Volleyball club- recap and thoughts

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:my kiddoe's BFF was on Academy last year and tried out there/MOCO this year and hands-down chose Academy. Kiddoe got much better over the past year and loves the environment.

OMG, there's the parent of an Academy player's BFF! We are missing a couple of grandparents, uncles / aunts, and some distant relatives who live overseas to testify just how great Academy is.

I think you are suggesting that there's sock puppeting going on. I'm pretty sure that there are three of us parents posting (could be two, could be four, but my guess is three). The "downside" of last years 13U team is pretty obvious -- they got crushed repeatedly! But I think they won at least once, they came close a bunch of times, and most of the girls learned a lot, made some friends, and had fun. My kid did clinics at three other clubs, but really felt strongly about returning to her Academy team, so that's where we landed. It's also not far from our house for practices, so that is a major win for me! A PP posted about the Coach starting the season warning the girls that she was putting them in with better teams for tournaments, so they should expect to lose a lot, but also to learn a lot. I appreciated that honesty and the philosophy that there's often a lot to learn in losing. I'm hoping this year will have some more wins, but so long as my kid is having fun and learning the sport, I'm fine with it either way. My kid met two girls at the try-outs that she thought were really nice, so she's hoping they join! If you're already scouting your spot on the Nebraska team, it's probably not for you, though.

Finally an Academy parent admitting that not everything was just perfect. This is a bit more believable than all the other posts, including the BFF post that was simply hilarious. I have nothing against Academy and I understand why the club owner is trying hard to oversell. However, the world of volleyball is really small and you keep bumping into players from other clubs the whole summer. A lot of posts here are simply misleading and in conflict with what I learned from Academy 13 players. I don't want to explain the circumstances because those players may have to return to Academy if they don't get offers from other clubs they are trying out for. But the picture is way less rosy than painted even by this last post.

Without sharing too much info because of the potential impact, we had the same experience as you on the older team. Same message of compete against the best, lose a lot, etc. We certainly competed against the best on day 1 of tournaments, by day 3 we were competing against teams below CHRVA's average level. Nothing against the club either, more options are good, its just oversold.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

This wasn’t our experience at Moco. DD started out in court three but moved to court 2 quickly then to court 1 soon after. She was given an offer that night. I assume they recognized her from the clinics she did with them in the fall. She only tried out at clubs that “know” her otherwise how else do you stand out?

I am the PP you quoted above. Congratulations to your DD for getting a Moco offer! It is great that she was able to stand out. Knowing my DD's level, I was not hoping that she would make the first, maybe not even the 2nd Moco team. I was thinking she may have had a chance to make their 3rd team. I wish they moved her - even temporarily - on the second court to see her playing with better players. They could have moved her back to the 3rd court if she didn't have the skills, but - at least - I could not complain that they never gave her a shot. A few coaches knew her from Moco clinics (including pre-tryouts), but we couldn't do the fall program. I feel like they knew all along that she won't make a team and simply discarded her on the 3rd court without even pretending they were interested. This experience is going to save us a lot of money in the future because we will never do Moco clinics ever again.

Did you or your DD ask the MoCo coaches during the pre tryout clinic she attended whether she was good enough to make their teams? My DD attended the 16U-18U clinics and they was a conversation that the coaches offered to have with any player who wanted to stay after. That is definitely one way to save time and money!

We did. They offered advice on things to improve, but they never said she would not have any chance. They actually said they were looking forward to seeing her at the tryouts.

I think it's tough for coaches to tell kids they don't think they are good enough to make a team directly to their face. Much easier to have them come to tryouts and then just not send them an offer. Also, clubs have an incentive to have their tryouts as full as possible. They both get to collect the tryout fees and hedge their bets - they can queue up 4 or 5 second choices to make offers to if their first choice declines their offer.

All of that sucks for you and your DD and I am sorry she didn't at least get a fair shot at showing what she could do on one of the higher courts. Hopefully she found a team that's a good fit.

It's ok, we are back to our previous club. I never expected the coach to tell us "don't even bother to show up" because of all the reason you listed. However, if a kid is trying out, at least pretend to give her a fair shot instead of humiliating her for three hours on the third court with no coaches watching.

We didn't have that experience. We started on the 3s court too. Didn't attend any prep clinics. DD tried out for both U13 & U14. Coaches from all three teams for each age group were on the 3s court at the start in the back by the stage and on the sidelines. We talked to some of the parents watching and some of the players on the 3s court at the start were returning club players. They ran a 6v6 drill to start and then switched to individual passing & hitting drills. For U13 DD got move up during the passing drills ~40 minutes in and stayed on the 2nd court for the rest of the tryout. For U14 she moved up about 50-60 minutes in, and then came back down about halfway through the tryouts. In both tryouts there were a lot of players moved up from the 3rd court and down from the other courts in the first hour or so.

Watching the U14 top court was almost like watching a completely different sport. We went into tryouts thinking she had a shot at 14s, we walked out knowing she didn't. Ended up getting a 3s team waitlist for U13 and no offer for a U14 team.

