Why is Cesar Milan now so unpopular? I wish I’d tried his techniques

[Anonymous]

with a rescue I adopted some years back that we were unable to train to be less reactive and we had to BE.

But I see people online losing their minds over him.

Why?

[Anonymous]

Same reason Ferber went out when "gentle parenting" came in, which is also why FAFO parenting is coming in as gentle parenting leaves: Trends shift.

The latest trend is pet "behaviorists", a newer profession that claims to have some scientific backing, but doesn't have the science and facts to really back any claims of superiority. People fall all over themselves to accept medical authority and veterinary medicine is mastering how to capitalize on that. "gentle" methods make people feel good, but they're not always the most effective.

Cesar Milan isn't a vet, doesn't have a behaviorist credential, and doesn't meet the same "vibe check" that's currently trending. He has more aggressive methods, and preaches an out-of-fashion pack dynamic model. Mostly, he's just old news.

At some point, everything old will be new again and we'll cycle back to similar training methods to his. A good trainer uses whatever method(s) work. Any trainer, vet, breeder, etc. preaching the gospel of one, limited modality should be considered a red flag.

[Anonymous]

I recently re-watched some old episodes of his show. He is pretty incredible with animals. He is very attuned to their cues and very good at using his own body language and handling to de-escalate reactive dogs.

But….I don’t think his experience + intuition based approach can be easily replicated by easier people unless their dogs have much milder problems. The average dog owner can definitely benefit from his general advice - exercise your dog, show them calm leadership, etc. - but dogs with severe problems cannot be magically cured. It takes incredible amounts of expertise, time and effort to have a chance at being successful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I recently re-watched some old episodes of his show. He is pretty incredible with animals. He is very attuned to their cues and very good at using his own body language and handling to de-escalate reactive dogs.

But….I don’t think his experience + intuition based approach can be easily replicated by easier people unless their dogs have much milder problems. The average dog owner can definitely benefit from his general advice - exercise your dog, show them calm leadership, etc. - but dogs with severe problems cannot be magically cured. It takes incredible amounts of expertise, time and effort to have a chance at being successful.

Who asked for that?

Fwiw we tried very pricey trainers and behaviors with our reactive dog bc that’s what everyone said to do and it was a waste. Ultimately we had to almost totally isolate the dog- which is what it seems many people do with their reactive dogs- avoid triggers- and it only made things more progressively worse

[Anonymous]

I watched him handle an aggressive dog going after another dog in a video today. And it was so interesting

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I recently re-watched some old episodes of his show. He is pretty incredible with animals. He is very attuned to their cues and very good at using his own body language and handling to de-escalate reactive dogs.

But….I don’t think his experience + intuition based approach can be easily replicated by easier people unless their dogs have much milder problems. The average dog owner can definitely benefit from his general advice - exercise your dog, show them calm leadership, etc. - but dogs with severe problems cannot be magically cured. It takes incredible amounts of expertise, time and effort to have a chance at being successful.

Who asked for that?

Fwiw we tried very pricey trainers and behaviors with our reactive dog bc that’s what everyone said to do and it was a waste. Ultimately we had to almost totally isolate the dog- which is what it seems many people do with their reactive dogs- avoid triggers- and it only made things more progressively worse

Right, that was my point. Cesar makes it look easy to fix these things but it is not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I recently re-watched some old episodes of his show. He is pretty incredible with animals. He is very attuned to their cues and very good at using his own body language and handling to de-escalate reactive dogs.

But….I don’t think his experience + intuition based approach can be easily replicated by easier people unless their dogs have much milder problems. The average dog owner can definitely benefit from his general advice - exercise your dog, show them calm leadership, etc. - but dogs with severe problems cannot be magically cured. It takes incredible amounts of expertise, time and effort to have a chance at being successful.

Who asked for that?

Fwiw we tried very pricey trainers and behaviors with our reactive dog bc that’s what everyone said to do and it was a waste. Ultimately we had to almost totally isolate the dog- which is what it seems many people do with their reactive dogs- avoid triggers- and it only made things more progressively worse

Right, that was my point. Cesar makes it look easy to fix these things but it is not.

Well I wouldn’t know because I didn’t use them. Everyone said his techniques were ‘abusive’

[Anonymous]

You do realize that stuff is carefully edited for television, right. It is entertainment not advice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You do realize that stuff is carefully edited for television, right. It is entertainment not advice.

