APS band in elementary

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For schools that require it do they provide instruments for all students. We are renting but I can see where folks might not have that option financially

At our school the provided them for students who qualified for free/reduced meals and others if available. I’m renting for $45/month. If it wasn’t mandatory we wouldn’t be doing it because my kid doesn’t enjoy it.

I'm so glad its optional at our school. I did band for 2 years, chose to, and hated it- I was terrible and never really picked up reading music. If my kids want to try it then that's great but I want them to have the ability to opt out as well.

And I did band starting in 4th grade, played through HS and college and loved it. Lifelong friends.

People need to read up on schools that require it - i.e. ATS who requires it and this is a choice/optional school. There's a lot of benefits to music and the performing arts. They don't make you take it because they think you'll become some virtuoso (although that would be nice) but because it has other benefits in life. Cultural, concentration, working as a team, mathematical, etc.

Switch out opting out of band with opting out of PE. The two have similar benefits.

If it’s so beneficial wouldn’t all school make it mandatory? I won’t argue that learning about instrument isn’t valuable, I know it is. Forcing it at an early age will turn some kids off of it for life. There are a lot of coordination skills that are needed to play an instrument and not all kids have them developed enough at 9. Some kids don’t enjoy music or have sensory issues. Our home school and the option school we got in to both require it so we’re doing it but it’s not enjoyable and I doubt my child will play a single note after 5th grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For schools that require it do they provide instruments for all students. We are renting but I can see where folks might not have that option financially

At our school the provided them for students who qualified for free/reduced meals and others if available. I’m renting for $45/month. If it wasn’t mandatory we wouldn’t be doing it because my kid doesn’t enjoy it.

I'm so glad its optional at our school. I did band for 2 years, chose to, and hated it- I was terrible and never really picked up reading music. If my kids want to try it then that's great but I want them to have the ability to opt out as well.

And I did band starting in 4th grade, played through HS and college and loved it. Lifelong friends.

People need to read up on schools that require it - i.e. ATS who requires it and this is a choice/optional school. There's a lot of benefits to music and the performing arts. They don't make you take it because they think you'll become some virtuoso (although that would be nice) but because it has other benefits in life. Cultural, concentration, working as a team, mathematical, etc.

Switch out opting out of band with opting out of PE. The two have similar benefits.

Wait, you think the benefits of regular physical activity are the same as playing a musical instrument?? Yea, ok!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For schools that require it do they provide instruments for all students. We are renting but I can see where folks might not have that option financially

At our school the provided them for students who qualified for free/reduced meals and others if available. I’m renting for $45/month. If it wasn’t mandatory we wouldn’t be doing it because my kid doesn’t enjoy it.

I'm so glad its optional at our school. I did band for 2 years, chose to, and hated it- I was terrible and never really picked up reading music. If my kids want to try it then that's great but I want them to have the ability to opt out as well.

And I did band starting in 4th grade, played through HS and college and loved it. Lifelong friends.

People need to read up on schools that require it - i.e. ATS who requires it and this is a choice/optional school. There's a lot of benefits to music and the performing arts. They don't make you take it because they think you'll become some virtuoso (although that would be nice) but because it has other benefits in life. Cultural, concentration, working as a team, mathematical, etc.

Switch out opting out of band with opting out of PE. The two have similar benefits.

Wait, you think the benefits of regular physical activity are the same as playing a musical instrument?? Yea, ok!

You don't read so well. Were you always this remedial?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Switch out opting out of band with opting out of PE. The two have similar benefits.

Oh, please. There may be side benefits to band/orchestra, but the actual benefit of playing an instrument is minimal. Lots of kids who play in ES (or even beyond) stop playing and never pick up an instrument again. But they ought to exercise.

And those side benefits to playing an instrument are all obtainable in other ways.

I don't care that ATS requires it because ATS is avoidable. But when people declare that all schools should be like ATS, I cringe, because when my kids were in elementary, I didn't care if they joined band or tucked in their shirts, and I am sure as heck would not have made them do homework every night. Nor would I have cared if they weren't reading by the end of K.