The hardest part about tryouts at every club we've tried out for is that eventually they have to separate players by ability level. There aren't many times in a 13 years olds life when they get immediate feedback about how someone else views them. If your DD isn't in the upper group at any of those tryouts, its hard for them to handle and often just as hard or harder for parents. We did 4 different clubs and every one of them sorted players. We dealt with some tears after several of them.

Just curious, what's your previous club that you are back at?

Congratulations for getting an offer! I am happy that you had a better experience. I do understand the need to separate the players based on experience. Your DD was at least given a chance to play on the second court before she was sent back to the third court. Mine didn't get that chance. I am not comfortable sharing the club name in this context because it would provide too much identifiable information. My DD wants to continue playing volleyball and I don't want to ruin it for her by having "that parent."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

Weird—I was certain the PP was describing MoJo (with a “J”) but then the back-and-forths that followed kept referencing Moco numerous times so that can’t be a typ-o.

But the “take your money and park you on a lower court where the coaches never look at you” strategy was definitely our mojo experience. We were naive, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

This wasn’t our experience at Moco. DD started out in court three but moved to court 2 quickly then to court 1 soon after. She was given an offer that night. I assume they recognized her from the clinics she did with them in the fall. She only tried out at clubs that “know” her otherwise how else do you stand out?

I am the PP you quoted above. Congratulations to your DD for getting a Moco offer! It is great that she was able to stand out. Knowing my DD's level, I was not hoping that she would make the first, maybe not even the 2nd Moco team. I was thinking she may have had a chance to make their 3rd team. I wish they moved her - even temporarily - on the second court to see her playing with better players. They could have moved her back to the 3rd court if she didn't have the skills, but - at least - I could not complain that they never gave her a shot. A few coaches knew her from Moco clinics (including pre-tryouts), but we couldn't do the fall program. I feel like they knew all along that she won't make a team and simply discarded her on the 3rd court without even pretending they were interested. This experience is going to save us a lot of money in the future because we will never do Moco clinics ever again.

Did you or your DD ask the MoCo coaches during the pre tryout clinic she attended whether she was good enough to make their teams? My DD attended the 16U-18U clinics and they was a conversation that the coaches offered to have with any player who wanted to stay after. That is definitely one way to save time and money!

We did. They offered advice on things to improve, but they never said she would not have any chance. They actually said they were looking forward to seeing her at the tryouts.

I think it's tough for coaches to tell kids they don't think they are good enough to make a team directly to their face. Much easier to have them come to tryouts and then just not send them an offer. Also, clubs have an incentive to have their tryouts as full as possible. They both get to collect the tryout fees and hedge their bets - they can queue up 4 or 5 second choices to make offers to if their first choice declines their offer.

All of that sucks for you and your DD and I am sorry she didn't at least get a fair shot at showing what she could do on one of the higher courts. Hopefully she found a team that's a good fit.

It's ok, we are back to our previous club. I never expected the coach to tell us "don't even bother to show up" because of all the reason you listed. However, if a kid is trying out, at least pretend to give her a fair shot instead of humiliating her for three hours on the third court with no coaches watching.

I completely agree with you on this. At least have some junior coaches or assistant coaches on the 3rd court or the "low court" watching and at least giving some pointers so you feel like you were at least seen and maybe even got a little coaching? But to not even have coaches watching most of the time is such a total waste of time and money.

Just having coaches watching the third court is not enough when most players on the court are close to rec level. In volleyball you depend on the team to pass, set, and hit. Even if you have one of those skills (or more than one), you still need at least one other player to get the ball over the net. That's why the move to the second court becomes important.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:What percentage of those invited to try out clinics are accepted?

That's a question that cannot be answered with the information provided. Every club has a different philosophy for tryout clinics. The best answer would be that it depends on the club. The lower tier clubs would probably send offers to many players that show up at their tryout clinics, but some of their offers will not be accepted. Other clubs can only make offers only to 25% of the players they invited to their tryout clinics. You need to be more specific to receive a more informative answer.

For Mojo?

How many girls were at their invite-only clinics that your DD went to?

Tbh this question isn’t that relevant at mojo. They want to be a stronger club than they are (and good for them!) but unfortunately they have quite figured out how to navigate that road of recruiting slightly stronger players every year without completing alienating potential players during the tryout process.
It’s a fine line.
They try to zero in on strong players with their invite only clinics but honestly they need to widen their net a little because most of those players are attending invite-only for 3-4 clubs. Two years on a row, my DD was iced out of the invite clinics and relegated to the not-top court in tryouts only to be called by mojo on the final day and offered a spot to try to fill in holes on their team.
First year, DD declined because she had already committed elsewhere. Second year, she declined bc just didn’t feel like being an afterthought AGAIN. And it’s kind of sad because she is a stronger player than at least four that they ended up extending offers to eventually. And if they had done a little better job at managing their own expectations while making an effort to make her feel even slightly wanted before the absolute last minute, she would have been happy to play there.
My point is not to bash them for jockeying to get the best players. I completely get that. My point is that if they were more realistic about who actually was attainable, they could make that middle tier feel a little more wanted and then the next year, their win record might look a little more appealing to the top tier player.
Baby steps to club improvement would help in this scenario.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:my kiddoe's BFF was on Academy last year and tried out there/MOCO this year and hands-down chose Academy. Kiddoe got much better over the past year and loves the environment.

