Anonymous wrote:
If that wasn’t you, DO you follow all those rules in Leviticus? Because if you don’t, then again, “logic fail.”
P.S. Many Christians see Paul as writing pastoral letters to new communities. Many of them are beautiful, but Paul didn’t ask to be taken literally, so why are you taking him literally?
BBC1 here,
Next you will say, "Many Christians see Jesus as saying some really cool things, many of them beautiful, but Jesus was only speaking metaphorically, not literally, so why are you taking him literally like him saying 'Go and sin no more and crap like that?"
Now we are getting to the crux of the issue, "Hath God said?". Satan is trying to deceive Christians by saying, "Hath God really said homosexuality is a sin? The Old Testament is just that: old, not relevant anymore, and Jesus did not say anything about it. Those clownish apostles in the New Testament --pffft! You can't take seriously those old misogynist bigots whose opinions do not apply in our enlightened modern times, and we aren't in the stone age anymore so their stone age beliefs concerning homosexuality is absurd not to mention outdated."
What you are attempting with this line of reasoning (and not just you but many others in a multi-pronged demonic assault on the church), is to make the case, "If a Christian does not follow all the rules in Leviticus then a Christian cannot condemn homosexuality on a biblical basis, only out of personal bigotry; therefore the Christian church has no basis to condemn homosexuality except for personal bigotry which is illegal (in Sweden at the moment but coming soon to a nation near you)."
http://www.massresistance.org/docs/gen3/17d/MR-UK-Coming-Out-Video/index.html
Once it can be established by enough people that the church opposes homosexuality on bigoted, discriminatory grounds instead of the revealed word of God, it is game over. The soon-coming laws will entangle the church, 1st Amendment or not, and wicked judges will mete out the harshest penalties with satanic glee.
Those who do not seek righteousness but want to feel good without having to be holy will accept your line of reasoning gladly, having their ears tickled, pleasing them greatly. This is something many so-called Christians want to hear so they won't be hated by the world and possibly persecuted, such as by being denied employment or fired for holding such beliefs. The world will seek retribution against those who dare call out their sins while they are trying to eat, drink, and be merry. Homosexuality is unrighteous behavior so it cannot be condoned, must be spoken out against, the same as other sins. How long this freedom of speech will continue to be tolerated by an increasingly hostile lesbo-feminist-liberal-antiChristian-hate conglomerate is unknown. Thank God for the 2nd Amendment. I have this vision of a zombie apocalypse where Christians will have to blast away liberals as they come moaning and groaning trying to break into the church to destroy its teachings and all who follow it. Yeah, I have an over-active imagination but I do see non-Christians as like zombies, needing the blood of Jesus to make them living human beings again. I view non-Christians as the living dead, which they are without Jesus.
The law and the prophets are over and done with. After Jesus died it "was finished". I do not follow all the rules in Leviticus because on occasion I eat pork and work on Saturday, and sitting in traffic on I-95 I may have taken the Lord's name in vain a time or two as well. If I were under the Law, since I am guilty of offending at least one, I am guilty of offending them all. But Jesus died so that I am not under the Law, but grace. Furthermore, I do not sacrifice pigeons or a lamb for my sins as instructed in Leviticus. The Old Law is no more, having been fulfilled by Jesus when he came and died on the cross and rose again the 3rd day.
One of the prongs of attack against the bible is to equate all the laws of the old testament with dietary and hygiene laws. That is clever, because it takes off the table the moral laws of the Old Testament which clearly prohibits homosexuality. Since the evil ones have not been able to make Christians give up their bibles (I use a KJV bible as my preference), they have to try the tactic of discrediting and dismissing all the passages of the bible which explicitly declare homosexuality to be sinful. Although Genesis states that God made male and female for each other, it does not carry the weight of a law, but anyone with any sense in their head can see God's design for the male and female: the two joined together in marriage, producing children.
Once the Old Testament is dispensed with, the next tactic is to insist that the writings of the New Testament are just opinions and have no relevance in the 21st century because we are now "enlightened", and our psychologists and so-called scientists have declared homosexuality to be a normal expression of human sexuality. It does not matter the fact that no loving parent wants their children to become queer, any more than they want them to become schizophrenic: the masses declare the Christian church must "get with the program" and stop discriminating against homosexuals based upon their religion. We Christians are telling the homosexual to repent, and we will discriminate against them by not letting them be in leadership positions nor be able to influence our children. Because they are reprobates, homosexuals cannot be trusted in any position requiring moral integrity.
