Screaming Principal

[Anonymous]

Is it normal for a principal to scream regularly?

My children attend Lakewood Elementary in Rockville, where the test scores are high, school is clean, children are well behaved, parent participation is high, all those good things. There is a relatively new principal and AP - last year was the first year. She spent a large percentage of her time telling the children in the lunchroom they were not good kids and did not behave properly because they talked too much. She arranged for all the first graders to have "assigned" seating such that they were not allowed to sit next to their friends (assigned by the teachers).

She threatened to deny the children recess as punishment. She didn't just randomly make these announcements, but screamed at the kids. When parents questioned her about her behavior, she denied yelling and said the children exaggerate. (parents heard her screaming regularly)

Well, this year, before spring break, the 5th graders were learning about the Constitution, the Boston Tea Party, protests, government and so on.
The fifth graders heard a very loud popping noise which startled them during lunch, so about a dozen children stood up and ran to the area where the noise was to investigate. They discovered a lunch table a cracked in half. Immediately the children were sent to the front of the room for getting out of their seats to investigate the loud popping noise. Seconds later the entire fifth grade was sent to the front of the room (over 80 children is my guess) for punishment. They then lost half their recess because those dozen or so children dared get out of their seats to find out what that loud noise was. (If there was a fire, would they be punished for running out and leaving their seats too?)

Several children thought this was not a fair policy, to punish the entire fifth grade for a few children getting out of their seats, so they spoke with the Assistant Principal about the issue and he suggested they put in writing their concerns. The 7 children who raised the issue spent an afternoon at home together and drafted a polite letter asking for reconsideration of the punishment to the entire 5th grade student body and thanked the AP for taking the time to consider their request.

Turns out, other fifth graders also signed the letter, with some not very nice comments - rude even.

The children also decided to stage a protest, and about 20 or so children sat on the side of the hill chanting "Mrs. X is unfair, fire Mrs. X", Mrs. X being the lunchroom aide who decided to punish the entire 5th grade student body. Keep in mind, Mrs X was one lone person managing the lunchroom filled with close to 200 children.

Anyway, the next day the principal called in 40 or so students who she believed signed the petition and SCREAMED at them for 35 minutes, with the school counselor by her side and the Assistant Principal on the other side of her, until she elicited tears and crying from the roomful of 10, 11 and maybe 12 year olds.
She got within inches of children's faces, screamed that she could expel them, "DO YOU WANT TO BE EXPELLED", " I COULD SUSPEND YOU", "What you are protesting about is
STUPID and is not even worth a PROTEST", " I AM TAKING AWAY YOUR ENTIRE RECESS, YES, THAT IS RIGHT, NO RECESS AT ALL, BECAUSE WHAT YOU DID WAS SO BAD YOU DON'T DESERVE RECESS"

So for 35 minutes she yelled at the children and when parents questioned her, she said the kids were bad and she didn't yell and scream and she would send a response to the community before Spring Break. Of course she ignored everyone and now she disappears and you just hardly see the woman at all. It is like she hides away afraid to see parents.

Is this normal behavior when schools have good test scores? Is it true that no one at the school board cares how a principal behaves when test scores are good?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is it normal for a principal to scream regularly?

No!

Anonymous wrote:Is it true that no one at the school board cares how a principal behaves when test scores are good?

No direct experience with MCPS, but I sure hope the superintendent and board of ed would care.

If the situation is as you describe, this behavior is abusive and I would encourage you to write a letter to the principal directly outlining your concerns and requesting a meeting with her. If she doesn't respond (sounds like she's in avoidance mode and won't) then write to the superintendent with your concerns. And document anything witnessed directly.

That said, is there any chance that the reports you've gotten through the grapevine are inaccurate? Could you request a meeting with the school counselor to express your concerns and hear his/her account of the meeting?

[Anonymous]

School counselor is inexperienced - first job out of school
When I questioned her about the meeting, she was extremely defensive.
She claimed there was no yelling.
When I explained that I heard from no less than 8 children and their parents, that was not the report I received, she backed down from her story and claimed there may have been some raised voices.
When I questioned her about the crying children, she stopped talking to me and told me she would not comment on the meeting and all she did was attend the meeting.
She absolutely refused to say any more and put her hands up, then said "You need to talk to the administration, I can't say anymore"
Most parents I find are just delighted their children are in fifth grade and leaving the school very very soon.
This is a very sad situation for the younger children k-2, as this principal spends such a large part of her day telling the younger children how "BAD" they are and how they don't listen and they can't behave and they are too loud etc.
It is very very sad.

[Anonymous]

This should be reported to county administrative officials who supervise her. If true, it is abusive and the principal should be fired or pulled to another position which doesn't permit contact with students until she is "retrained."

It is not your job to figure out if the allegations are true. You have heard an allegation from your child, supported by what you have heard from other parents and a counselor present.

You would be remiss if you did not report this abusive behavior to upper level officials.

No teacher or administrator should be telling elementary children that they are "bad." They may be breaking rules, opening themselves up to stated/logical consequences, etc., but they themselves are not "bad" kids.

[Anonymous]

Just wondering... was your child at all involved in the situation or are you getting all of this second hand? Everyone has their side of the story. If I were you I would request a meeting with the principal and voice your concerns in a calm and non-confrontational matter. I would make sure you are prepared with a response if the principal tells you that it involves other children and she is not allowed to discuss how she reprimanded them(which would be true). Make sure you put this into a context that does involve your child.

[Anonymous]

I am absolutely appalled by the prospect of a principal who screams at students and tells them they are bad. I do sincerely hope that this situation is resolved quickly.

I agree with 11:42--send a letter to the principal and CC people above her (district superintendent, superintendent, school board members, etc.). This just cannot go on without recourse.

[Anonymous]

What the....? Whether there is or is not actual yelling, clearly something is going on. Agree that it's important to document your concerns even if you can't "prove" anything. For all you know there is a history of this behavior but nobody has stood up before.

FWIW - DC has an Ombudsman's office where you can report pretty much anything on-line. They also publish results of investigations on-line. (Go figure.) If there's something similar in your area, probably won't hurt to check it out.

If it's bothering you enough to post it here, it's likely bothering other people as well. At best, the kids are making it all up and the future will be bright and rosy once they graduate.

Worst case - well, it shouldn't have to get worse should it.

Good luck. This sounds awful. What do the teachers say?

[Anonymous]

No - screaming at kids is the vice principal's job.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No - screaming at kids is the vice principal's job.

I do not mean to make light out of the situation but this post was cute. Are you an Assistant Principal poster? I am - I do not scream at children but I do feel that most of my time is spent disciplining children or putting out adult fires that involve children (teachers yelling at children or being disrespectful to parents)

[Anonymous]

I wish the OP would come back to update this thread. I've been wondering if anything has happened.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish the OP would come back to update this thread. I've been wondering if anything has happened.

I am also curious. Did anyone stop that abusive principal?

[Anonymous]

I would slap her.... seriously, it would take a lot to restrain me. Are the parents petioning the superintendent? If the PTA is involved why aren't there stepping in? I would not be passive about this or just pull my kid out. It will be easier for her supervisors to fire her with written complaints. Be specific with dates and direct language.

[Anonymous]

Someone should capture her rants with a cell phone...use the video feature....and then send it to the school board and YouTube.