+1

Its not 2010 anymore.

[Anonymous]

His techniques work but people hate acknowledging that dogs are pack animals and not humans. Scientists have studied dog behavior for many years and fundamentally they think and understand differently than humans. Cesar approaches training and dogs the way a mother or leader dog would. It’s not always pretty but it’s what happens in the natural world. He is also very intuned to subtle dog signals like hackles, ear direction, body positioning, facial tightness, etc to be able to see what is about to happen and stops it, or tries to, before it does. He encourages good behavior, not bad and always gives the dog a purpose or job. Humans don’t always want to hear this or like to think their dog doesn’t need a job or purpose. This is where you can get a lot of bad behaviors, fears, or anxieties. We would rather medicate and perhaps send away to board and trains rather than educate ourselves on rearing a dog. So enter the world of strictly positive and force free trainers. Not all bad in my opinion, but in another camp. I’ve done years of dog training with trainers from all sides of the training spectrum. The best in my opinion are the balanced ones and understand that a dog, no matter what size and how cute, is a dog, and to have a great relationship with them, we need to approach them as a dog and not a human. But I guess until humans realize they might be a little broken too, we will break some dogs in the process.

[Anonymous]

He’s been bit more than a few times for his methods. They are dangerous for Joe dog owner to try to replicate on their own (hence the warning that was at the beginning of episodes)

It can be effective if done well, but it’s really dangerous if done poorly. No one is going to make things worse by feeding a treat at the wrong time, but they could potentially make things really bad with an improperly timed correction.

I’m not against punishment in dog training, but I think it’s best left to the professionals. I teach my clients only +R to keep everyone as safe as possible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:He’s been bit more than a few times for his methods. They are dangerous for Joe dog owner to try to replicate on their own (hence the warning that was at the beginning of episodes)

It can be effective if done well, but it’s really dangerous if done poorly. No one is going to make things worse by feeding a treat at the wrong time, but they could potentially make things really bad with an improperly timed correction.

I’m not against punishment in dog training, but I think it’s best left to the professionals. I teach my clients only +R to keep everyone as safe as possible.

This attitude is why we have SO many ignorant owners and crappily trained dogs. Training a dog isn't that hard. If you're not willing to learn how to understand your animal and train it, you shouldn't own animals. +R only leads to the same sort of spoilage as "gentle parenting". It's one tool. You'll need many. If you're not willing to acquire the whole set, pet sit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You do realize that stuff is carefully edited for television, right. It is entertainment not advice.

+1

Its not 2010 anymore.

It is advice though. And obviously it’s edited. That doesn’t mean it’s not effective training

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:He’s been bit more than a few times for his methods. They are dangerous for Joe dog owner to try to replicate on their own (hence the warning that was at the beginning of episodes)

It can be effective if done well, but it’s really dangerous if done poorly. No one is going to make things worse by feeding a treat at the wrong time, but they could potentially make things really bad with an improperly timed correction.

I’m not against punishment in dog training, but I think it’s best left to the professionals. I teach my clients only +R to keep everyone as safe as possible.

I totally disagree with this. The over professionalization of dog ownership is not good

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:His techniques work but people hate acknowledging that dogs are pack animals and not humans. Scientists have studied dog behavior for many years and fundamentally they think and understand differently than humans. Cesar approaches training and dogs the way a mother or leader dog would. It’s not always pretty but it’s what happens in the natural world. He is also very intuned to subtle dog signals like hackles, ear direction, body positioning, facial tightness, etc to be able to see what is about to happen and stops it, or tries to, before it does. He encourages good behavior, not bad and always gives the dog a purpose or job. Humans don’t always want to hear this or like to think their dog doesn’t need a job or purpose. This is where you can get a lot of bad behaviors, fears, or anxieties. We would rather medicate and perhaps send away to board and trains rather than educate ourselves on rearing a dog. So enter the world of strictly positive and force free trainers. Not all bad in my opinion, but in another camp. I’ve done years of dog training with trainers from all sides of the training spectrum. The best in my opinion are the balanced ones and understand that a dog, no matter what size and how cute, is a dog, and to have a great relationship with them, we need to approach them as a dog and not a human. But I guess until humans realize they might be a little broken too, we will break some dogs in the process.

It has nothing to do with understanding that dogs are pack animals. It has to do with the fact that humans are themselves undisciplined, so they have a hard time disciplining others. Humans are destroying both themselves and dogs.