Beware of Small Liberal Arts Colleges if you're not on a sport

[Anonymous]

Couple things: (1) At DIII schools, NARPs can walk on to teams that are, in actuality, no-cut; doesn't happen that way at DI schools, so maybe a SLAC is despite the assumptions the right place for the ARP-curious. (2) For intellectual kids or kids thinking of getting PhDs, the educational advantages of these "elite" SLACs outweigh the social pain that goes so deep on one side of the athlete/non-athlete divide. That pain is just something you try not to enmesh yourself in as you take tutorial-style courses and do independent studies and effortlessly collect recommendations and research opportunities that position you for an Ivy PhD program. The key is to not feel jealous of the football, lacrosse, and hockey athletes and their social lives that look perfect from outside of those particular teams. Find solidarity and fun times with the other smart kids of the type who exude soulfulness in John Hughes movies. And go to Harvard for grad school.
-Geeky Eph walk-on with a PhD

[Anonymous]

How many kids are getting phds? Maybe 2% of a typical slac class?

[Anonymous]

Maybe 20 percent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What is Colgate like? DD is applying there- she is a no-sports, no sorority, studious kid.

Great education and strong alum support. Heavy Greek presence with residential houses. Known for being a big school for drinking. Super remote.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How many kids are getting phds? Maybe 2% of a typical slac class?

2% of Americans have a Ph.D. The Top SLACs disproportionately produce students who go on to get Ph.D.s, so I'm guessing more than 2% for SLACs overall.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How many kids are getting phds? Maybe 2% of a typical slac class?

Many aren't getting PhDs, but many are PhD curious and enjoy the intellectual vibe of preparing as if they were.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:agree with earlier poster that this is a real problem at smaller nescacs like Williams and middlebury - get ready for cold lonely winters there if ur not an athlete. Less of an issue at the larger schools like Tufts and Wes. Athletics is almost a counter culture at Wes, the jocks are basically seen as caricatures

Middlebury currently has 2,800 students. Just under 800 students participate on sports teams. That leaves 2,000+ non-athletes. Hardly lonely.

meh - the student body is extremely fragmented, cliquey and divisive at Middlebury - probably the worst in the nescac and I’m speaking from experience- if ur a male and don’t play sports.. hard pass

Ha. As a male who went to Middlebury and never got close to a field of any sort (except to watch a few football games), I patently disagree. But I guess everyone has their own lived experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:word to the wise about radio and newspaper - those aren't generally social, radio in particular. you may have a zoom once a term, but otherwise you get your time slot and then you're alone in a booth - or at some schools - broadcasting from your own laptop in your own room. Newspapers also a lot of assignments, not a lot of milling about a newsroom like an old movie.

Funny: For me, the student newspaper and the radio station were the two places where I found my people.

Sure, sometimes I'd be by myself in the studio booth while doing a radio shift, but there was a lounge right next to it with all the record shelves where people hung out and talked and pulled out records or CDs for their upcoming shifts, and discussed what bands were coming to our town. And the newspaper had weekly meetings to discuss upcoming stories, and we'd hang out afterward. Both groups had parties about every two weeks, which was good for me to be able to study but have fun too.

So anyway, that was in the '90s, but I imagine it's similar now at many schools!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:agree with earlier poster that this is a real problem at smaller nescacs like Williams and middlebury - get ready for cold lonely winters there if ur not an athlete. Less of an issue at the larger schools like Tufts and Wes. Athletics is almost a counter culture at Wes, the jocks are basically seen as caricatures

Middlebury currently has 2,800 students. Just under 800 students participate on sports teams. That leaves 2,000+ non-athletes. Hardly lonely.

meh - the student body is extremely fragmented, cliquey and divisive at Middlebury - probably the worst in the nescac and I’m speaking from experience- if ur a male and don’t play sports.. hard pass

Ha. As a male who went to Middlebury and never got close to a field of any sort (except to watch a few football games), I patently disagree. But I guess everyone has their own lived experience.