[Anonymous]

I love how dcum can turn a post about elementary school band into an argument

[Anonymous]

I really don't understand all these posts about kids not enjoying band so they shouldn't have to do it. One of the points of school is to expose kids to things they wouldn't otherwise learn or experience.

Playing an instrument is hard at first. It takes coordination. You have to read music. You need to learn rhythm and pay attention. For many kids you have to get over that learning curve before it can be fun. It gets to be more fun once you have some competency and skills, but that takes a bit of perseverance, which is a great skill to have.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Switch out opting out of band with opting out of PE. The two have similar benefits.

Oh, please. There may be side benefits to band/orchestra, but the actual benefit of playing an instrument is minimal. Lots of kids who play in ES (or even beyond) stop playing and never pick up an instrument again. But they ought to exercise.

And those side benefits to playing an instrument are all obtainable in other ways.

I don't care that ATS requires it because ATS is avoidable. But when people declare that all schools should be like ATS, I cringe, because when my kids were in elementary, I didn't care if they joined band or tucked in their shirts, and I am sure as heck would not have made them do homework every night. Nor would I have cared if they weren't reading by the end of K.

huh? when and who? why even bother with a cringe? you know it'll never happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I really don't understand all these posts about kids not enjoying band so they shouldn't have to do it. One of the points of school is to expose kids to things they wouldn't otherwise learn or experience.

Playing an instrument is hard at first. It takes coordination. You have to read music. You need to learn rhythm and pay attention. For many kids you have to get over that learning curve before it can be fun. It gets to be more fun once you have some competency and skills, but that takes a bit of perseverance, which is a great skill to have.

1. It costs many people money
2. It’s noisy in a county where many kids live in apartments/condos this is an issue
3. It’s not mandatory across the county so some kids are forced into it while others aren’t.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For schools that require it do they provide instruments for all students. We are renting but I can see where folks might not have that option financially

At our school the provided them for students who qualified for free/reduced meals and others if available. I’m renting for $45/month. If it wasn’t mandatory we wouldn’t be doing it because my kid doesn’t enjoy it.

I'm so glad its optional at our school. I did band for 2 years, chose to, and hated it- I was terrible and never really picked up reading music. If my kids want to try it then that's great but I want them to have the ability to opt out as well.

And I did band starting in 4th grade, played through HS and college and loved it. Lifelong friends.

People need to read up on schools that require it - i.e. ATS who requires it and this is a choice/optional school. There's a lot of benefits to music and the performing arts. They don't make you take it because they think you'll become some virtuoso (although that would be nice) but because it has other benefits in life. Cultural, concentration, working as a team, mathematical, etc.

Switch out opting out of band with opting out of PE. The two have similar benefits.

Wait, you think the benefits of regular physical activity are the same as playing a musical instrument?? Yea, ok!

You don't read so well. Were you always this remedial?

See bolded. Unless you are saying kids should be able opt out of PE like they can opt out of band. And still- not the same benefit- playing a musical instrument is nice but building a foundation of lifetime physical activity is slightly more important for many reasons. For starters, playing an instrument is not going to lower my chance of heart disease, type 2 diabetes and obesity. I'm not anti-music- if my kids want to play an instrument, I will support them and if they want to quit, I will support them. However, I will always encourage them to get exercise and be active regardless of if they love sports or PE.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For schools that require it do they provide instruments for all students. We are renting but I can see where folks might not have that option financially

At our school the provided them for students who qualified for free/reduced meals and others if available. I’m renting for $45/month. If it wasn’t mandatory we wouldn’t be doing it because my kid doesn’t enjoy it.

I'm so glad its optional at our school. I did band for 2 years, chose to, and hated it- I was terrible and never really picked up reading music. If my kids want to try it then that's great but I want them to have the ability to opt out as well.

And I did band starting in 4th grade, played through HS and college and loved it. Lifelong friends.

People need to read up on schools that require it - i.e. ATS who requires it and this is a choice/optional school. There's a lot of benefits to music and the performing arts. They don't make you take it because they think you'll become some virtuoso (although that would be nice) but because it has other benefits in life. Cultural, concentration, working as a team, mathematical, etc.

Switch out opting out of band with opting out of PE. The two have similar benefits.

