Selective Colleges and Foreign Language Requirements

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What would she replace it with? If she is headed to engineering and can replace FL with another math class, that might be all right.

My kids both did three years in HS but since they did language in MS too that took them through level 5. They opted not to do the AP class senior year and replaced it with an extra math class for DS who is now in an applied math major, and an extra science class for DD who is planning to major in biology/environmental science

I think taking it at least through junior year is the bare minimum if you want to be competitive for selective schools.

[Anonymous]

Does her high school offer Latin? If so I would have her consider that. It builds grammar, vocab, and contextual translation which is helpful for multiple subjects and it’s not spoken so might alleviate her concern for other languages?

[Anonymous]

This is so stressful. My &th grader is in Spanish 2 and hates it. (This is weird for me as I did double languages in HS because I loved them and really love Spanish in particular.). The idea that he has to take 3 more years is so painful. I wish they had more language choices in HS. Changing to French or German seems pointless.
Has anyones kid done a foreign language through Montgomery college or through an online school instead?

[Anonymous]

Colleges want to see 2+ years of languages taken IN HIGH SCHOOL. You wouldn’t believe the number of abusive parents who force their 11-year-old to take a language in 6th grade because they unwisely believe that will somehow give them a leg-up on college admissions. Hint: it won’t. Unless your middle schooler has the maturity and the work ethic of a 9th grader, there is NO REASON to take a language in middle school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Colleges want to see 2+ years of languages taken IN HIGH SCHOOL. You wouldn’t believe the number of abusive parents who force their 11-year-old to take a language in 6th grade because they unwisely believe that will somehow give them a leg-up on college admissions. Hint: it won’t. Unless your middle schooler has the maturity and the work ethic of a 9th grader, there is NO REASON to take a language in middle school.

Abusive, really? We picked a FL in 6th because my son wasn't that interested in the "rotations" offered as one of the electives. Granted, it is his hardest class, but we'll see what he'll do as he progresses, there are still a number of options available (retaking a level, starting a new language etc.) I'd like him to take the FL AP anyway (if he continues with the current FL), so if he does that sophomore year, I don't see a school that he'd be interested in (that's not an Ivy, cause we're not paying for that anyway) not accept him because he doesn't have a language his junior year, given that he's mostly into STEM and will probably take a bunch of AP level classes in HS. If he decides he loves it and wants to major in humanities or languages, then by all means, he should take them up to and including his senior year!

Also, if you start a FL earlier, you have some learning advantages, you can get to a higher level etc. It's not all disadvantages just because the classes are hard (that being said, come on MCPS, give the kids textbooks!)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I could be mistaken, but doesn't MCPS require at least two years of foreign language in high school? FWIW, my current college freshman was advised by his counselor to take at least 3 years of language in high school because most colleges want to see at least that much even though MCPS only requires 2 years.

OP, I feel your pain. My younger DC loathes foreign language, so I know I will be facing a similar situation too. Good luck!

Nope. My eighth grader has already completed his MCPS foreign language graduation requirement.

[Anonymous]

Colleges can look past not having language classes on high school if there is a reason for it. For example a three or four year program completer like PLTW, Magruder Aviation, etc. that creates a giant block in a schedule and limits course selections. They are looking for a commitment more than anything else. Liberal arts colleges might be more demanding though since students would likely have to take language courses in college there as well.

[Anonymous]

I always thought 2 years of foreign language was required but I am looking at my kid’s high school course paperwork and it said 2 Language OR advance technology OR career development.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Colleges want to see 2+ years of languages taken IN HIGH SCHOOL. You wouldn’t believe the number of abusive parents who force their 11-year-old to take a language in 6th grade because they unwisely believe that will somehow give them a leg-up on college admissions. Hint: it won’t. Unless your middle schooler has the maturity and the work ethic of a 9th grader, there is NO REASON to take a language in middle school.

It's not abusive and the younger they start the easier it is as it's a lot of memorization.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I always thought 2 years of foreign language was required but I am looking at my kid’s high school course paperwork and it said 2 Language OR advance technology OR career development.

That's right. No need to take FL at all to graduate. If your DC is aiming for MD state colleges, no need to take any FLs. Lots of out of state colleges do not require FL at all.