+1 A good friend's son recently graduated from Middlebury and he was one of the least sporty people I know and he loved it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What is Colgate like? DD is applying there- she is a no-sports, no sorority, studious kid.

Colgate is very athlete, frat oriented. According to many prior threads about Colgate, female students are not treated with respect.

The campus is attractive, but the town is tiny. One main bar for students.

To which other schools is your daughter applying ? (Based on your description of your daughter, Colgate does not seem like the right environment.)

Colgate's academics are fine. connections often lead to high paying jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Didn't high school have a lot of athletes, people in plays, etc.? Don't know why college would be any different.

Time to grow up.

(New Poster)

Time to grow up ? Please reread your post; you are making the point that LACs are just like redoing high school. I agree.

It's not re-doing high school. High school has groups doing the same things most colleges do regardless of size. If a kid cannot adapt socially, that's not the college's fault.

Someone 18-22 needs to learn how to interact with a college community. The social environment will not be tailor made for you.

I appreciate your perspective, but I still disagree.

LACs are more cliquish than high schools and this is a problem because students spend 24 hours of each day on campus. There is no break from the segregation. At least during high school one ate breakfast & dinner elsewhere & slept at home.

Larger schools require more maturity due to diversity on all levels--social, academic, athletic, as well as economically. If a student wants to segregate at a large school, then it is easy to join a fraternity or sorority or live in a group theme house; but large universities also have lots of independent students as well as the opportunity for occasional anonymity. In short, LACs are like living in a small town where everyone knows everyone's business and each person has a place while large universities are more like living in a city amid diversity in all of its forms. LACs delay real life--which is fine if that is what one prefers.

You people are so crazy. I can’t imagine being a full-grown adult and writing anything like the above. It is bizarre. Fascinating in a way because I find the anti-SLAC people interesting — I can’t imagine making SLACs my obsession in life — but bizarre.

It certainly appears as though you are obsessed. What a weirdly childish post you wrote--and for what purpose ? Just to denigrate another poster ?

[Anonymous]

Discussion of LACs is important because they are typically small schools in isolated locations for which full-pay students pay about $350,000+ for a four year liberal arts degree.

National Universities offer more diversity socially, academically, athletically, and with respect to opportunities. If a student has difficulty adjusting in such an environment, it is probably the student's fault for not taking advantage of the many varied options.

LACs are small, isolated communities which often have a strong, dominant personality. If one doesn't fit in, then the options are quite limited.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please, people, name the colleges you are talking about. Particularly you, OP. So bizarre to come here to "give advice" to other parents but not to mention the school in question. Are you worried that you'll somehow be outed?

They aren’t really parents. They are trolls.

+1 They are definitely a weird group.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know why anyone would want such a small universe
sorry ~ large state school preference here

Your education didn’t serve you well if you can’t actually understand this, and I say this as someone who didn’t attend or have ties to SLACs. Here are just a few reasons a student might want to attend:

Because they want to go on to get PhDs, which SLAC students do disproportionately.

Because they don’t want to be an anonymous number.

Because they want to know all their professors well.

Because they don’t want classes taught by underpaid and sometimes abused graduate students.

Because they want to be on a campus where they can talk with the president of the school easily.

Because they want to go to medical school.

And that’s just a fraction of the reasons I can identify with very little effort.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know why anyone would want such a small universe
sorry ~ large state school preference here

Your education didn’t serve you well if you can’t actually understand this, and I say this as someone who didn’t attend or have ties to SLACs. Here are just a few reasons a student might want to attend:

Because they want to go on to get PhDs, which SLAC students do disproportionately.

Because they don’t want to be an anonymous number.

Because they want to know all their professors well.

Because they don’t want classes taught by underpaid and sometimes abused graduate students.

Because they want to be on a campus where they can talk with the president of the school easily.

Because they want to go to medical school.

And that’s just a fraction of the reasons I can identify with very little effort.

+1. The main reason my kid was attracted to LACs was the prospect of being taught by professors, not grad-student TAs. And the potential opportunities of doing research with those professors, who of course won't have grad-student TAs.