OMG, there's the parent of an Academy player's BFF! We are missing a couple of grandparents, uncles / aunts, and some distant relatives who live overseas to testify just how great Academy is.

I think you are suggesting that there's sock puppeting going on. I'm pretty sure that there are three of us parents posting (could be two, could be four, but my guess is three). The "downside" of last years 13U team is pretty obvious -- they got crushed repeatedly! But I think they won at least once, they came close a bunch of times, and most of the girls learned a lot, made some friends, and had fun. My kid did clinics at three other clubs, but really felt strongly about returning to her Academy team, so that's where we landed. It's also not far from our house for practices, so that is a major win for me! A PP posted about the Coach starting the season warning the girls that she was putting them in with better teams for tournaments, so they should expect to lose a lot, but also to learn a lot. I appreciated that honesty and the philosophy that there's often a lot to learn in losing. I'm hoping this year will have some more wins, but so long as my kid is having fun and learning the sport, I'm fine with it either way. My kid met two girls at the try-outs that she thought were really nice, so she's hoping they join! If you're already scouting your spot on the Nebraska team, it's probably not for you, though.

Finally an Academy parent admitting that not everything was just perfect. This is a bit more believable than all the other posts, including the BFF post that was simply hilarious. I have nothing against Academy and I understand why the club owner is trying hard to oversell. However, the world of volleyball is really small and you keep bumping into players from other clubs the whole summer. A lot of posts here are simply misleading and in conflict with what I learned from Academy 13 players. I don't want to explain the circumstances because those players may have to return to Academy if they don't get offers from other clubs they are trying out for. But the picture is way less rosy than painted even by this last post.

I'm one of the other pp's about Academy (the one who mentioned that Coach Amy said that the team was going to lose a lot), and I can only speak about my daughter's experience. She loves Coach Amy and had a great year - the losses were tough of course - but she enjoyed herself and learned a ton. No sock puppeting here.

We were at the same tournaments as Academy a few times (and we are not one of the top teams by any measure). Every time there was a chance to meet them we would come out of the pools in different brackets and we never got to play against them. They had a game once when we had a break and we watched them (because my DD wanted to see one of her friends play). I am just going to say that they were not losing because they were playing against top teams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

This wasn’t our experience at Moco. DD started out in court three but moved to court 2 quickly then to court 1 soon after. She was given an offer that night. I assume they recognized her from the clinics she did with them in the fall. She only tried out at clubs that “know” her otherwise how else do you stand out?

I am the PP you quoted above. Congratulations to your DD for getting a Moco offer! It is great that she was able to stand out. Knowing my DD's level, I was not hoping that she would make the first, maybe not even the 2nd Moco team. I was thinking she may have had a chance to make their 3rd team. I wish they moved her - even temporarily - on the second court to see her playing with better players. They could have moved her back to the 3rd court if she didn't have the skills, but - at least - I could not complain that they never gave her a shot. A few coaches knew her from Moco clinics (including pre-tryouts), but we couldn't do the fall program. I feel like they knew all along that she won't make a team and simply discarded her on the 3rd court without even pretending they were interested. This experience is going to save us a lot of money in the future because we will never do Moco clinics ever again.

Did you or your DD ask the MoCo coaches during the pre tryout clinic she attended whether she was good enough to make their teams? My DD attended the 16U-18U clinics and they was a conversation that the coaches offered to have with any player who wanted to stay after. That is definitely one way to save time and money!

We did. They offered advice on things to improve, but they never said she would not have any chance. They actually said they were looking forward to seeing her at the tryouts.

I think it's tough for coaches to tell kids they don't think they are good enough to make a team directly to their face. Much easier to have them come to tryouts and then just not send them an offer. Also, clubs have an incentive to have their tryouts as full as possible. They both get to collect the tryout fees and hedge their bets - they can queue up 4 or 5 second choices to make offers to if their first choice declines their offer.

All of that sucks for you and your DD and I am sorry she didn't at least get a fair shot at showing what she could do on one of the higher courts. Hopefully she found a team that's a good fit.

It's ok, we are back to our previous club. I never expected the coach to tell us "don't even bother to show up" because of all the reason you listed. However, if a kid is trying out, at least pretend to give her a fair shot instead of humiliating her for three hours on the third court with no coaches watching.

I completely agree with you on this. At least have some junior coaches or assistant coaches on the 3rd court or the "low court" watching and at least giving some pointers so you feel like you were at least seen and maybe even got a little coaching? But to not even have coaches watching most of the time is such a total waste of time and money.

Just having coaches watching the third court is not enough when most players on the court are close to rec level. In volleyball you depend on the team to pass, set, and hit. Even if you have one of those skills (or more than one), you still need at least one other player to get the ball over the net. That's why the move to the second court becomes important.

