Is algebra necessary for ALL?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The point is, if you were to drop Algebra II from DCPS schools, the number of DCPS students with an opportunity to have a STEM career would go from 5% to 0%. And likewise, it's also been pointed out that higher math is a requirement in grad school admissions exams. So you've also reduced the pool of DCPS grads to go on to grad school to 0%.

nuts to that. depends on the grad school program.

[Anonymous]

Here's my two cents. Studying higher math is more than just a gateway to STEM careers. It comes at a critical time in one's high school path where school is getting harder, when even smart kids can't skate through anymore without some effort and discipline. That's the time when "school sucks," "math is hard," and "I'll never need this BS anyway" attitudes cause kids to wash out of math and often out of school altogether.

In my opinion, there is value not only in keeping one's options for higher education and careers open, but also in teaching kids how to succeed in a difficult course, how to study and the value of hard work and discipline. Most of us believe in exposing our kids to music, literature, foreign language, history and sports not because we think they will necessarily major in these topics or become professional athletes, but because we want to introduce our children to a variety of academic and cultural fields that may become vocations or avocations later in life.

One of the data posts above says that STEM degree holders enjoy higher earnings whether or not they are in STEM careers. I can't help but think that is at least partially due to the fact that you need hard work and determination to power through some of the STEM coursework, and those skills serve everyone well throughout their lives.

[Anonymous]

The GRE doesn't really include anything beyond high school algebra and geometry. There's definitely no calculus or trig and the "statistics" on the GRE are very very basic. Combinatorics might be the toughest thing on the test and that is pretty basic stuff. GMAT is much the same though a bit tougher on the quant section in terms of logic and critical thinking.

I'm not advocating for dropping Algebra II. I think lack of math understanding is incredibly problematic. Higher level math is absolutely a life skill. Mastering something like Algebra II builds a person's ability to think logically. But to argue it from a "oh no, now they can't pass grad school exams" is silly. GRE, GMAT, LSAT are not math intensive tests and require 0 college level math for the test taker to do well. MCAT is not in the discussion because pre-med folks take some core science and math requirements.

I teach prep classes for grad school exams and the basic math skills are pretty terrible for the majority of students. Things seem to be derailing in terms of mastery long before high school for a good number of students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here's my two cents. Studying higher math is more than just a gateway to STEM careers. It comes at a critical time in one's high school path where school is getting harder, when even smart kids can't skate through anymore without some effort and discipline. That's the time when "school sucks," "math is hard," and "I'll never need this BS anyway" attitudes cause kids to wash out of math and often out of school altogether.

In my opinion, there is value not only in keeping one's options for higher education and careers open, but also in teaching kids how to succeed in a difficult course, how to study and the value of hard work and discipline. Most of us believe in exposing our kids to music, literature, foreign language, history and sports not because we think they will necessarily major in these topics or become professional athletes, but because we want to introduce our children to a variety of academic and cultural fields that may become vocations or avocations later in life.

One of the data posts above says that STEM degree holders enjoy higher earnings whether or not they are in STEM careers. I can't help but think that is at least partially due to the fact that you need hard work and determination to power through some of the STEM coursework, and those skills serve everyone well throughout their lives.

+1. Well-said.

[Anonymous]

Tell you what, anti-Algebra person... Let's apply your logic to the rest of the system, shall we?

A lot of these kids evidently don't manage to master proper English either. So why burden with that unnecessary hardship and stop teaching English at 4th grade too?

For that matter, why don't we just stop teaching them altogether when they reach 4th grade? Have school end then.

Your logic, not mine.

[Anonymous]

Maybe 8th grade, followed by Voc Ed and apprenticeship program

[Anonymous]

Yep, just teach to the lowest common denominator, screw every other kid's needs. I guess you are looking to drive a huge number of families away from DCPS schools.

Heckuva plan there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yep, just teach to the lowest common denominator, screw every other kid's needs. I guess you are looking to drive a huge number of families away from DCPS schools.

Heckuva plan there.

Not at all, schools should offer a banquet, but we should be able to offer a range of programs to fit different needs.

[Anonymous]

There's no banquet when it only extends to 8th grade math.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There's no banquet when it only extends to 8th grade math.

Do you understand English? Beginning to doubt your reading comprehension skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's no banquet when it only extends to 8th grade math.

Do you understand English? Beginning to doubt your reading comprehension skills.

Comprehended just fine, I agree that a banquet should be offered - a true banquet of options would offer far richer and deeper math, straight through to Calculus as opposed to stopping at Algebra I. Maybe you have your posters confused, the "8th grade math" comment was directed at the anti-Algebra poster.

[Anonymous]

Let’s be serious. DCPS isn’t capable offering a banquet of educational opportunities. It’s more like a fast-food menu, often served at a franchise that can’t pass a health inspection. Algebra II doesn’t fit well into that establishment. So, citing advanced thinking in education, DCPS rationalizes that they should get rid of it for the good of the children.

[Anonymous]

I find the whole premise of the article ridiculous - it seems the author is blaming algebra for the country's failing school system. Algebra teaches necessary competences in understanding the relationships between inputs and outputs, cause and effect. Fundamental to the way the world works. We absolutely should keep it in the cirriculum - and let's not be scared if it differentiates the best and the brightest. We need those kids to lead and contribute to our country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Let’s be serious. DCPS isn’t capable offering a banquet of educational opportunities. It’s more like a fast-food menu, often served at a franchise that can’t pass a health inspection. Algebra II doesn’t fit well into that establishment. So, citing advanced thinking in education, DCPS rationalizes that they should get rid of it for the good of the children.

If that's what DCPS is advocating for, I guess that's their prerogative. But given that choice, people who continue to support DCPS and its choices will have to accept the inevitable increase in school segregation, low expectations and the continued cycle of multigenerational poverty, and the continued flight from DCPS schools to charters and other schools that will definitely come along with it. They won't find much sympathy from the rest of us about those wounds, given they are self-inflicted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's no banquet when it only extends to 8th grade math.

Do you understand English? Beginning to doubt your reading comprehension skills.

Comprehended just fine, I agree that a banquet should be offered - a true banquet of options would offer far richer and deeper math, straight through to Calculus as opposed to stopping at Algebra I. Maybe you have your posters confused, the "8th grade math" comment was directed at the anti-Algebra poster.

"offered" is the key word which is different from "required".