WSJ article on your child's chances of getting into an IVY are slim

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“The record 11.8 percent admission rate for Harvard's class of 1999 is significantly lower than rates at other Ivy League schools, ...“

Has it ever been easy?

It’s never been easy for your typical kid. It’s always been significantly easier for connected kids.

I went to a NE boarding school. They told us that before about the 1990s, kids essentially signed up for HYP like you would an intramural softball team. It isn’t like that anymore, but my high school sends roughly 25% of its graduates each year to an Ivy League school. The process remains deeply unfair.

Is this typical of the higher end NE boarding schools? Do their students get preferred admissions? Looking at this now for my kid who is interested in going starting in 2023 to play a sport (he's been talking to the coach), so if we're going to consider that school, we'll likely consider others as well. Just curious because DH and I are public school graduates so this is all new.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see these kinds of kids getting bounced, and then OTOH I see a lot of top 20 colleges (including my own alma mater) offering pre-calculus classes for incoming students to complete the calculus sequence in 3 or 4 semesters. I’ve come down to just convincing my own kids to not even shoot for a top 20 university. Just get the best grades you can, prep for the SAT/ACT a reasonable amount, and do ECs they actually enjoy without worrying about cultivating a compelling personal narrative. The chips will fall where they will. Life is too short, and where you go to college is not that important to the outcome of ones life.

Harvard has offered precalc for math years.

I know. Lot of people when I was in college came from HS that capped out at Pre-Calc (or they didn’t test out of it). Mine included. So I was on the 3 semester track, while most who went to college prep HS were on the 2 semester track. Just out of curiosity, I was looking at their courses last night, and they have now expanded it to a 4 semester track, with what used to be the 2 semester sequence being spread out over 3 now. So these colleges are apparently admitting some significant number of applicants who aren’t calculus ready, but then it is ever harder for advanced students to get in. It’s the unpredictability and randomness that I think fuels the disillusionment. I’m not saying its wrong or right, it’s just hard to see the rationale behind it all, if there even is one. Admissions seem to be a bigger black box than ever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“The record 11.8 percent admission rate for Harvard's class of 1999 is significantly lower than rates at other Ivy League schools, ...“

Has it ever been easy?

It’s never been easy for your typical kid. It’s always been significantly easier for connected kids.

I went to a NE boarding school. They told us that before about the 1990s, kids essentially signed up for HYP like you would an intramural softball team. It isn’t like that anymore, but my high school sends roughly 25% of its graduates each year to an Ivy League school. The process remains deeply unfair.

Doesn't this just show that the schools are not "all that" in the first place? It just a prestige thing, with no real value other than that. They aren't actually "better," and obviously there are thousands of brilliant students who attend other colleges.

[Anonymous]

I say lets the spawn and URM and 3.5GPA athletes have the "elites". Ivys are sort of sick in the head. The data shows that you have to be in one of those categories to get in, yet they aggressively outreached my kid and others that they had zero intention of admitting (My kids stats are higher than this girl in the article by a small margin). They dont increase their class size and they just roll in the application fees so by rejecting us all they can seem even cooler. Fool me once...but you won't fool me again. I've made a pledge that I will never hire another ivy grad and I wont let my other kids apply. Ivy League is Fake News.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“The record 11.8 percent admission rate for Harvard's class of 1999 is significantly lower than rates at other Ivy League schools, ...“

Has it ever been easy?

It’s never been easy for your typical kid. It’s always been significantly easier for connected kids.

I went to a NE boarding school. They told us that before about the 1990s, kids essentially signed up for HYP like you would an intramural softball team. It isn’t like that anymore, but my high school sends roughly 25% of its graduates each year to an Ivy League school. The process remains deeply unfair.

Doesn't this just show that the schools are not "all that" in the first place? It just a prestige thing, with no real value other than that. They aren't actually "better," and obviously there are thousands of brilliant students who attend other colleges.