Pretty much every tryout has some part that is focused on individual skills rather than team skills. How did your DD do in the individual drills like passing and hitting where there was no team playing around her?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

This wasn’t our experience at Moco. DD started out in court three but moved to court 2 quickly then to court 1 soon after. She was given an offer that night. I assume they recognized her from the clinics she did with them in the fall. She only tried out at clubs that “know” her otherwise how else do you stand out?

My daughter started on three and ended on two. Still no emails. Already took another offer but curious that they have not sent anything?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

This wasn’t our experience at Moco. DD started out in court three but moved to court 2 quickly then to court 1 soon after. She was given an offer that night. I assume they recognized her from the clinics she did with them in the fall. She only tried out at clubs that “know” her otherwise how else do you stand out?

I am the PP you quoted above. Congratulations to your DD for getting a Moco offer! It is great that she was able to stand out. Knowing my DD's level, I was not hoping that she would make the first, maybe not even the 2nd Moco team. I was thinking she may have had a chance to make their 3rd team. I wish they moved her - even temporarily - on the second court to see her playing with better players. They could have moved her back to the 3rd court if she didn't have the skills, but - at least - I could not complain that they never gave her a shot. A few coaches knew her from Moco clinics (including pre-tryouts), but we couldn't do the fall program. I feel like they knew all along that she won't make a team and simply discarded her on the 3rd court without even pretending they were interested. This experience is going to save us a lot of money in the future because we will never do Moco clinics ever again.

Did you or your DD ask the MoCo coaches during the pre tryout clinic she attended whether she was good enough to make their teams? My DD attended the 16U-18U clinics and they was a conversation that the coaches offered to have with any player who wanted to stay after. That is definitely one way to save time and money!

We did. They offered advice on things to improve, but they never said she would not have any chance. They actually said they were looking forward to seeing her at the tryouts.

I think it's tough for coaches to tell kids they don't think they are good enough to make a team directly to their face. Much easier to have them come to tryouts and then just not send them an offer. Also, clubs have an incentive to have their tryouts as full as possible. They both get to collect the tryout fees and hedge their bets - they can queue up 4 or 5 second choices to make offers to if their first choice declines their offer.

All of that sucks for you and your DD and I am sorry she didn't at least get a fair shot at showing what she could do on one of the higher courts. Hopefully she found a team that's a good fit.

It's ok, we are back to our previous club. I never expected the coach to tell us "don't even bother to show up" because of all the reason you listed. However, if a kid is trying out, at least pretend to give her a fair shot instead of humiliating her for three hours on the third court with no coaches watching.

I completely agree with you on this. At least have some junior coaches or assistant coaches on the 3rd court or the "low court" watching and at least giving some pointers so you feel like you were at least seen and maybe even got a little coaching? But to not even have coaches watching most of the time is such a total waste of time and money.

Just having coaches watching the third court is not enough when most players on the court are close to rec level. In volleyball you depend on the team to pass, set, and hit. Even if you have one of those skills (or more than one), you still need at least one other player to get the ball over the net. That's why the move to the second court becomes important.

Pretty much every tryout has some part that is focused on individual skills rather than team skills. How did your DD do in the individual drills like passing and hitting where there was no team playing around her?

I didn't ask her because she was too bummed by the whole experience. I would not trust her assessment anyway because kids are not the best at judging their own skills. I already mentioned that she is a rather average player, so I didn't have high expectations. However, I was surprised to see her playing on the third court when I got back to the gym to pick her up from the tryouts. All I got out of her was that she was stuck on the third court from the beginning and she was never given the chance to play on the second court.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What percentage of those invited to try out clinics are accepted?

That's a question that cannot be answered with the information provided. Every club has a different philosophy for tryout clinics. The best answer would be that it depends on the club. The lower tier clubs would probably send offers to many players that show up at their tryout clinics, but some of their offers will not be accepted. Other clubs can only make offers only to 25% of the players they invited to their tryout clinics. You need to be more specific to receive a more informative answer.

For Mojo?

How many girls were at their invite-only clinics that your DD went to?

Tbh this question isn’t that relevant at mojo. They want to be a stronger club than they are (and good for them!) but unfortunately they have quite figured out how to navigate that road of recruiting slightly stronger players every year without completing alienating potential players during the tryout process.
It’s a fine line.
They try to zero in on strong players with their invite only clinics but honestly they need to widen their net a little because most of those players are attending invite-only for 3-4 clubs. Two years on a row, my DD was iced out of the invite clinics and relegated to the not-top court in tryouts only to be called by mojo on the final day and offered a spot to try to fill in holes on their team.
First year, DD declined because she had already committed elsewhere. Second year, she declined bc just didn’t feel like being an afterthought AGAIN. And it’s kind of sad because she is a stronger player than at least four that they ended up extending offers to eventually. And if they had done a little better job at managing their own expectations while making an effort to make her feel even slightly wanted before the absolute last minute, she would have been happy to play there.
My point is not to bash them for jockeying to get the best players. I completely get that. My point is that if they were more realistic about who actually was attainable, they could make that middle tier feel a little more wanted and then the next year, their win record might look a little more appealing to the top tier player.
Baby steps to club improvement would help in this scenario.