[Anonymous]

I review undergrad apps at my university. I do not take applicants seriously that don't show a sincere enthusiasm for a foreign language. It doesn't disqualify you, but I'd much rather admit a student who has excelled in a foreign language than one who merely checked off a box

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I review undergrad apps at my university. I do not take applicants seriously that don't show a sincere enthusiasm for a foreign language. It doesn't disqualify you, but I'd much rather admit a student who has excelled in a foreign language than one who merely checked off a box

What’s your take on students taking ASL?

[Anonymous]

OP, try to focus on this re: foreign language and college: it's not just about getting in, it's also about getting out.

HS competence shows the university that the student is likely to fulfill the FL college requirements. Now, if the student's major doesn't require FL, that's a huge advantage for your daughter's chances and likely success at that university.

Start looking up The Common Data Set of a few colleges. Look at majors, what's required. To get a sense. Look at other areas of the country. FL emphasis varies. A major within a College of Arts & Sciences, for example, most assuredly is going to have a FL requirement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I review undergrad apps at my university. I do not take applicants seriously that don't show a sincere enthusiasm for a foreign language. It doesn't disqualify you, but I'd much rather admit a student who has excelled in a foreign language than one who merely checked off a box

This seems like an odd take. Isn't the important thing to identify candidates that have sincere enthusiasm for any one of a myriad of subjects? Why must they have sincere enthusiasm for a foreign language for you to find them interesting? How about a student who is passionate about philosophy or physics or ancient history? Are they less interesting to you than one who possesses a sincere enthusiasm for a foreign language?

I speak as a parent of a kid with genuine profound curiosity across several subjects, including math, philosophy, political science, and physics. Yet for some reason he finds the study of foreign language pretty dull. Still, he took 4 years of it, concluding in 10th grade. And he excelled in it. So I find your comment that you prefer a student who "excelled" in foreign language vs one who "merely checked off a box" interesting. It wasn't one vs the other for him. He did excel, but he absolutely checked a box because there's a multitude of other subjects he would rather pursue (and does now). And that didn't impede his college admissions in the least. He was admitted to several highly selective colleges. While I'll never know why they chose him, I presume his deep intellectual curiosity was a key reason, rather than an arbitrary belief that intellectual curiosity must be in a foreign language to be deemed a qualified candidate.

I should be clear that I'm an advocate for the study of foreign languages. My point is only that we are all wired differently and I think it would be an odd requirement that individuals must have a "sincere enthusiasm" for a foreign language to be admissable. That's quite different than a solid exposure and some mastery of a foreign language, which strikes me as a more logical requirement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I review undergrad apps at my university. I do not take applicants seriously that don't show a sincere enthusiasm for a foreign language. It doesn't disqualify you, but I'd much rather admit a student who has excelled in a foreign language than one who merely checked off a box

This seems like an odd take. Isn't the important thing to identify candidates that have sincere enthusiasm for any one of a myriad of subjects? Why must they have sincere enthusiasm for a foreign language for you to find them interesting? How about a student who is passionate about philosophy or physics or ancient history? Are they less interesting to you than one who possesses a sincere enthusiasm for a foreign language?

I speak as a parent of a kid with genuine profound curiosity across several subjects, including math, philosophy, political science, and physics. Yet for some reason he finds the study of foreign language pretty dull. Still, he took 4 years of it, concluding in 10th grade. And he excelled in it. So I find your comment that you prefer a student who "excelled" in foreign language vs one who "merely checked off a box" interesting. It wasn't one vs the other for him. He did excel, but he absolutely checked a box because there's a multitude of other subjects he would rather pursue (and does now). And that didn't impede his college admissions in the least. He was admitted to several highly selective colleges. While I'll never know why they chose him, I presume his deep intellectual curiosity was a key reason, rather than an arbitrary belief that intellectual curiosity must be in a foreign language to be deemed a qualified candidate.

I should be clear that I'm an advocate for the study of foreign languages. My point is only that we are all wired differently and I think it would be an odd requirement that individuals must have a "sincere enthusiasm" for a foreign language to be admissable. That's quite different than a solid exposure and some mastery of a foreign language, which strikes me as a more logical requirement.

Also, how is taking levels 1-4 in 6th-9th or 7th-10th "checking a box" but taking the exact same levels in 9th-12th excelling? Since my son is starting in 6th, I'll probably make him take 5 years, just in case, but if I was doing interviews for a "selective college" and they had this kind of rule in place, I'd try to lobby against it or at least advocate for good candidates regardless or when they finish level 4 or whatever. Because it's a stupid rule (if it's even an actual rule.)