NP. Learning a second language while young is beneficial too, but not all APS schools are immersion schools. Lots of things have benefits but aren’t required (or even available) at every school.
If it’s so beneficial wouldn’t all school make it mandatory? I won’t argue that learning about instrument isn’t valuable, I know it is. Forcing it at an early age will turn some kids off of it for life. There are a lot of coordination skills that are needed to play an instrument and not all kids have them developed enough at 9. Some kids don’t enjoy music or have sensory issues. Our home school and the option school we got in to both require it so we’re doing it but it’s not enjoyable and I doubt my child will play a single note after 5th grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really don't understand all these posts about kids not enjoying band so they shouldn't have to do it. One of the points of school is to expose kids to things they wouldn't otherwise learn or experience.

Playing an instrument is hard at first. It takes coordination. You have to read music. You need to learn rhythm and pay attention. For many kids you have to get over that learning curve before it can be fun. It gets to be more fun once you have some competency and skills, but that takes a bit of perseverance, which is a great skill to have.

1. It costs many people money
2. It’s noisy in a county where many kids live in apartments/condos this is an issue
3. It’s not mandatory across the county so some kids are forced into it while others aren’t.

All of this. Many kids do not live in a home where they can have dedicated quiet for practice or homework.
Learning an instrument is a hobby, its really a gift to kids that enjoy music because it can lead to lifelong love of music. But some kids are not musically inclined AT ALL. Forcing them to play an instrument when they have absolutely no interest is just painful for everyone involved -- they will hate it, the other kids learning the same instrument will not be able to advance as quickly, and parents will have to shell out money and energy on something that their kid does not enjoy. Its not like reading or eating your vegetables where even if you don't enjoy it, you have to do it to be a healthy, productive member of society.
APS makes kids learn the recorder for 3rd, 4th, and 5th grade as part of the standard music curriculum. That's enough if you don't have enough interest to play a real instrument.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really don't understand all these posts about kids not enjoying band so they shouldn't have to do it. One of the points of school is to expose kids to things they wouldn't otherwise learn or experience.

Playing an instrument is hard at first. It takes coordination. You have to read music. You need to learn rhythm and pay attention. For many kids you have to get over that learning curve before it can be fun. It gets to be more fun once you have some competency and skills, but that takes a bit of perseverance, which is a great skill to have.

1. It costs many people money
2. It’s noisy in a county where many kids live in apartments/condos this is an issue
3. It’s not mandatory across the county so some kids are forced into it while others aren’t.

All of this. Many kids do not live in a home where they can have dedicated quiet for practice or homework.
Learning an instrument is a hobby, its really a gift to kids that enjoy music because it can lead to lifelong love of music. But some kids are not musically inclined AT ALL. Forcing them to play an instrument when they have absolutely no interest is just painful for everyone involved -- they will hate it, the other kids learning the same instrument will not be able to advance as quickly, and parents will have to shell out money and energy on something that their kid does not enjoy. Its not like reading or eating your vegetables where even if you don't enjoy it, you have to do it to be a healthy, productive member of society.
APS makes kids learn the recorder for 3rd, 4th, and 5th grade as part of the standard music curriculum. That's enough if you don't have enough interest to play a real instrument.

Like anything, you don't really know if a kid will take to music until they give it an honest try. There's no requirement for them to become Mozart. Playing for a few years as a tween as part of a school activity isnt asking that much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really don't understand all these posts about kids not enjoying band so they shouldn't have to do it. One of the points of school is to expose kids to things they wouldn't otherwise learn or experience.

Playing an instrument is hard at first. It takes coordination. You have to read music. You need to learn rhythm and pay attention. For many kids you have to get over that learning curve before it can be fun. It gets to be more fun once you have some competency and skills, but that takes a bit of perseverance, which is a great skill to have.

1. It costs many people money
2. It’s noisy in a county where many kids live in apartments/condos this is an issue
3. It’s not mandatory across the county so some kids are forced into it while others aren’t.