I think this is really important for clubs wanting to become more competitive. They spend so much energy courting their top choices that will likely have multiple offers from other clubs, they neglect to give enough attention to the good players who they will likely need to fill out their rosters. I get that they can only give out so many offers at a time, but they could absolutely increase the numbers at invite clinics and make these players not feel like they were a last resort.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

This wasn’t our experience at Moco. DD started out in court three but moved to court 2 quickly then to court 1 soon after. She was given an offer that night. I assume they recognized her from the clinics she did with them in the fall. She only tried out at clubs that “know” her otherwise how else do you stand out?

I am the PP you quoted above. Congratulations to your DD for getting a Moco offer! It is great that she was able to stand out. Knowing my DD's level, I was not hoping that she would make the first, maybe not even the 2nd Moco team. I was thinking she may have had a chance to make their 3rd team. I wish they moved her - even temporarily - on the second court to see her playing with better players. They could have moved her back to the 3rd court if she didn't have the skills, but - at least - I could not complain that they never gave her a shot. A few coaches knew her from Moco clinics (including pre-tryouts), but we couldn't do the fall program. I feel like they knew all along that she won't make a team and simply discarded her on the 3rd court without even pretending they were interested. This experience is going to save us a lot of money in the future because we will never do Moco clinics ever again.

Did you or your DD ask the MoCo coaches during the pre tryout clinic she attended whether she was good enough to make their teams? My DD attended the 16U-18U clinics and they was a conversation that the coaches offered to have with any player who wanted to stay after. That is definitely one way to save time and money!

We did. They offered advice on things to improve, but they never said she would not have any chance. They actually said they were looking forward to seeing her at the tryouts.

I think it's tough for coaches to tell kids they don't think they are good enough to make a team directly to their face. Much easier to have them come to tryouts and then just not send them an offer. Also, clubs have an incentive to have their tryouts as full as possible. They both get to collect the tryout fees and hedge their bets - they can queue up 4 or 5 second choices to make offers to if their first choice declines their offer.

All of that sucks for you and your DD and I am sorry she didn't at least get a fair shot at showing what she could do on one of the higher courts. Hopefully she found a team that's a good fit.

It's ok, we are back to our previous club. I never expected the coach to tell us "don't even bother to show up" because of all the reason you listed. However, if a kid is trying out, at least pretend to give her a fair shot instead of humiliating her for three hours on the third court with no coaches watching.

I completely agree with you on this. At least have some junior coaches or assistant coaches on the 3rd court or the "low court" watching and at least giving some pointers so you feel like you were at least seen and maybe even got a little coaching? But to not even have coaches watching most of the time is such a total waste of time and money.

Just having coaches watching the third court is not enough when most players on the court are close to rec level. In volleyball you depend on the team to pass, set, and hit. Even if you have one of those skills (or more than one), you still need at least one other player to get the ball over the net. That's why the move to the second court becomes important.

Pretty much every tryout has some part that is focused on individual skills rather than team skills. How did your DD do in the individual drills like passing and hitting where there was no team playing around her?

I didn't ask her because she was too bummed by the whole experience. I would not trust her assessment anyway because kids are not the best at judging their own skills. I already mentioned that she is a rather average player, so I didn't have high expectations. However, I was surprised to see her playing on the third court when I got back to the gym to pick her up from the tryouts. All I got out of her was that she was stuck on the third court from the beginning and she was never given the chance to play on the second court.

Its too bad she didn't get moved up and its really hard for the player. But your earlier posts made it sound like you were there watching the whole time and were upset that she never got the chance to be watched by coaches or play volleyball above a rec level.

In terms of surprise, the level of play at all the higher performing clubs is increasing fast and what was average at one club can fall behind the clubs that are growing quickly. For example, 4-5 years ago there were a number of clubs that had a good level of talent and tended to do very well in tournaments, now they would be considered second or third options for most good players.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

This wasn’t our experience at Moco. DD started out in court three but moved to court 2 quickly then to court 1 soon after. She was given an offer that night. I assume they recognized her from the clinics she did with them in the fall. She only tried out at clubs that “know” her otherwise how else do you stand out?

I am the PP you quoted above. Congratulations to your DD for getting a Moco offer! It is great that she was able to stand out. Knowing my DD's level, I was not hoping that she would make the first, maybe not even the 2nd Moco team. I was thinking she may have had a chance to make their 3rd team. I wish they moved her - even temporarily - on the second court to see her playing with better players. They could have moved her back to the 3rd court if she didn't have the skills, but - at least - I could not complain that they never gave her a shot. A few coaches knew her from Moco clinics (including pre-tryouts), but we couldn't do the fall program. I feel like they knew all along that she won't make a team and simply discarded her on the 3rd court without even pretending they were interested. This experience is going to save us a lot of money in the future because we will never do Moco clinics ever again.

Did you or your DD ask the MoCo coaches during the pre tryout clinic she attended whether she was good enough to make their teams? My DD attended the 16U-18U clinics and they was a conversation that the coaches offered to have with any player who wanted to stay after. That is definitely one way to save time and money!

