Downtown DC is a storefront ghost
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Anonymous
The difference between me and you is that I have no personal views or agenda. I am just pointing out patterns of consumer behavior and that seems to make you mad. |
Anonymous
Have you followed the thread? Multiple people have advocated for plentiful and reasonably priced parking in (newly built) garages, as one element in successfully reimagining the downtown DC core. See Bethesda for a thriving real-life example. The Wharf businesses are bustling with vacationing tourists and expense-account business travelers. Yay. Neither group blanches at the eye-watering parking prices because they’re taking ubers they don’t pay for or they’re on that once- a-year special anniversary hotel stay. You can’t create an entire downtown on the backs of these two groups without canibalizing other parts of DC. You need to be attractive to a broader swath of the public — and $50-$75 transportation/ day doesn’t do that. |
Anonymous
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I just wanted to note that La Cosecha has a large parking garage underneath it where you can park for free for the first three hours. It is also used as overflow parking for Union Market.
Every large building being built in the Union Market area has a parking garage, there is zero reason to rely on street parking there. Eventually they'll get rid of the lot at UM to build another building there (with underground parking). Also eventually none of the parking in that neighborhood will be free unless you are shopping at Trader Joe's. This is how urban development works. |
Anonymous
Surface parking lots and then above ground garages are more highly preferred than underground garages from a consumer standpoint. All of the surface lots at Pike and Rose fill first before the garages. In downtown Bethesda, the above ground lots fill before the underground lots which never fill. People will circle the garage in Bethesda Row for 15 minutes and not even consider parking in the underground garage just around the corner that has 700 spaces. |
Anonymous
I live in the neighborhood and La Cosecha has a ton of dedicated parking -- it right under the building and free for the first three hours. It's arguably much better than the parking at Union Market because it's in a parking garage so you can also park and go to La Cosecha without going outside in inclement weather, and is much more handicap accessible because there is an elevator. People park at Union Market will walk to La Cosecha or other eateries in that part of the neighborhood. People park where they can park. The two markets are very close -- two blocks. In between you have places like Last Call, St. Anselm, Maman bakery -- all of which are technically closer to La Cosecha actually. The new Pastis is on the same street as La Cosecha and not visible from Union Market. The Trader Joe's, Warby Parker, and Framebridge are all closer to La Cosecha. The reason La Cosecha has struggled compared to Union Market is because they tried to scale up very quickly, I think figuring they could capitalize on the success of UM. The space is very built out with more permanent installations and fewer stalls (there's actually a lot of turnover in the stalls at Union Market, but it's not that hard for them to get replacement tenants because the stalls are fairly cheap to rent -- much harder to turnover a larger cafe space with a bar and seating, or a full restaurant build out like the one at the now-closed Las Gemelas at La Cosecha). I also think La Cosecha has struggled with identity. By billing themselves as a Latin market, they narrow the potential businesses that can go in there (no such restriction at UM). It also means there's slightly less variety there, which might impact consumer interest. I say this as someone who love Las Gemelas and went often, and hits up Peruvian Bros. for empanadas once a week. Living in the neighborhood, I have friends come here often and it's harder to convince people to meet up at La Cosecha than Union Market, because I think people are unsure what to make of it and feel Union Market offers more options. La Cosecha is actually nicer (better seating, more pleasant outdoor area, and because it's less crowded, it's easier to sit) but I get that UM is more convenient to people. The problem with La Cosecha is NOT lack of parking (they have free parking). It has to do with other things related to pricing and concept. They also got pretty screwed with their timing, due to the pandemic, which compacted their already accelerated scale up time. |
Anonymous
It doesn't matter. Pike and Rose is in the suburbs. Surface lots are incredibly inefficient in the urban core and surface lots don't last. The surface lot at Union Market will be eliminated in the next few years. It's not even well maintained now -- it's nothing like the lots at Pike and Rose which were built to last a long time. The developers who are building up Union Market are going to force all the parking underground because it allows them to put up buildings with street level retail and then high rise apartments, greatly increasing the value of the lot. Also, since the build up of the neighborhood involves so many apartments, the development is building in a customer base that does not even need a car, on top of the people who live nearby in NoMa. None of those people are going to drive to Union Market. These are people who bought there specifically so they could walk to all the amenities. Development in the city and in the suburbs operates differently. Eventually it will be close to impossible to park in Union Market, and when you do, it will cost a lot of money, just like in Navy Yard or the Wharf. And suburbanites will complain. And no one will care because the neighborhood will have enough well off residents to sustain business there, and people from outside the city will just have to suck it up and pay a premium for underground parking, or use public transportation. And many of you will, because you actually like these destinations and they offer a lot more than anything you have in the burbs. Even at a place like Pike and Rose or the Mosaic District, which ultimately are just facsimiles of what the city offers. Sorry. |
Anonymous
This is truly maddening behavior by drivers. They will circle, they will park in a bus stop/bike lane/fire hydrant zone, throw on their flashers in a travel lane for thirty minutes when a free or cheap garage is right there to use. What is even going through their heads? Do they not know about the garage? |
Anonymous
No you’re not objectively pointing out a “pattern of consumer behavior.” You’re actively claiming the obvious pattern of consumer behavior in a city isn’t happening. |
Anonymous
Lol just stop. So not only are dense urban spaces supposed to cater to drivers, but it also has to be surface parking? Total clown show. |
Anonymous
This is why I don’t like areas like Bethesda. All the worst parts of a suburb with none of the charm of the city or actual space of a suburb. I much prefer actual urban areas friendly to pedestrians, even if the open space is shared (eg parks) instead of my own backyard. |
Anonymous
^^exactly. PP in denial about what the market actually wants (dense, walkable, transit). You’ll always be able to drive and park in city centers - but you’re going to have to pay a premium (which is logical since there’s more demand for space) and deal with traffic (also logical). PP wants the suburbs. |
Anonymous
Does GGW staff a full time intern to obsessively monitor this and similar sites? |
Anonymous
Hm. The ratio of 28 yr olds without kids or a mortgage relative to the rest of the adults in DC and the close suburbs is lopsided in favor of the latter. Spoiler alert - the group that doesn’t live in the micro apartments has more disposable income. But, feel free to push the vision that the younger, carless renters alone can sustain the kind of CRE conversion needed in downtown DC |
Anonymous
Someone’s obsessive, and it’s not the people pointing out the obvious fact that people walk/metro in city areas like Union Market and the Wharf, and if you do drive, it will be expensive and inconvenient. |
Anonymous
I don’t even understand what that word salad meant. The rest of us get that driving to a city center and parking in a surface lot or street for cheap, right in front of the restaurant you want to go to, is not really a thing. If you chose to live driving distance away from the city core and won’t take metro, it is what it is. I don’t think turning downtown DC into a stripmall is anyone’s notion of an economic turnaround plan. |