How the hell is anyone supposed to get into college now?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Getting into the second tier schools like Mich really isn’t that hard. You just need the stats and scores. And you need to be strategic, know which regions and which schools the college likes the pull kids from. There are schools that have 3-4 kids accepted into Mich every year. This may not be where your HS sends kids. So figure out if they send kids to NYU or another school.

I disagree. Michigan routinely denies valedictorians

Michigan waitlisted my A Student IB Diploma DD. Has old time ECs like newspaper EIC and sports captain, plus a couple of good internships. Perhaps because TO. But going to a top 15 school.

same.

4.92 wgpa
4.0 gpa
1580 sat

THIS. Try applying to Michigan 00S with a 1350 and not at the very top of your class with excellent ECs and essays and awards and see what happens. It's on par with ivies for OOS kids - the 20% is for in-state kids. That 1350 poster always pops up to crap on Michigan and say how easy it is to get in.

Major matters….

ok, so major in art history, as a PP stated. Certainly not CS or Eng, like my super high stats DC did.

You clearly weren’t strategic.

How would they have been strategic in order to be a CS major? I don't think it's easy to transfer into CS.

Don’t be a CS major.

but, that's what they are interested in, so that doesn't really work.

Intellectually narrow-minded people aren't interesting to a college. Your kid can sit on the computer at home. Don't need an elite college for that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t believe everything you read. That’s the most important step in the process. Everyone has an agenda, even if it’s just to humble brag about one’s own kid, so stay alert.

People embellish grades but especially test scores regularly, and there are countless people who will insist that there are more than enough applicants with an unblemished GPA, a perfect ACT of SAT score (one-and-done, no less) and a wall of 5s on 15+ AP tests to occupy every available seat in the incoming freshman class at the Top 20 schools. Meanwhile, back in reality, there are less than 500 applicants in any year with that profile. Not even enough to fill a single Top 20 freshman class other than at Cal Tech.

Just don’t trust strangers …

THIS. There is a DCUM poster who posts relentlessly about her class of 2023 kid who had top/perfect everything and was basically shut out from top 20 schools. She pops up again and again and again. She posts enough that I swear it changes the tone of this place--every time you turn around you're hit with the "perfect wasn't good enough" narrative and it seems like it's posted by many different people but it's always the same mom.

Yet no one has given a counterexample from a public school

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Getting into the second tier schools like Mich really isn’t that hard. You just need the stats and scores. And you need to be strategic, know which regions and which schools the college likes the pull kids from. There are schools that have 3-4 kids accepted into Mich every year. This may not be where your HS sends kids. So figure out if they send kids to NYU or another school.

I disagree. Michigan routinely denies valedictorians

Michigan waitlisted my A Student IB Diploma DD. Has old time ECs like newspaper EIC and sports captain, plus a couple of good internships. Perhaps because TO. But going to a top 15 school.

same.

4.92 wgpa
4.0 gpa
1580 sat

THIS. Try applying to Michigan 00S with a 1350 and not at the very top of your class with excellent ECs and essays and awards and see what happens. It's on par with ivies for OOS kids - the 20% is for in-state kids. That 1350 poster always pops up to crap on Michigan and say how easy it is to get in.

Major matters….

ok, so major in art history, as a PP stated. Certainly not CS or Eng, like my super high stats DC did.

You clearly weren’t strategic.

How would they have been strategic in order to be a CS major? I don't think it's easy to transfer into CS.

Don’t be a CS major.

but, that's what they are interested in, so that doesn't really work.

Intellectually narrow-minded people aren't interesting to a college. Your kid can sit on the computer at home. Don't need an elite college for that.

💯 agree here

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Ugh, I feel bad for my average student

Don't - an average student with reasonable goals, funding and selection criteria has the easiest time in this process.

Yes and average students have never been able to get into top schools. Top colleges are for top students who will succeed in that type of environment.

Top colleges are for rich kids and fgli diversity.

[Anonymous]

My son is very smart, but I also think fairly typical/well-rounded. Unhooked and got in everywhere last cycle RD. 2 Ivies, Hopkins, T20s, etc, etc. No private hired counselor. Wrote his own essays.

I heard all kinds of horror stories and we were prepared for a shutout so 'over' applied---17 schools. He was accepted to all but 1.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:
Then go to a less selective school. You can study CS in lots of places. In VA, you could go to UMW (91% admit rate) and a high-stats student would get merit making the cost <$20k/year.