We did. They offered advice on things to improve, but they never said she would not have any chance. They actually said they were looking forward to seeing her at the tryouts.

I think it's tough for coaches to tell kids they don't think they are good enough to make a team directly to their face. Much easier to have them come to tryouts and then just not send them an offer. Also, clubs have an incentive to have their tryouts as full as possible. They both get to collect the tryout fees and hedge their bets - they can queue up 4 or 5 second choices to make offers to if their first choice declines their offer.

All of that sucks for you and your DD and I am sorry she didn't at least get a fair shot at showing what she could do on one of the higher courts. Hopefully she found a team that's a good fit.

It's ok, we are back to our previous club. I never expected the coach to tell us "don't even bother to show up" because of all the reason you listed. However, if a kid is trying out, at least pretend to give her a fair shot instead of humiliating her for three hours on the third court with no coaches watching.

I completely agree with you on this. At least have some junior coaches or assistant coaches on the 3rd court or the "low court" watching and at least giving some pointers so you feel like you were at least seen and maybe even got a little coaching? But to not even have coaches watching most of the time is such a total waste of time and money.

Just having coaches watching the third court is not enough when most players on the court are close to rec level. In volleyball you depend on the team to pass, set, and hit. Even if you have one of those skills (or more than one), you still need at least one other player to get the ball over the net. That's why the move to the second court becomes important.

Pretty much every tryout has some part that is focused on individual skills rather than team skills. How did your DD do in the individual drills like passing and hitting where there was no team playing around her?

I didn't ask her because she was too bummed by the whole experience. I would not trust her assessment anyway because kids are not the best at judging their own skills. I already mentioned that she is a rather average player, so I didn't have high expectations. However, I was surprised to see her playing on the third court when I got back to the gym to pick her up from the tryouts. All I got out of her was that she was stuck on the third court from the beginning and she was never given the chance to play on the second court.

Its too bad she didn't get moved up and its really hard for the player. But your earlier posts made it sound like you were there watching the whole time and were upset that she never got the chance to be watched by coaches or play volleyball above a rec level.

In terms of surprise, the level of play at all the higher performing clubs is increasing fast and what was average at one club can fall behind the clubs that are growing quickly. For example, 4-5 years ago there were a number of clubs that had a good level of talent and tended to do very well in tournaments, now they would be considered second or third options for most good players.

The coaches told us that we cannot watch, so I dropped her off and I came back to pick her up before the tryouts were over. I was surprised to see that other parents were observing the 3rd court, so I started watching. I only saw the last part of the tryout. She told me that she never moved from the 3rd court - I was not there to see it with my own eyes.

In terms of how I see an average player: she is not average for the club we come from, she is average compared to all the players we see in tournaments, clinics, and club leagues. A lot of parents may be biased about their kids skills (and I may be as well), but she still deserved to be taken from the 3rd court and given a chance on the 2nd court even for 10-15 minutes. It's not too much to ask during a 3 hour tryout.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

This wasn’t our experience at Moco. DD started out in court three but moved to court 2 quickly then to court 1 soon after. She was given an offer that night. I assume they recognized her from the clinics she did with them in the fall. She only tried out at clubs that “know” her otherwise how else do you stand out?

I am the PP you quoted above. Congratulations to your DD for getting a Moco offer! It is great that she was able to stand out. Knowing my DD's level, I was not hoping that she would make the first, maybe not even the 2nd Moco team. I was thinking she may have had a chance to make their 3rd team. I wish they moved her - even temporarily - on the second court to see her playing with better players. They could have moved her back to the 3rd court if she didn't have the skills, but - at least - I could not complain that they never gave her a shot. A few coaches knew her from Moco clinics (including pre-tryouts), but we couldn't do the fall program. I feel like they knew all along that she won't make a team and simply discarded her on the 3rd court without even pretending they were interested. This experience is going to save us a lot of money in the future because we will never do Moco clinics ever again.

Did you or your DD ask the MoCo coaches during the pre tryout clinic she attended whether she was good enough to make their teams? My DD attended the 16U-18U clinics and they was a conversation that the coaches offered to have with any player who wanted to stay after. That is definitely one way to save time and money!

We did. They offered advice on things to improve, but they never said she would not have any chance. They actually said they were looking forward to seeing her at the tryouts.

I think it's tough for coaches to tell kids they don't think they are good enough to make a team directly to their face. Much easier to have them come to tryouts and then just not send them an offer. Also, clubs have an incentive to have their tryouts as full as possible. They both get to collect the tryout fees and hedge their bets - they can queue up 4 or 5 second choices to make offers to if their first choice declines their offer.

All of that sucks for you and your DD and I am sorry she didn't at least get a fair shot at showing what she could do on one of the higher courts. Hopefully she found a team that's a good fit.

It's ok, we are back to our previous club. I never expected the coach to tell us "don't even bother to show up" because of all the reason you listed. However, if a kid is trying out, at least pretend to give her a fair shot instead of humiliating her for three hours on the third court with no coaches watching.

