Changes to grading for all MCPS high school students

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This isn't something the BOE votes on. It's a regulation, not a policy, so it's up to Taylor and CO to rewrite it.

True, but when they informed the BOE about it maybe a month ago, and said they planned to do a phased roll-out, the BOE pushed back. That's why it's 6-12 now.

My objection isn't to the policy it's to the process. Don't publicly announce you're planning one thing and then do another without any notice or any explanation.

Making unannounced last-minute changes doesn't inspire trust and feels like a bait and switch. They could really easily have said, Hey, we were planning a phased implementation but decided to do it all at once, here's why. Still not ideal but I agree with OP that the lack of transparency here isn't right and is actually counter-educational: A system that doesn't hold itself to public account does not inspire students' trust.

The juniors and seniors are gonna be justifiably mad--not because it's not good policy, but because it's bad governance--and honestly that's not a great starting place for anyone for next year.

My kid has never had a B quarter grade and only stands to benefit from this, in theory. In practice, it's just one more indication that the system they are subject to is not actually interested in them as full-fledged human beings with opinions, thoughts, and voices of their own.

This is Taylor’s way. MCPS ducks accountability, fails to show its work and does not want genuine parent or student input or feedback.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I hope everyone is expressing their opinions, whatever they are, directly to Taylor, Hazel and the BOE as suggested by the OP. They need to hear from parents.

Yes! People need to be vocal about their disgust with MCPS’s lack of transparency and collaboration with the public.

[Anonymous]

I really wish the MCR and SGA's weren't so anemic. They could be representing students and not just padding resumes and planning HoCo. Though obviously that's not up to me!

Students are stakeholders. Some are legal adults! And most older students are very nearly so. It's such poor form not to notify them at all, much less solicit feedback, much less change the game 3/4 of the way in.

Can't wait to be done with all this. Less than 12 months to go!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op is right that it’s weird to average the two quarters instead of skit giving a semester grade. For the AP classes there are almost no assignments 4th quarter so it’s weird to weigh it as heavily as third quarter.

I have a rising junior and somehow missed the earlier thread about this. Amy change is incredibly nerve wracking at this point. We are already so stressed out aboit the whole thing. And I feel like the first year always has tough adjustments as the teachers figure it out. I really hate for the experimentation heat to be his junior year when we’re already sort of mentally hanging on by a thread. Teachers will neeec to develop new finals that they’ve never given before and it won’t necessarily all work immediately for all teachers. It might be helpful if they all bring back curved grading — my oldest is at a challenging college and often the teacher overshoots on the final, everyone gets a D and so the teacher says “sorry, I wrote a bad test — don’t worrry I’ve curve it.” Currently McPS teachers don’t have that ability. I just think there are gojng to be unanticipated wrinkles that will take a year or two to iron out.

What are you talking about no assignments 4th quarter for AP classes. There are plenty of assignments. There has to be because all the students who are not seniors need grades. It’s one of the reasons why I and others absolutely hate when school starts and how classes are setup because for AP students they have to take exams early May at almost the start of 4th qtr but then have like 6wks remaining for class. My kid has had whole projects and papers that had to be done post exams.

Are you aware of what those assignments actually are? As a mother of current junior, I found the multiple assignments requiring students to plan trips interesting but not exactly reflective of the subject.

Yes I’m acutely aware of the assignments are and can see the grades. And while even my kids will admit these assignments are more interesting and enjoyable, the absolutely are still requiring time and focus. They are just more project based assignments.

Yes. It’s very “project based” to plan a teacher’s vacation. <eye roll>

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's not fair that my 89.45 didn't round to 89.5 to round to 90 to round to 100/An

You should probably relearn the rules of rounding. Some of you are telling on yourselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I disagree with not rounding X9.5 ti 10. Isn’t it a very basic rule of math?

I also do not get why all four grading periods are equal. This is still screwy as was the previous way. Why not simply count all grades earned within the semester toward the final grade?

NP here.

If someone wishes to have a strict view of "at least X%", then "at least X%" means you have to be at X.0, Not (X-0.5). For example, an A is at least 90% would mean an A is at least 90.0, not 89.5.

I am fine with that, quite honestly. Not all college profs allow 0.5 bump.

I am 51 years old and had a numerical grading system. Even in the olden days, when someone was ended up with an 89.5, it was rounded to a 90. Of all of MCPS’s policies, rounding is the least controversial/probelmatic.

It's doesn't really matter one way or the other what the cut off is, but there's no argument in favor of rounding a cutoff. If you want the cutoff to be 89.5, make the cut off 89.5, and say it is 89.5! Don't make the cutoff 89.5 but lie and say it's 90.

Anyone who doesn't understand this doesn't deserve a high school diploma, and probably was educated in MCPS.

Schools have rounded for a long, long time. I’m sorry basic rules of rounding escaped you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems that OP is the only one opposed, lol. I’m strongly for these immediate changes.

What grade is your kid in? I’m fine with this for my 7th grader when she starts HS, but not okay with it for my 10th grader. It’s just not fair to these kids to change the rule on how semester grades are calculated halfway through HS.

But isn't it better to change it now to prepare them for college? Otherwise they will just get thrown into college without experience with real grading.

Real grading? I thought it was about real leaning.