You can study CS in lots of places, but the outcome is not the same. As you would expect, the average salary at age 25 and age 45 of a CS grads from UMW is far less than that of a CS grad from VT or UVA or an OOS selective institution.

Sensible major at less selective school >>> dumb major at more selective school
Sensible major at more selective school >>> sensible major at less selective school

CS is vocational

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Getting into the second tier schools like Mich really isn’t that hard. You just need the stats and scores. And you need to be strategic, know which regions and which schools the college likes the pull kids from. There are schools that have 3-4 kids accepted into Mich every year. This may not be where your HS sends kids. So figure out if they send kids to NYU or another school.

I disagree. Michigan routinely denies valedictorians

Michigan waitlisted my A Student IB Diploma DD. Has old time ECs like newspaper EIC and sports captain, plus a couple of good internships. Perhaps because TO. But going to a top 15 school.

same.

4.92 wgpa
4.0 gpa
1580 sat

THIS. Try applying to Michigan 00S with a 1350 and not at the very top of your class with excellent ECs and essays and awards and see what happens. It's on par with ivies for OOS kids - the 20% is for in-state kids. That 1350 poster always pops up to crap on Michigan and say how easy it is to get in.

Major matters….

ok, so major in art history, as a PP stated. Certainly not CS or Eng, like my super high stats DC did.

You clearly weren’t strategic.

How would they have been strategic in order to be a CS major? I don't think it's easy to transfer into CS.

Don’t be a CS major.

but, that's what they are interested in, so that doesn't really work.

Intellectually narrow-minded people aren't interesting to a college. Your kid can sit on the computer at home. Don't need an elite college for that.

The irony...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My son is very smart, but I also think fairly typical/well-rounded. Unhooked and got in everywhere last cycle RD. 2 Ivies, Hopkins, T20s, etc, etc. No private hired counselor. Wrote his own essays.

I heard all kinds of horror stories and we were prepared for a shutout so 'over' applied---17 schools. He was accepted to all but 1.

Stats? Major? Public or private Hs?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Like so many straight A students who were chief school newspaper editor, captain of a varsity sports team, volunteering, and more who can't even get to VA Tech. I don't know what people who get into schools like Michigan or the Ivy Leagues are doing in high school.

My daughter's friend who got into Yale was an Asian male with a very high wGPA who won Science Olympiad competitions and is an advanced string player.

Straight A doesn't mean anything, OP, you should know this. There is a world's difference between an A in a regular classs and an A in an AP class. Kids who get into the top colleges have 10+ APs, have a national level EC, etc. Your newpaper editing and team captainship worked a generation ago, but not today.

This is sounds exhausting. Kids have no time to be kids.

I am 44, and in my European country, high school was a stressful workathon culminating in one heck of a national exam week. I was so stressed out I couldn't eat on the first day of national exams. But that's nowhere near the worst. My cousins come from a country in Asia known for its teen suicide rate due to exam failure. Over there, when school ends for the day, the kids go to afternoon prep schools to cram. I know *elementary school kids* who had tutors to prepare for admission into the most prestigious afternoon prep schools!!! Separate from their regular school! HOW CRAZY IS THAT?!?

All to say: don't ever believe the US has it bad. I promise you, even for the kids who take grades seriously... it's still a layabout's paradise.

Huh? My NYC sibling had a tutor for her 2yo to prep for preschool admissions to get into the right preschool that would line up for the right elementary. That was over 20 years ago. She had two kids - one ended up graduating from Wash U and is unemployed. The other is at an Ivy.

One of my kids had a tutor by elementary. All had tutors in high school and SAT prep. All took multiple APs, as early as 9th grade. The thing about US education isn’t that it’s laid back - it’s that it’s very individual. It’s a huge country and getting into the top 10-15 schools is very hard - but no one will force you to do those things. There are a lot of less competitive options and that’s where most of the laid back kids will end up.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Full pay helps

Do you indicate full pay on the application? How does full pay help?

You don’t complete a FAFSA or other financial aid forms.

So if you don't complete FAFSA/aid to submit with the application, that can be taken into consideration? Does FAFSA come later in the process?
Sorry, I have a 10th and we're not there yet

Yes…many schools give preference to people that don’t need aid. The very top 15 schools are need-blind and don’t care if you need aid but they have massive endowments.