I completely agree with you on this. At least have some junior coaches or assistant coaches on the 3rd court or the "low court" watching and at least giving some pointers so you feel like you were at least seen and maybe even got a little coaching? But to not even have coaches watching most of the time is such a total waste of time and money.

Just having coaches watching the third court is not enough when most players on the court are close to rec level. In volleyball you depend on the team to pass, set, and hit. Even if you have one of those skills (or more than one), you still need at least one other player to get the ball over the net. That's why the move to the second court becomes important.

Pretty much every tryout has some part that is focused on individual skills rather than team skills. How did your DD do in the individual drills like passing and hitting where there was no team playing around her?

I'm not the PP you're talking to, but she pretty much already explained (and she's right) that when most players on the court are playing rec-league level in a skills exercise, like passing/setting/hitting, if all the passes and sets suck, it's very hard to show what you can do with normal passes & sets. So even on the individual skills exercises it really helps to have a coach setting the ball up for the exercise and watching what each girl can do with a well-positioned ball instead of watching everyone flail because most of the balls are impossible to do something impressive with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

This wasn’t our experience at Moco. DD started out in court three but moved to court 2 quickly then to court 1 soon after. She was given an offer that night. I assume they recognized her from the clinics she did with them in the fall. She only tried out at clubs that “know” her otherwise how else do you stand out?

I am the PP you quoted above. Congratulations to your DD for getting a Moco offer! It is great that she was able to stand out. Knowing my DD's level, I was not hoping that she would make the first, maybe not even the 2nd Moco team. I was thinking she may have had a chance to make their 3rd team. I wish they moved her - even temporarily - on the second court to see her playing with better players. They could have moved her back to the 3rd court if she didn't have the skills, but - at least - I could not complain that they never gave her a shot. A few coaches knew her from Moco clinics (including pre-tryouts), but we couldn't do the fall program. I feel like they knew all along that she won't make a team and simply discarded her on the 3rd court without even pretending they were interested. This experience is going to save us a lot of money in the future because we will never do Moco clinics ever again.

Did you or your DD ask the MoCo coaches during the pre tryout clinic she attended whether she was good enough to make their teams? My DD attended the 16U-18U clinics and they was a conversation that the coaches offered to have with any player who wanted to stay after. That is definitely one way to save time and money!

We did. They offered advice on things to improve, but they never said she would not have any chance. They actually said they were looking forward to seeing her at the tryouts.

I think it's tough for coaches to tell kids they don't think they are good enough to make a team directly to their face. Much easier to have them come to tryouts and then just not send them an offer. Also, clubs have an incentive to have their tryouts as full as possible. They both get to collect the tryout fees and hedge their bets - they can queue up 4 or 5 second choices to make offers to if their first choice declines their offer.

All of that sucks for you and your DD and I am sorry she didn't at least get a fair shot at showing what she could do on one of the higher courts. Hopefully she found a team that's a good fit.

It's ok, we are back to our previous club. I never expected the coach to tell us "don't even bother to show up" because of all the reason you listed. However, if a kid is trying out, at least pretend to give her a fair shot instead of humiliating her for three hours on the third court with no coaches watching.

I completely agree with you on this. At least have some junior coaches or assistant coaches on the 3rd court or the "low court" watching and at least giving some pointers so you feel like you were at least seen and maybe even got a little coaching? But to not even have coaches watching most of the time is such a total waste of time and money.

Just having coaches watching the third court is not enough when most players on the court are close to rec level. In volleyball you depend on the team to pass, set, and hit. Even if you have one of those skills (or more than one), you still need at least one other player to get the ball over the net. That's why the move to the second court becomes important.

Pretty much every tryout has some part that is focused on individual skills rather than team skills. How did your DD do in the individual drills like passing and hitting where there was no team playing around her?

I'm not the PP you're talking to, but she pretty much already explained (and she's right) that when most players on the court are playing rec-league level in a skills exercise, like passing/setting/hitting, if all the passes and sets suck, it's very hard to show what you can do with normal passes & sets. So even on the individual skills exercises it really helps to have a coach setting the ball up for the exercise and watching what each girl can do with a well-positioned ball instead of watching everyone flail because most of the balls are impossible to do something impressive with.

What you said at the end was pretty much exactly what we saw. A 6v6 drill to warmup and then the court moved to coach initiated passing drills where the only people contacting the ball were the coach and the passer. Then hitting lines where the coach tossed the ball. Somewhere in there they did some 4v4 scrimmage for a short time. That was the first hour of the tryout. When we moved all the courts were doing the same thing.

If you can pass or hit at a consistent level in an isolated drill like passing or hitting, you probably get moved up. If you can't, you probably get moved down. Most clubs are smart enough to isolate skills in a way that allows them to actually evaluate players, especially at the younger ages where there is a huge variability in basic player skills. Talking with our DD every club we went to did something similar.

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Anonymous wrote:Ironically, the one club clinic where she ended up on the lower court is the club she wants to play for the most. Why? Because the coaches were clear about why there were different courts. The lower court was for skills work with the goal of improving their skill very quickly. The upper court was gameplay for players that already had the skill. And the lower court was staffed and watched by the coaches for DD age group. By the end of the session both courts were running the same scrimmage - the upper court was just running it faster and more consistently. It was the only session where she came out a significantly better player than she was when she went in. It also helped that all the club's players from last year were genuinely welcoming new players into their teams/groups.

