Mainstream public middle school for AuDHDer?

[Anonymous]

My AuDHDer with low-level anxiety is in 6th grade and doing very well in a very small SN school. They would be happy to keep him there but also feel he is ready to grow more through a more mainstream environment and harder academics. We agree, although it has also been nice feeling relaxed and secure there for a few years.

We moved him out of public school in late elementary because it was not going well. He was doing fine academically but couldn't deal with the ambiguity of rules and lack of structure. He became friends with kids who were constantly goofing around and being disruptive, and he got involved in a few groups that were being aggressive towards each other. We were very concerned about his behavior at school and at home, as he was becoming angry all the time, being explosive when frustrated (despite never having been before), and sneaking around to get whatever he wanted (candy, screen time).

Therapy and the new school and time have really, really helped. We know we can't continue to coddle him (and he is getting bored at his current school), but we are scared of the alternatives because we don't want a situation like before!

We have two options - a mainstream private that is smallish but quite a bit larger than his current school (going from about 10 kids in 6th grade to about 50 at the private school), vs a medium-sized public (about 230 kids in 6th). The public would be in our neighborhood and walkable and has sports and clubs. It's supposed to be a "good school," but our elementary was also (however, we have since moved, so this is a totally different school district). The private is pretty rigorous academically and has sports and clubs but is not close by. He thrives on peer relationships and independence and would LOVE to be back in public school, but he also doesn't realize how bad things were and why we had to move him out. He recently said, "Remember how I went like a month without showering in 4th grade?" Now he showers every day, but it was a huge battle back then. He doesn't remember and can't explain why. He was clearly seeking to control things to feel more secure back then.

Is there a hope for a situation where a public school might work for a kid like this? Has anyone had a kid who has been successful in that setting? The value of the private is that it's smaller and we would probably have better teacher communication and more supervision over who he hangs out with, since we would have to drive him to any meetups. But since it's farther away, I envision us being less involved as parents in volunteering and PTA, etc.

I should also note that he does not really present obviously as having autism. On the one hand, this can make it easier to "blend in" with peers, but it creates its own problems when he doesn't fully grasp social situations, and teachers often "read" him as simply misbehaving when he may actually not understand or be too overwhelmed to comply in the moment.

[Anonymous]

I would not move him since he’s doing so well where he’s at.

[Anonymous]

At public MS, plan for the following to get worse:
-teachers misreading him
-anger and explosiveness
-sneaking candy, screen time
-gap between peers' pragmatic and expressive language and his own

I would sit down with his current school to find out whether any differentiation can be can be done to address the boredom.

[Anonymous]

OP here. Sigh, yes, I know those things are going to be a major risk... I guess I'm hoping maybe his maturity and our own awareness will help, but I know this is a bit of a pipe dream.

Either way, he has pretty much no high school options like his current school, so he will need to move to a somewhat larger and mainstream school in 9th regardless. I worry he won't be ready at all socially or academically if he stays where he is now. His academic progress has pretty much stagnated there, and he's a very smart kid. It is also a very small environment, and he would thrive with opportunities to meet kids and do school-sponsored activities (which the school doesn't offer now).

He's a good kid but needs people to take his mistakes lightly. He's very sensitive to judgment, but instead of changing when he notices people are judging his (sometimes absurd and inappropriate behavior), he can get defensive and go into blame mode. I could see this being a risk in either situation, although he and we have also done a lot of work on coping skills over the past few years. On the other hand, he is also feeling like it's unfair that he can't be in a more maintenance environment because he sees neighborhood kids he knows going to bigger schools with more science and math and music and sports options, and I could see his getting angrier from that, too.

[Anonymous]

My DC has ADHD only, but that comes with some social challenges also. The PEERS program was recommended to us and it is also (probably even more) recommended for autistic teens. I also find the books and work of Michelle Garcia Winner of Social Thinking useful.

If your DC goes back to public MS, it might help to do a social skills work over the summer and to enter school with a 1-pager he (or you) can give to teachers to explain her social communication issues/need. Also, even if you don't end up at public, you should ask for an IEP as part of considering your options - you want to know before you move back what support and accommodations he will be provided.

I would also think about a therapist. Middle school is the age when kids start having a harder time talking to parents about friendship issues, and it is always hard for a teen to receive social coaching from a parent without perceiving it as control or pressure to succeed in some way.