We filled out the FAFSA but applied early decision (which implies willingness to pay full price). Got in, and are now paying 90k per year. Be careful what you wish for!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Getting into the second tier schools like Mich really isn’t that hard. You just need the stats and scores. And you need to be strategic, know which regions and which schools the college likes the pull kids from. There are schools that have 3-4 kids accepted into Mich every year. This may not be where your HS sends kids. So figure out if they send kids to NYU or another school.

I disagree. Michigan routinely denies valedictorians

Michigan waitlisted my A Student IB Diploma DD. Has old time ECs like newspaper EIC and sports captain, plus a couple of good internships. Perhaps because TO. But going to a top 15 school.

same.

4.92 wgpa
4.0 gpa
1580 sat

THIS. Try applying to Michigan 00S with a 1350 and not at the very top of your class with excellent ECs and essays and awards and see what happens. It's on par with ivies for OOS kids - the 20% is for in-state kids. That 1350 poster always pops up to crap on Michigan and say how easy it is to get in.

How is quoting the fact that at least 40% of Michigan's freshmen have an SAT score below 1350 crapping on Michigan? That's just pointing out that you don't need a1550 to get into good schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Like so many straight A students who were chief school newspaper editor, captain of a varsity sports team, volunteering, and more who can't even get to VA Tech. I don't know what people who get into schools like Michigan or the Ivy Leagues are doing in high school.

My daughter's friend who got into Yale was an Asian male with a very high wGPA who won Science Olympiad competitions and is an advanced string player.

Straight A doesn't mean anything, OP, you should know this. There is a world's difference between an A in a regular classs and an A in an AP class. Kids who get into the top colleges have 10+ APs, have a national level EC, etc. Your newpaper editing and team captainship worked a generation ago, but not today.

This is sounds exhausting. Kids have no time to be kids.

The top kids canget the 1530+ first try, ace all the hard APs, and find time to have 3-4 meaningful ECs as well as at least state level
academic recognition. And they sleep too. The competition is that fierce.

My neighbor’s kid plays violin, varsity football, 7 AP’s 5, lost his virginity at 13, editor of school newspaper, 1570 SAT. Waitlisted at Harvard, Yale. Princeton admit.

Our family friend in suburban Chicago had mediocre grades and average test scores but started his own business—a brothel in his parent’s home- and also got into Princeton.

Ha ha does he like playing air guitar in his shirt/undies?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just apply as an art history major.

Top schools do not accept by major. No one is getting fooled by the art history major with programming ECs

You need to change your ECs too.
Omit some.
Smart ppl start on this in 9th/10th

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Getting into the second tier schools like Mich really isn’t that hard. You just need the stats and scores. And you need to be strategic, know which regions and which schools the college likes the pull kids from. There are schools that have 3-4 kids accepted into Mich every year. This may not be where your HS sends kids. So figure out if they send kids to NYU or another school.

I disagree. Michigan routinely denies valedictorians

Michigan waitlisted my A Student IB Diploma DD. Has old time ECs like newspaper EIC and sports captain, plus a couple of good internships. Perhaps because TO. But going to a top 15 school.

same.

4.92 wgpa
4.0 gpa
1580 sat

THIS. Try applying to Michigan 00S with a 1350 and not at the very top of your class with excellent ECs and essays and awards and see what happens. It's on par with ivies for OOS kids - the 20% is for in-state kids. That 1350 poster always pops up to crap on Michigan and say how easy it is to get in.

Major matters….

ok, so major in art history, as a PP stated. Certainly not CS or Eng, like my super high stats DC did.

You clearly weren’t strategic.

How would they have been strategic in order to be a CS major? I don't think it's easy to transfer into CS.

Don’t be a CS major.

but, that's what they are interested in, so that doesn't really work.

Intellectually narrow-minded people aren't interesting to a college. Your kid can sit on the computer at home. Don't need an elite college for that.

Narrow minded kids go to college all the time. They’re 17/18 years olds. Most kids have no idea what they even want to do when they grow up. Nor should they. Only the tippy top colleges require proof of passion or niche interests. It’s irrelevant to most students .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Like so many straight A students who were chief school newspaper editor, captain of a varsity sports team, volunteering, and more who can't even get to VA Tech. I don't know what people who get into schools like Michigan or the Ivy Leagues are doing in high school.

I think your first mistake is saying “even VA Tech,” as if you assume it’s somehow easy to get into or that your kid deserves a spot for some reason. It’s an excellent school, along with many others you no doubt underestimate.