I'm sure some players left that gym knowing that they weren't going to make a team with the club. But I don't think any of them could say the club didn't take the time to really try to help them get better.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about MOCO here? We had the same vibe there during the pre-tryout clinics. We had a pretty good experience with MVSA as well (probably the best experience in the way they split the teams, in terms of competitiveness), but some of the MVSA players were really unfriendly. They would cut each other a lot of slack, but they would be pretty mean when "outsiders" would make mistakes on the court.

I seriously doubt OP was talking about MOCO. MOCO can be super dismissive of some players at tryouts and it's pretty obvious to those on the "lower court" that they've already been ruled out, sometimes before anyone's taken a good look at them playing. And our DDs each played one season for MOCO, then never tried out with them again.

That was our experience as well. My DD had a sticker on the number saying to start on court 3 with a bunch of other kids with little experience. She felt like she was in rec league all over again with three touches being the exception rather than the rule. She felt like she was at the same level with the others because she could not find a position to make a difference. When she tried to set, the passes would go too low and at random places. She tried to pass, but the new setters could rarely set. When the setters would eventually set, the ball would be unhittable. She was never given the chance to play with more experienced kids. Most coaches were in the other gym to look at courts 1 and 2. Unlike what they said during the parent meeting, the kids on the lower court never had a chance. I wish I knew she would start on the 3rd court with no chance of moving up - I would have saved some time and money by not even signing up for the MOCO tryouts.

This wasn’t our experience at Moco. DD started out in court three but moved to court 2 quickly then to court 1 soon after. She was given an offer that night. I assume they recognized her from the clinics she did with them in the fall. She only tried out at clubs that “know” her otherwise how else do you stand out?

I am the PP you quoted above. Congratulations to your DD for getting a Moco offer! It is great that she was able to stand out. Knowing my DD's level, I was not hoping that she would make the first, maybe not even the 2nd Moco team. I was thinking she may have had a chance to make their 3rd team. I wish they moved her - even temporarily - on the second court to see her playing with better players. They could have moved her back to the 3rd court if she didn't have the skills, but - at least - I could not complain that they never gave her a shot. A few coaches knew her from Moco clinics (including pre-tryouts), but we couldn't do the fall program. I feel like they knew all along that she won't make a team and simply discarded her on the 3rd court without even pretending they were interested. This experience is going to save us a lot of money in the future because we will never do Moco clinics ever again.

Did you or your DD ask the MoCo coaches during the pre tryout clinic she attended whether she was good enough to make their teams? My DD attended the 16U-18U clinics and they was a conversation that the coaches offered to have with any player who wanted to stay after. That is definitely one way to save time and money!

We did. They offered advice on things to improve, but they never said she would not have any chance. They actually said they were looking forward to seeing her at the tryouts.

I think it's tough for coaches to tell kids they don't think they are good enough to make a team directly to their face. Much easier to have them come to tryouts and then just not send them an offer. Also, clubs have an incentive to have their tryouts as full as possible. They both get to collect the tryout fees and hedge their bets - they can queue up 4 or 5 second choices to make offers to if their first choice declines their offer.

All of that sucks for you and your DD and I am sorry she didn't at least get a fair shot at showing what she could do on one of the higher courts. Hopefully she found a team that's a good fit.

It's ok, we are back to our previous club. I never expected the coach to tell us "don't even bother to show up" because of all the reason you listed. However, if a kid is trying out, at least pretend to give her a fair shot instead of humiliating her for three hours on the third court with no coaches watching.

I completely agree with you on this. At least have some junior coaches or assistant coaches on the 3rd court or the "low court" watching and at least giving some pointers so you feel like you were at least seen and maybe even got a little coaching? But to not even have coaches watching most of the time is such a total waste of time and money.

Just having coaches watching the third court is not enough when most players on the court are close to rec level. In volleyball you depend on the team to pass, set, and hit. Even if you have one of those skills (or more than one), you still need at least one other player to get the ball over the net. That's why the move to the second court becomes important.

Pretty much every tryout has some part that is focused on individual skills rather than team skills. How did your DD do in the individual drills like passing and hitting where there was no team playing around her?

I'm not the PP you're talking to, but she pretty much already explained (and she's right) that when most players on the court are playing rec-league level in a skills exercise, like passing/setting/hitting, if all the passes and sets suck, it's very hard to show what you can do with normal passes & sets. So even on the individual skills exercises it really helps to have a coach setting the ball up for the exercise and watching what each girl can do with a well-positioned ball instead of watching everyone flail because most of the balls are impossible to do something impressive with.

Thank you! I was not even thinking about having a coach setting the ball. All she needed was the chance to play on court 2 for 10-15 minutes. If she was not good enough for court 2 (which I highly doubt), the coaches could have sent her back on court 3. We paid a lot for this tryout and she was not even offered a reasonable opportunity to show what she can do.