NP. I agree with what you’re saying completely, but management consulting and I-banking hiring still favor kids from top schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I say lets the spawn and URM and 3.5GPA athletes have the "elites". Ivys are sort of sick in the head. The data shows that you have to be in one of those categories to get in, yet they aggressively outreached my kid and others that they had zero intention of admitting (My kids stats are higher than this girl in the article by a small margin). They dont increase their class size and they just roll in the application fees so by rejecting us all they can seem even cooler. Fool me once...but you won't fool me again. I've made a pledge that I will never hire another ivy grad and I wont let my other kids apply. Ivy League is Fake News.

MAGA?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“The record 11.8 percent admission rate for Harvard's class of 1999 is significantly lower than rates at other Ivy League schools, ...“

Has it ever been easy?

It’s never been easy for your typical kid. It’s always been significantly easier for connected kids.

I went to a NE boarding school. They told us that before about the 1990s, kids essentially signed up for HYP like you would an intramural softball team. It isn’t like that anymore, but my high school sends roughly 25% of its graduates each year to an Ivy League school. The process remains deeply unfair.

Doesn't this just show that the schools are not "all that" in the first place? It just a prestige thing, with no real value other than that. They aren't actually "better," and obviously there are thousands of brilliant students who attend other colleges.

There is "value" but not necessarily academics.

[Anonymous]

No, not MAGA. Shortcut for saying Ivy League is not the pinnacle of Academic Excellence and American Royalty but rather a cult/club that enrolls many average (comparably below-average) students that fit their agenda or their donation schedule. They misrepresent themselves and most of America buys into it, until you take a closer look at who they are admitting and their actual deceptive practices. Fake News.

[Anonymous]

I will say it - I think schools didn’t admit her bc her essays were about her mental health struggles over getting Bs during Covid.

I wish the system wasn’t this way - we talk a good game on mental health - but I think societal actions prove another thing.

I also think business is an incredibly oversubscribed major.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No, not MAGA. Shortcut for saying Ivy League is not the pinnacle of Academic Excellence and American Royalty but rather a cult/club that enrolls many average (comparably below-average) students that fit their agenda or their donation schedule. They misrepresent themselves and most of America buys into it, until you take a closer look at who they are admitting and their actual deceptive practices. Fake News.

If you don’t like their “agenda,” don’t apply. I’m assuming your child is a UMC white male.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not the whole article, but here is the lede:

“ Kaitlyn Younger has been an academic standout since she started studying algebra in third grade.

She took her first advanced-placement course as a freshman, scored 1550 on her SATs as a junior at McKinney High School near Dallas and will graduate this spring with an unweighted 3.95 grade-point average and as the founder of the school’s accounting club. Along the way she performed in and directed about 30 plays, sang in the school choir, scored top marks on the tests she has so far taken for 11 advanced-placement classes, helped run a summer camp and held down a part-time job.

“She is extraordinary,” said Jeff Cranmore, her guidance counselor at McKinney High School.

Ms. Younger, 18 years old, was cautiously optimistic when she applied to top U.S. colleges last fall. Responses came this month: Stanford, Harvard, Yale, Brown, Cornell, University of Pennsylvania, University of Southern California, University of California, Berkeley, and Northwestern all rejected her.

“I expected a bunch wouldn’t accept me,” she said. “I didn’t expect it to be this bad.””

It says she’s going to Arizona State.

It seems she would be an automatic admit to UT Austin. Unless with all that she's not a top ranked student in her HS, which would mean all those decisions are not that surprising.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not the whole article, but here is the lede:

“ Kaitlyn Younger has been an academic standout since she started studying algebra in third grade.

She took her first advanced-placement course as a freshman, scored 1550 on her SATs as a junior at McKinney High School near Dallas and will graduate this spring with an unweighted 3.95 grade-point average and as the founder of the school’s accounting club. Along the way she performed in and directed about 30 plays, sang in the school choir, scored top marks on the tests she has so far taken for 11 advanced-placement classes, helped run a summer camp and held down a part-time job.

“She is extraordinary,” said Jeff Cranmore, her guidance counselor at McKinney High School.