How is your kid at self-advocacy? All kids legally deserve privacy about their diagnoses, but TBH, part of growing up is being able to say "this is the authentic me" and part of that is autism and needing things in school and social relationships that are atypical.

I would also ask the school what they mean by "ready for harder academics"? Have you had an assessment that includes IQ? Some autistic and/or ADHD kids are quite bright, and being in (an appropriately) challenging environment is educating to their strengths and interests - things that they will rely on in adolescence and are important to the ADHD aspect of motivation. IMO public and private of different kinds of "challenging" academic environments.

[Anonymous]

I honestly don't see a mainstream public middle working for the kid you describe. Maybe for high school when the other kids have had a chance to mature and not be struggling themselves with social skills. Driving to the other private seems like MUCH less hassle than dealing with a poor fit public.

You seem like a great mom, OP. I love how you describe your kid with love, compassion, and clarity.

[Anonymous]

My kid, similar to yours it sounds like, is in a public MS and it has been horrible. He is completely disengaged from the academics because of mild bullying due to his ADHD. He often called SPED (special ed) and the administrators don't know how to manage his emotions when he gets frustrated or upset. I do not recommend public MS.

[Anonymous]

My ADHD/ASD kid did most of his K-12 in MCPS, with an IEP, then a 504. Now in college.

In middle school, he was part of the North Bethesda MD GTLD program (gifted, talented and learning disabled). Mainstreamed but in classes with trained teacher and paraeducators, with a dedicated resource class full of kids like him. It was WONDERFUL, mainly because the teachers were understanding.

In high school, he went to Walter Johnson. The pandemic did a number on his peer socialization, from which he's only now barely recovering, as a college freshman. He became very isolated and essentially spent all his high school years doing his homework. Which got him an extremely high GPA and a dozen APs, so good for college admissions! But zero friends.

There was no bullying and the IEP teams in both schools were excellent and always ready to cater to his needs.

[Anonymous]

We have a kid currently in middle school who sounds fairly similar. He is at his second public middle school. Last year he went to our neighborhood school. It was not the disaster I had feared. The wider group of kids got him away from the kids from his elementary schoo and helped him have a fresh start. We were proactive with teachers but slowly his school work went off the rails and then he had a few incidents of acting out in school.

For this year, we switched him to a special autism program at another public middle school. He is in general ed or co-taught classy but has social skills and executive function classes within the program. He also has a case manager who helps with communication serves as his go to person for issues at school.

I would suggest at least talking to your middle school ( or the central office) about what programs and support they have for kids like your son. That said, if we could find an affordable private school that would accept our kid within a reasonable commute, we would probably go private.

[Anonymous]

OP here. You are all so helpful. Really, this is probably the most helpful DCUM post I've ever had/seen, and I have been posting periodically for years! (I particularly appreciate the PP who said I was doing a good job trying as a mom - we don't hear that enough, and I tend to internalize it when he struggles, so this was a huge compliment).

It sounds like the consensus is that public is not so awesome and option... Do you think that was mostly the size that was the issue? Could the small mainstream private work, or do you think that's likely to have the same issues? It's main benefit is that it is smaller and that they sort of have to be more responsive to parents as a private school. But it isn't set up with explicit social learning/EF coaching, etc, and although they seem responsive (we have a meeting later this week to learn more), they aren't going to have an IEP for him like public would (albeit, the IEP is unlikely to address the main issues). I was thinking if he were in public, he would be home earlier and we'd also have more resources to devote to outside therapies. We will definitely continue regular therapy, as it has been a big help, but maybe also try for a social skills or EF outside support?

Unfortunately, my sense is that the autism supports public has are for kids with more academic needs and supports than mine. I don't know that they would be the right fit, but we can look into it. There is a smaller charter school that could be a possibility, too, but we missed the lottery deadline because we weren't thinking of moving him at the time. It's hard because he doesn't think he has any particular needs and hates the idea of being "different."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I honestly don't see a mainstream public middle working for the kid you describe. Maybe for high school when the other kids have had a chance to mature and not be struggling themselves with social skills. Driving to the other private seems like MUCH less hassle than dealing with a poor fit public.