All of this. Many kids do not live in a home where they can have dedicated quiet for practice or homework.
Learning an instrument is a hobby, its really a gift to kids that enjoy music because it can lead to lifelong love of music. But some kids are not musically inclined AT ALL. Forcing them to play an instrument when they have absolutely no interest is just painful for everyone involved -- they will hate it, the other kids learning the same instrument will not be able to advance as quickly, and parents will have to shell out money and energy on something that their kid does not enjoy. Its not like reading or eating your vegetables where even if you don't enjoy it, you have to do it to be a healthy, productive member of society.
APS makes kids learn the recorder for 3rd, 4th, and 5th grade as part of the standard music curriculum. That's enough if you don't have enough interest to play a real instrument.

Like anything, you don't really know if a kid will take to music until they give it an honest try. There's no requirement for them to become Mozart. Playing for a few years as a tween as part of a school activity isnt asking that much.

So what's wrong with the "honest try" being the recorder sections that they have in their regular music class -- they are playing an instrument that is really cheap but are getting most of the benefits (learning to read music, rhythm, perseverance, discipline for practicing, etc). My eldest was really good at the recorder by the end of the fifth grade. Then any interested kids have the option to play in band/orchestra middle school, where its an elective and is much more serious/productive because its an actual graded class (which will motivate most kids to practice if they need to).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really don't understand all these posts about kids not enjoying band so they shouldn't have to do it. One of the points of school is to expose kids to things they wouldn't otherwise learn or experience.

Playing an instrument is hard at first. It takes coordination. You have to read music. You need to learn rhythm and pay attention. For many kids you have to get over that learning curve before it can be fun. It gets to be more fun once you have some competency and skills, but that takes a bit of perseverance, which is a great skill to have.

1. It costs many people money
2. It’s noisy in a county where many kids live in apartments/condos this is an issue
3. It’s not mandatory across the county so some kids are forced into it while others aren’t.

All of this. Many kids do not live in a home where they can have dedicated quiet for practice or homework.
Learning an instrument is a hobby, its really a gift to kids that enjoy music because it can lead to lifelong love of music. But some kids are not musically inclined AT ALL. Forcing them to play an instrument when they have absolutely no interest is just painful for everyone involved -- they will hate it, the other kids learning the same instrument will not be able to advance as quickly, and parents will have to shell out money and energy on something that their kid does not enjoy. Its not like reading or eating your vegetables where even if you don't enjoy it, you have to do it to be a healthy, productive member of society.
APS makes kids learn the recorder for 3rd, 4th, and 5th grade as part of the standard music curriculum. That's enough if you don't have enough interest to play a real instrument.

Like anything, you don't really know if a kid will take to music until they give it an honest try. There's no requirement for them to become Mozart. Playing for a few years as a tween as part of a school activity isnt asking that much.

So what's wrong with the "honest try" being the recorder sections that they have in their regular music class -- they are playing an instrument that is really cheap but are getting most of the benefits (learning to read music, rhythm, perseverance, discipline for practicing, etc). My eldest was really good at the recorder by the end of the fifth grade. Then any interested kids have the option to play in band/orchestra middle school, where its an elective and is much more serious/productive because its an actual graded class (which will motivate most kids to practice if they need to).

It's like asking whether a kid can decide if they have a passion for soccer by playing foosball.

[Anonymous]

It's like asking whether a kid can decide if they have a passion for soccer by playing foosball.

Yes, the recorder is not a robust an instrument, but it is a pretty good introduction to see if you would enjoy playing an instrument, especially if you would enjoy playing a wind instrument. It requires coordination, fine motor skills that are comparable to playing a "real instrument", and the ability to read sheet music. In foosball you don't actually run around or kick a ball, you only use your hands, so that's not an accurate analogy.
I don't know how old your kids are, but you may also really be reading in to how "good" the APS band offering is. My current sixth grader only got to page 10 (out of a 40 page book) in elementary school. Sure COVID had something to do with that, but my current fourth grader is still on page 1 of his music book. That's just putting his instrument together and playing a single note. Both of my older kids were really really bored in elementary band, they can't move forward until all of the kids have mastered what was assigned. So they end up practicing the same two line song for 2+ months. They move much faster in middle school and high school, because its a class and the kids in it take it more seriously. Making everyone take an instrument would be really tough for kids that are really interested in learning to play, the progress would be even slower.