Question about Trump and the pope for Catholics

[Anonymous]

I am not Catholic but grew up in an area that was heavily Catholic. My understanding was/is that Catholicism tells Catholics that the pope is infallible in what he preaches. To contradict him or to say you disagree with him would be the same as saying you contradict and disagree with God. Is it more nuanced than this? Because I would think that with Trump basically calling the pope a terrible person and a loser, and the pope speaking out against the war in Iran, Catholics who intend to follow the church doctrine really don't have a choice but to be against Trump at this point. Am I missing something? I assume I am, but I'd like to hear from practicing Catholics about it.

[Anonymous]

Catholics pick and choose what they want to follow. Jesus would not have been for racism or deporting people, but people can rationalize anything.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Catholics pick and choose what they want to follow. Jesus would not have been for racism or deporting people, but people can rationalize anything.

Indeed. Jesus would not have been in favor of abortion or lawlessness, but the Pope remained silent when those things were condoned.

Why would the pope have been meeting with David Axelrod, a Jew, if not for political reasons?

[Anonymous]

I heard the president portrayed himself as Jesus. Maybe they are equal?

[Anonymous]

Is it more nuanced than this?

Yes, the Pope is only infallible when he speaks ex cathedra or from the chair. That's exceedingly rare. The last time was in 1950.

Other pronouncements, particularly those in encyclicals, are generally viewed as binding on Catholic practice.

There are Catholic doctrines which apply here. One is the doctrine of a just war, which you can read about here:

https://www.milarch.org/catholic-teaching-on-peace/

What Pope Leo is saying is that Trump's war in Iran doesn't satisfy these conditions and thus it is an immoral war.

Hope that helps.

[Anonymous]

^^Not to mention LBGTQ++ and transgenderism being endorsed, especially when relates to children

[Anonymous]

FWIW, many practicing Catholics have been against Trump since forever. He doesn’t represent faith or morality at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Catholics pick and choose what they want to follow. Jesus would not have been for racism or deporting people, but people can rationalize anything.

Right, I definitely get that and see it every day, but this question was more specifically about the pope being infallible and what that means for Catholics who support Trump. It's one thing (in my mind) for a politician to say he is in favor of deportation, and a Christian finding a way to rationalize that by taking a quote from scripture out of context (or at least out of context in my personal opinion). But to me this seems more akin to Trump saying "stop following Jesus and follow me instead" or something- something that you really can't rationalize if you are devout. I thought the pope telling us that we need to not support these things meant that Catholics really had to just do what the pope said, because the pope was infallible. But like I said, I don't know enough about it, and was interested in an honest answer from a Catholic who knows more. I don't even want to argue I just want to learn.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Is it more nuanced than this?

Yes, the Pope is only infallible when he speaks ex cathedra or from the chair. That's exceedingly rare. The last time was in 1950.

Other pronouncements, particularly those in encyclicals, are generally viewed as binding on Catholic practice.

There are Catholic doctrines which apply here. One is the doctrine of a just war, which you can read about here:

https://www.milarch.org/catholic-teaching-on-peace/

What Pope Leo is saying is that Trump's war in Iran doesn't satisfy these conditions and thus it is an immoral war.

Hope that helps.

Thank you! This is the info I was looking for! I guess I had heard that "the pope is infallible" and took that as more of a blanket statement than it is. Appreciate it.

[Anonymous]

When the Ayatollah was killed, for Shiite muslims, that was close to the equivalent of killing the Pope would be for Catholics. Even people outside Iran who are Shiites were in mourning over that. He was a political figure but also a spiritual leader so that's why it caused a lot of uproar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^Not to mention LBGTQ++ and transgenderism being endorsed, especially when relates to children

Yeah, because F those kids right? It should be celebrated kids today have an outlet vs how horribly they were treated before.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:FWIW, many practicing Catholics have been against Trump since forever. He doesn’t represent faith or morality at all.

Not many that I know. My Catholic in laws and all their church friends are super maga. In Northern Va too, not some small town.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Catholics pick and choose what they want to follow. Jesus would not have been for racism or deporting people, but people can rationalize anything.

Indeed. Jesus would not have been in favor of abortion or lawlessness, but the Pope remained silent when those things were condoned.

Why would the pope have been meeting with David Axelrod, a Jew, if not for political reasons?

Can you provide some evidence that Jesus wouldn't have been pro-choice? The Bible certainly doesn't say that.

I'm a Catholic who talks with and meets with people of other religions. I'm not sure why meeting with someone who is Jewish would be suspicious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Catholics pick and choose what they want to follow. Jesus would not have been for racism or deporting people, but people can rationalize anything.

Indeed. Jesus would not have been in favor of abortion or lawlessness, but the Pope remained silent when those things were condoned.

Why would the pope have been meeting with David Axelrod, a Jew, if not for political reasons?

Can you provide some evidence that Jesus wouldn't have been pro-choice? The Bible certainly doesn't say that.

I'm a Catholic who talks with and meets with people of other religions. I'm not sure why meeting with someone who is Jewish would be suspicious.

The Catholic Church is 100% unequivocally anti abortion.

No offense, but you're not on the same level as the Pope. Therefore, it's reasonable to question why a Jewish Democratic operative would be consulting with the Pope for any reason other than politics. They weren't chilling at a backyard BBQ sharing pics of their recent vacations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Catholics pick and choose what they want to follow. Jesus would not have been for racism or deporting people, but people can rationalize anything.

Like all people.