You seem like a great mom, OP. I love how you describe your kid with love, compassion, and clarity.

I'm a middle school special education teacher at a public school and I completely agree with this PP. I would never say so if this was not an anonymous forum. We are stretched too thin and dealing with a lot of very serious behavior issues without enough support. Unfortunately a kid like OP's could fall through the cracks easily. I see it happen every day.

[Anonymous]

Yup, I don't see public being a great fit. And what you say about the other private school doesn't really fill me with confidence either, plus the distance... Are there any private schools you could look into that have more suitable EF and social programming for him? Because sometimes mainstream privates will say what you want to hear, but they don't actually have staff with the right skill set to meet your son's needs. And if it's a poor fit and things go badly and they decide they want you to leave, that could be quite upsetting for your son (and you).

I would see if you can stay at your current school for another year and find ways to improve the academics. And work hard in therapy on accepting "difference" and EF and social skills. Honestly I would rather have him enter 9th grade having mastered those things than having learned academic content. Because academic content can be made up more easily.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Sigh, yes, I know those things are going to be a major risk... I guess I'm hoping maybe his maturity and our own awareness will help, but I know this is a bit of a pipe dream.

Either way, he has pretty much no high school options like his current school, so he will need to move to a somewhat larger and mainstream school in 9th regardless. I worry he won't be ready at all socially or academically if he stays where he is now. His academic progress has pretty much stagnated there, and he's a very smart kid. It is also a very small environment, and he would thrive with opportunities to meet kids and do school-sponsored activities (which the school doesn't offer now).

He's a good kid but needs people to take his mistakes lightly. He's very sensitive to judgment, but instead of changing when he notices people are judging his (sometimes absurd and inappropriate behavior), he can get defensive and go into blame mode. I could see this being a risk in either situation, although he and we have also done a lot of work on coping skills over the past few years. On the other hand, he is also feeling like it's unfair that he can't be in a more maintenance environment because he sees neighborhood kids he knows going to bigger schools with more science and math and music and sports options, and I could see his getting angrier from that, too.

The bolded about emotions really rings true for my ADHD family members and there is a lot written about how emotional dysregulation and rejection sensitive dysphoria are key parts of ADHD. In our family medication has been tremendously helpful for this - some take zoloft, some take strattera. It makes responding appropriately to criticism (whether constructive or not), much easier. (Other benefits as well).

I disagree with others that say public school is better as a blanket statement. It is a very fact-specific analysis. I have seen some terrible, discriminatory teachers, and I have seen the same at privates. It will happen everywhere. Sadly. I think it's better to enter a new school in MS and get stabilized rather than 9th grade when grades are important.

[Anonymous]

OP, you said you pulled out of public in late elementary. And now is 6th grade. How long has it been in the current school? 1-2 years?

I think it's wishful thinking to think that now that things got better he can go to a public. No, things are better because he is not in public.

Also, 6th grade is old enough to explain his own differences to him and to coach explicitly for social situations/skills.

[Anonymous]

OP here. Yikes on the middle school teacher who thinks the private is best - that's sad (but thank you for your honest perspective on this).

With regard to meds and ADHD, this is something we have recently been considering, and I do wonder if it might help him succeed better in a mainstream environment. Unfortunately, we won't know until we try and probably need to make a decision sooner than we will know. The reason we haven't tried them earlier is a long and semi unrelated story, so I won't go into it, but I do think that may (or may not) support his school performance in the future.

As for it being wishful thinking that he is doing better and can go back into public... Yes, you might be right, and I wonder this myself. On the other hand, the school itself kind of thinks of itself as a place that supports kids in moving back into mainstream, so I don't think it's entirely unlikely. He has been there for 2.5 years, but it feels like a really long time for some reason. I think it's because it's such a small school. Unfortunately, he just doesn't really have much of a trajectory forward there, and I think we all know it. He could probably do another year, but that would mean moving schools for 8th, which would be even tougher than 7th.

We have a meeting with the private school this week, so maybe we'll have a better sense of what they are thinking soon. Similarly to what one PP said, I am wondering if it's better to coddle him more so he is all ready to walk into high school and is more mature at that point - or if we should push it now and give the mainstream private or the public a try. I'm leaning toward the public being just too much of a stretch, but I still think the private has potential.