Ms. Younger, 18 years old, was cautiously optimistic when she applied to top U.S. colleges last fall. Responses came this month: Stanford, Harvard, Yale, Brown, Cornell, University of Pennsylvania, University of Southern California, University of California, Berkeley, and Northwestern all rejected her.

“I expected a bunch wouldn’t accept me,” she said. “I didn’t expect it to be this bad.””

It says she’s going to Arizona State.

It seems she would be an automatic admit to UT Austin. Unless with all that she's not a top ranked student in her HS, which would mean all those decisions are not that surprising.

With those stats she likely got significant merit aid at ASU

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not the whole article, but here is the lede:

“ Kaitlyn Younger has been an academic standout since she started studying algebra in third grade.

She took her first advanced-placement course as a freshman, scored 1550 on her SATs as a junior at McKinney High School near Dallas and will graduate this spring with an unweighted 3.95 grade-point average and as the founder of the school’s accounting club. Along the way she performed in and directed about 30 plays, sang in the school choir, scored top marks on the tests she has so far taken for 11 advanced-placement classes, helped run a summer camp and held down a part-time job.

“She is extraordinary,” said Jeff Cranmore, her guidance counselor at McKinney High School.

Ms. Younger, 18 years old, was cautiously optimistic when she applied to top U.S. colleges last fall. Responses came this month: Stanford, Harvard, Yale, Brown, Cornell, University of Pennsylvania, University of Southern California, University of California, Berkeley, and Northwestern all rejected her.

“I expected a bunch wouldn’t accept me,” she said. “I didn’t expect it to be this bad.””

It says she’s going to Arizona State.

It seems she would be an automatic admit to UT Austin. Unless with all that she's not a top ranked student in her HS, which would mean all those decisions are not that surprising.

With those stats she likely got significant merit aid at ASU

Right. I assume she's getting a free ride at ASU, which is frankly a smart choice anyhow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not the whole article, but here is the lede:

“ Kaitlyn Younger has been an academic standout since she started studying algebra in third grade.

She took her first advanced-placement course as a freshman, scored 1550 on her SATs as a junior at McKinney High School near Dallas and will graduate this spring with an unweighted 3.95 grade-point average and as the founder of the school’s accounting club. Along the way she performed in and directed about 30 plays, sang in the school choir, scored top marks on the tests she has so far taken for 11 advanced-placement classes, helped run a summer camp and held down a part-time job.

“She is extraordinary,” said Jeff Cranmore, her guidance counselor at McKinney High School.

Ms. Younger, 18 years old, was cautiously optimistic when she applied to top U.S. colleges last fall. Responses came this month: Stanford, Harvard, Yale, Brown, Cornell, University of Pennsylvania, University of Southern California, University of California, Berkeley, and Northwestern all rejected her.

“I expected a bunch wouldn’t accept me,” she said. “I didn’t expect it to be this bad.””

It says she’s going to Arizona State.

She’s fantastic but the thing is, lots of kids are just like this. In NoVa, the top 20% of the class is similar. My kid was similar and took a full scholarship at a school DCUM makes fun of. Because as a UMC white kid, there was just no hook. Too “privileged” for an assist, too middle class to have connections or invest a ton of money into becoming a recruitable athlete.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“The record 11.8 percent admission rate for Harvard's class of 1999 is significantly lower than rates at other Ivy League schools, ...“

Has it ever been easy?

It’s never been easy for your typical kid. It’s always been significantly easier for connected kids.

I went to a NE boarding school. They told us that before about the 1990s, kids essentially signed up for HYP like you would an intramural softball team. It isn’t like that anymore, but my high school sends roughly 25% of its graduates each year to an Ivy League school. The process remains deeply unfair.

Doesn't this just show that the schools are not "all that" in the first place? It just a prestige thing, with no real value other than that. They aren't actually "better," and obviously there are thousands of brilliant students who attend other colleges.

I don’t agree. Of course, there are legacies and other connected kids, but the very top prep schools are absolutely wonderful for very motivated kids.

Take a look at Andover’s Course of Study, for example, and tell me how it compares to other schools: https://issuu.com/phillipsacademy/docs/cos2021-2022?e=1320520/85034501