In house Comp for lawyers relative to firms

[Anonymous]

The "what if laid off" from in house thread made me think.

I have been in house for most of my career--22 years in house and about 5 at firms before that and 1 in government.

I noticed when I went in house at first after the law firms the comp was roughly the same as "of counsel" at firms.

Now there seems to be a huge difference--the law firm salaries exploded and the in house did not.

Thoughts? Is this a right read? What can we do about it.

I think of counsel at most big law is probably around 450 (pre bonus) and call it another 50k bonus. Is that right.

Whereas most in house is in the 200s with bonus. I would be like mid 200s with say 325-340 all in with cash bonus.

[Anonymous]

Yes - that's the right read. Take a look at indeed.com for posted in-house positions. You'll see a range of salaries offered, but they typically fall in the $120k - $250k per year in salary depending on the size of the company and experience required (usually asking for at least 3-5 years of experience). Starting salary for a 1st year associate at a large firm is now at the top end of that scale - $225k. That doesn't capture bonuses, 401k match, hours worked, etc. but there's no question that law firm salaries have outpaced in-house comp packages. I think you'd be doing quite well if you have an in-house position that pays $500k in comp and bonuses - that's what 27 year old kids who are 6 years out of law school are making at firms.

[Anonymous]

It took 10 years of being in house for my all in comp to exceed $400K and 7 years before my base exceeded $200K. In house comp has definitely not kept pace with big law. I think there will be a reckoning at law firms soon and we’ll see the ranks of associates shrink dramatically as AI takes over more and more low-level legal work.

[Anonymous]

What can we do about it? LOL. Guess you could hire cheaper forms as outside counsel.

Meanwhile as an ex-Big Law now govt lawyer with 20 years experience in a highly technical area and no support (from junior lawyers or paralegals) I get paid less than a first year Big Law associate.

[Anonymous]

I think your take is right. But here’s the thing. In house is easier. You aren’t competing for work - it’s just there. And, at least for me, it’s a lot less hours. Way better work - life balance.

[Anonymous]

Yep.

15 years of experience, 10 years at a firm, 5 years in house. My in house comp all in is probably $350-375K when bonus, stock and 401k matching is accounted for. I'd be making $500-700k at a firm depending on if I was on a reduced schedule or not.

But I'm not panicking when I haven't checked emails for 1-2 hours and when things are quiet I don't worry about making my hours.

Firms have raised their billing rates so much that clients now expect unreasonable availability and response times. And from what o can

[Anonymous]

I made $450k as an of counsel in Biglaw 15 years ago. So I think your numbers are low.

[Anonymous]

PP. Hit post too soon.

From
What I can tell, making partner used to mean you could "relax" a bit - now it's just more and more work...

[Anonymous]

My all-in in-house comp is slightly above $500k. I know several more senior in-house lawyers who make 700k+ at large companies, but they are working nearly as much as they would be if they were at a law firm and have to deal with significantly more BS corporate managerial responsibilities. But I know way more in-house lawyers who make significantly less than I do, so overall in-house comp mostly sucks, particularly in comparison to BigLaw.

[Anonymous]

I guess I’m doing better than most in house. I’ll make $530k this year. Do you guys not get some kind of long term incentive? I was making $350k or so the first few years in house, but once I had vested into the long term incentive plan, that went up quite a bit.

[Anonymous]

Another inhouse lawyer here. I have 7 years of BigLaw followed by 13 years inhouse. I manage 6 lawyers and two paralegals and report to GC. Total pay with 401k match and bonus and everything is ~$450k. It isn’t superb b/c workload is fairly heavy and I’m in an expensive area on coast. Generally agree with all the posts above.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think your take is right. But here’s the thing. In house is easier. You aren’t competing for work - it’s just there. And, at least for me, it’s a lot less hours. Way better work - life balance.

Agree on OP re pay differential.

But my work life balance is much better. It can be company dependent, but if I was having to work biglaw hours I would just move back to get that pay scale.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think your take is right. But here’s the thing. In house is easier. You aren’t competing for work - it’s just there. And, at least for me, it’s a lot less hours. Way better work - life balance.

Until you get laid off or the company goes under. Or your boss is never leaving so there is no chance of a promotion.

All of the above sent my DH back to a law firm. He didn’t actually find in-house stable at all.

He’s a partner at a midsize which is more sane than big law, at least his is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The "what if laid off" from in house thread made me think.

I have been in house for most of my career--22 years in house and about 5 at firms before that and 1 in government.

I noticed when I went in house at first after the law firms the comp was roughly the same as "of counsel" at firms.

Now there seems to be a huge difference--the law firm salaries exploded and the in house did not.

Thoughts? Is this a right read? What can we do about it.

I think of counsel at most big law is probably around 450 (pre bonus) and call it another 50k bonus. Is that right.

Whereas most in house is in the 200s with bonus. I would be like mid 200s with say 325-340 all in with cash bonus.

I started in big law and it always seemed to me that a good (mid-level) in house job's salary was pegged to the current first year salary at the Cravath scale. Obviously GCs would earn more but everyone who left the firm to go in house took a pay cut.

I'm in house now and make 210 -- I just looked up the current scale and it seems I've fallen behind!

[Anonymous]

In-house people, how many of you can work remotely, and how often?