Please tell me how real learning can happen when little Johnny doesn’t show up for 10 weeks because he knows he got a C during MP3…

If grades weren’t important for learning, we wouldn’t have them. But they absolutely are necessary, at least for students whose minds are not fully developed, and would not be intrinsically motivated to learn algebraic equations. Also, teachers cannot adequately measure a students learning without grades. If you would like to keep living in La La Land, go ahead…

I am absolutely baffled that people here care about the kid who doesn’t show up for 10 weeks and gets a C. What does that have to do with my kid? Teachers keep moving the lessons along. Some of you are absolutely nuts. Set standards for your own kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Now if they would bring back a real attendance policy. Like Loss of Credit.

Why do you care? How does this affect your child?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op is right that it’s weird to average the two quarters instead of skit giving a semester grade. For the AP classes there are almost no assignments 4th quarter so it’s weird to weigh it as heavily as third quarter.

I have a rising junior and somehow missed the earlier thread about this. Amy change is incredibly nerve wracking at this point. We are already so stressed out aboit the whole thing. And I feel like the first year always has tough adjustments as the teachers figure it out. I really hate for the experimentation heat to be his junior year when we’re already sort of mentally hanging on by a thread. Teachers will neeec to develop new finals that they’ve never given before and it won’t necessarily all work immediately for all teachers. It might be helpful if they all bring back curved grading — my oldest is at a challenging college and often the teacher overshoots on the final, everyone gets a D and so the teacher says “sorry, I wrote a bad test — don’t worrry I’ve curve it.” Currently McPS teachers don’t have that ability. I just think there are gojng to be unanticipated wrinkles that will take a year or two to iron out.

What are you talking about no assignments 4th quarter for AP classes. There are plenty of assignments. There has to be because all the students who are not seniors need grades. It’s one of the reasons why I and others absolutely hate when school starts and how classes are setup because for AP students they have to take exams early May at almost the start of 4th qtr but then have like 6wks remaining for class. My kid has had whole projects and papers that had to be done post exams.

Are you aware of what those assignments actually are? As a mother of current junior, I found the multiple assignments requiring students to plan trips interesting but not exactly reflective of the subject.

Sounds like an easy A. You MCPS parents want everyone to get a participation trophy (A+)

That’s the first PP’s point - not all points are the same. I know you are just dying to insult kids and parents as you talk about grade inflation and participation, but please keep up. You lack sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Now if they would bring back a real attendance policy. Like Loss of Credit.

Why do you care? How does this affect your child?

Because students consistently skip classes knowing that they can.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Now if they would bring back a real attendance policy. Like Loss of Credit.

Why do you care? How does this affect your child?

Because students consistently skip classes knowing that they can.

Parent your own kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Now if they would bring back a real attendance policy. Like Loss of Credit.

Why do you care? How does this affect your child?

Because students consistently skip classes knowing that they can.

Parent your own kid.

Teachers can’t parent their students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If grades weren’t important for learning, we wouldn’t have them. But they absolutely are necessary, at least for students whose minds are not fully developed, and would not be intrinsically motivated to learn algebraic equations. Also, teachers cannot adequately measure a students learning without grades. If you would like to keep living in La La Land, go ahead…

I love this response! It really demonstrates super well how the most vehement opinions are often based on false assumptions and cognitive biases:

1. Research consistently shows that grades are not necessary for learning and may in fact undermine it. See Self-Determination Theory (external rewards (ike grades can actually crowd out intrinsic motivation); and mastery vs performance orientation (Dweck) - emphasis on performance comes at expense of mastery.

For younger and less motivated learners, research consistently shows that clear goals, support, and feedback work better than letter grades.

2. *Feedback* is necessary; grades are not. More than thirty years of research demonstrate that adding a grade to feedback actually reduces the effect of the feedback.

tl;dr The opposite of what you said is true

lol

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Now if they would bring back a real attendance policy. Like Loss of Credit.

Why do you care? How does this affect your child?

Because students consistently skip classes knowing that they can.

Parent your own kid.

Teachers can’t parent their students.

Worried other people’s children again?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I had a tougher grading scale than my kids do, I had semester and final exams, there was no such thing as retakes, and there was no 50% rule — but teachers could offer extra credit, I didn’t have to take math my senior year, I had 2-3 study halls as a senior, I didn’t need to take tons of APs to get into college, there was no SSL requirement, no one I knew did any serious prepping for the SAT. I don’t remember feeling like my college app essay was a make-or-break part of the application process. I wasn’t even a slacker; I was valedictorian and a National Merit Scholar and attended college on a full tuition scholarship.


Now you have to have an unweighted 4.0, a 1500+ SAT, take 12 APs, be a competitive athlete at the state level, have 300 documented SSL hours, have an interesting hobby, a leadership position, and a compelling life story to get into a top college.

I don’t object to bringing back a tougher grading scale and final exams, but something has to give. It’s not fair to subject today’s students to all of the most stringent requirements from the last 40 years. No other generation has had the proposed grading scale + final exams + SSL requirement + current course requirements + no study halls + such competitive college admissions.

There is a lot of truth to this. I graduated in 1990 as a national merit scholar, top grades, 4 APs (which was considered crazy rigorous back then!). I had ECs that I considered fancy but now would be cosnidered basically a joke. When my oldest was in HS, she was 1-2 years ahead of all the classes I took. And she had 7 classsrs when I only had six and one of them was orchestra! Stuff is just so incredibly stressful now that being able to ride a little on that 1st q A was the only thing getting my kid thru. She was sleeping like 4 hours a night most of senior year. She is now at a top 10 college and finds it basically pretty easy. She’s not commuting an hour a day to school with butt in seat in class for 7 hours plus all the ECs, so she has a ton more time to actually study!

I just feel like we’ve made Hs so insanely stressful. I hope at least the teachers can cut down on some of the busy work assignments.