Adulterers are not punished by stoning to death anymore, although I am sure many cheated upon spouses wish it were so. AIDS has metaphorically "stoned" many homosexuals to death, and they will continue to die of plagues and other maladies as long as they persist in thumbing their noses at God. When a person is so far gone they cannot see that our bodies are designed male for female, to mate with the opposite sex to produce children, that person has been given over to a reprobate mind. It takes a lot of self-deception, probably along with copious amounts of drugs and alcohol, to convince oneself "God is fine with men trying to mate with other men or women with women". At best, homosexuality is a mental disorder where one's "wires are crossed" and their confused affection falls upon the same sex; at worst, it is willful fornication to fulfill the most degrading lusts of the flesh.
Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law." - (Romans 13)
So what about homosexuality? If two men love each other and have sex with each other, and Jesus said love one another is a commandment, how can that be sin?
The carnal Christian, usually a liberal, is determined at all costs to redefine deviant sexual behavior which is homosexuality to be "not a sin". These liberals use the fact that Old Testament dietary laws have passed away to claim that the prohibition against homosexuality is gone, saying that "Jesus never said anything about it", and "Paul was just giving his opinion on stuff within the context of his culture, a culture which hated gays and restricted women to childbearing and being servants in the home."
If Paul and the other apostles were not under the guidance and direction of the Holy Spirit, then nothing any of them said is of any value, any more than an Aesop’s fable: a possible moral but nothing more, to be accepted or rejected as one desires. This is what liberal Christians do: whatever I feel like is true, that is what is true, regardless what is said in the bible.
If this were all cut-and-dry, such disputes as we were having would not arise. There is some gray area, and the sinner, always afraid to come out into the light and be exposed, takes refuge in the gray shadows to justify sin.
You trying to say homosexuality is not a sin is like reaching for every possible shred in the gray area to shroud yourself in flimsy gray threads so as to hide from the truth. The bible in all its context is absolutely clear that homosexuality is a sin. The very first book of the bible declares God made man and woman to be with each other. If you cannot see this elementary, basic fact then you are either a) willfully ignorant of the truth, b) under the sway of a false teacher, or c) an evil person with an agenda to undermine the church and its teachings and won’t rest until the church caves on the issue. The church won’t, but some individual churches in apostasy will do so, and then they will cease to exist.
For over a thousand years the church, referencing the bible, has declared homosexuality to be a sin. The apostle Paul declared it a sin. Is the church suddenly wrong because a coalition of feminists, liberals, and homosexuals demand that the church reject the teachings in the bible and accept the queer view? Do you mean to tell me that for all these centuries the church has been wrong even when the bible is abundantly clear on the matter? No, the church and the bible are not incorrect, it is evil people who do not want their sins to be called sins who are wrong and are hell-bent (it is from hell these doctrines of demons are coming from) to change the church from within so that it approves of homosexuality.
You can hide in any gray area you want to justify homosexuality by omitting scripture. I cannot stop you, but I can have people like you tossed out of my local church if such people like you will not repent after hearing the truth. I will certainly vote out any pastor who holds such views.
When you stand before Jesus, you will be judged for trying to corrupt the church by treating the word of God as "opinionated drivel", trying to turn the pure, holy bride of Christ into an unclean bisexual whore with puke stains on her wedding gown and feces on her spiked heels, covered in filthy tattoos and wearing a dog collar. That is what you are trying to turn the bride of Christ into and it won't work: the true Christians who love their Lord with all their heart, mind, and soul will not abide such nonsense and will either go into a church that teaches the truth or form their own church within their homes or in a spot in the wilderness. And we will bring our children with us too and teach them, even if it is against the law we will do so, just as we did when Hitler tried to wrest the minds of our children away from God with his Hitler Youth garbage, just as we did when Stalin tried by making it illegal for parents to teach their children about God.
If you dispense with the Old Testament and all of the New Testament except for the words of Jesus, claiming that the rest of the New Testament is "just opinions of men not inspired by the Holy Spirit", then there is no place in the bible you can condemn homosexuality. The final authority becomes whatever the state and secular church leaders decide. And this is the battle we are seeing: a constant attack on the bible to declare it not an authority on anything.
1 Timothy 3:15
And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
The apostles, and Paul, wrote their letters to the churches under the guidance and teaching of the Holy Spirit. To deny this is to deny that the Holy Spirit operates in the life of anyone.
This sums up my opinion of it: “You’re wrong and you’re loved.”
https://www.desiringgod.org/articles/why-homosexuality-is-not-like-other-sins
![[Post New]](/jforum/templates/default/images/icon_minipost_new.gif){kind=icon}