Boundary Focus Groups

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When did taking responsibility for your own children become considered "Every man for himself"? We would have liked to have 4 kids, but we knew we could only properly support and educate two. I have neither the time nor inclination to educate somebody else's kids.

This.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I am getting sick of Ward 3 parents suggesting what will work for my Ward 4 family that feeds to Deal. Sure like another MS for Ross and Shepherd will be similar to Deal. BS. Our neighborhood has fed into Deal for generations and I take exception of you being so quick to kick us out. Also, there is already a good MS alternative that you describe, it's called Hardy. Stop trying to sacrifice other neighborhoods because you may be in the chopping block. Fwiw, I do not think any neighborhood will get felt out of Deal, but it's nice to know that you look at us as such outsiders that you graciously allow to attend your school.

Upper Ward 3 parents are so confident that they will be fine. They have already removed Ward 4 schools, except Laffeyette, from the feeder patterns -at least in my focus group.

Well it's a good thing their focus group isn't making decision. Every level I have heard states there will be no change in feeders to Deal. OOB feeder rights is another story. Funny how many of the Ward 3 parents assume that they are the only upper class families that live in DC and they have so much political power because of their income. Their are plenty of families EOTP that earn more than Ward 3, not to mention some are even brown, gasp! Assumptions are a MF.

While, yes, your statement is factually true: there are households in ward 4 that earn more than households in ward 3, it is a meaningless statement. If, instead, you are trying to say something meaningful, like Ward 4 earns almost as much as Ward 3, then you're dead wrong. Not even close.

Ward 3 average HHI: 240,000 (a gain of 17k between 2007 and 2011)
Ward 4 average HHI: 115,000 (a gain of 8k between 2007 and 2011)

Data--emphasis DATA-- from http://www.neighborhoodinfodc.org/profiles.html

I'm not trying to plant my flag atop the family income hill. I'm just trying to root out people spouting completely unsubstantiated things. Especially completely erroneous or, at best, meaningless things.

You are obviously not getting my point. Firstly, most of the million dollar income earners (that raise the average) that live in Ward 4 do not attend DCPS so they will not move away if they don't get their way (as so many Ward 3 parents threaten). Secondly, why don't you measure the incomes of AU Park (specifically the ones that attend public) and those of Colonial Village, Crestwod, Shep Park. You will find the disparity is not that wide. Ward 3 does not have any low income (or even middle income), Ward 4 does as it's geography is large, so averages aren't going to take you that far when proving your point. My point is that the threats that Ward 3 "high income earners" are making is getting tired. These neighborhoods have fed to these schools for generations and a few miles difference is not going to influence change, especially when you're threatening to cut ALL diversity. Please don't mention how many French speaking white people live in Ward 3. So please stop trying to make up this middle school on 16th that will alleviate all your troubles by taking any brown (many rich) kids out of ALL of OUR school. It's not going to happen. The entitlement some posters have is astounding. They speak as of they have been doing EOTP kids a favor by allowing them to be zoned for Deal when they reality is Deal would have closed many years ago due to under enrollment when whites were too afraid to send their kid there.

This is a lazy retort, deserving of only a modicum of effort in response. You asked about HHI in AU Park versus Colonial Village/Shephard Park. If only there was a way to find this out. If only someone had posted the link to a website with this information. If only you tried first to disprove your ignorant hunches before posting.

From the same website as before, HHI in AU Park is 215k (and that's down from 240k in 1999). In Colonial Village/Shep. Park it is 180k. We're talking about a 20% difference, and that's with your cherry-picked neighborhoods.

I have nothing to say about the rest of your post(s). I am merely here to provide some facts in place of false guesses masquerading as facts.

1. How many AU families go private vs Shepherd Park?
2. What is the taxable income for $215k and $180k, accounting for mortgage interest, business loss etc?

You prove my point. DC officials are not going to cater to AU families who pay maybe a few thousand year more in taxes at the cost the diverse, HHI of Shepherd Park because a few Ward 3 families are threatening to leave.

NP here. As of 2012, Janney IB is 92% and Shepherd IB is 28%. Given that the overwhelming majority of the neighborhood isn't using the school, I don't think you are going to get it's residents into a lather over moving boundaries. Now, no one is going to change Janney's boundaries because it is too close to Deal. However, for hypothetical purposes if that were to happen you can imagine the ruckus parents and residents would make.

Just because SP kids don't go to SP elementary doesn't mean they don't go to Deal. I would wager that there is as much % kids in SP going to Deal vs Private as Janney. The argument is moot, SP will not get zoned out of Deal no matter how much you will/wish it to happen. If you think Janney families would cause more ruckus than SP/CV you are sadly mistaken and have no clue about how DC works.

[Anonymous]

My question is whether the election next year will just end this entire process. As in, Mayor Gray never gets out from under the cloud and therefore never runs, and Bowser runs and wins and can therefore never do anything that takes guts with regard to Ward 4 (where I live by the way).

That's a sad thought because this process is important, and I think a key aspect will be breathing new life into the schools in Wards 1 and 4 to make middle class families go there, both with carrots and sticks.

With Bowser in charge I don't think this process will do anything to create a system broader than one working feeder.

[Anonymous]

DC officials are not going to cater to AU families who pay maybe a few thousand year more in taxes at the cost the diverse, HHI of Shepherd Park because a few Ward 3 families are threatening to leave.

NP here. As of 2012, Janney IB is 92% and Shepherd IB is 28%. Given that the overwhelming majority of the neighborhood isn't using the school, I don't think you are going to get it's residents into a lather over moving boundaries. Now, no one is going to change Janney's boundaries because it is too close to Deal. However, for hypothetical purposes if that were to happen you can imagine the ruckus parents and residents would make.

Just because SP kids don't go to SP elementary doesn't mean they don't go to Deal. I would wager that there is as much % kids in SP going to Deal vs Private as Janney. The argument is moot, SP will not get zoned out of Deal no matter how much you will/wish it to happen. If you think Janney families would cause more ruckus than SP/CV you are sadly mistaken and have no clue about how DC works.

Shepherd Park and Colonial Village are filled with old people, Orthodox Jews and high SES AAs who attend privates. None of these people are going to fight to the death over boundary changes the way that AU people would. For God sakes, Janney is getting its second addition in three years. They know how to pull the levers of power in this town. The gold coast as a power base is dying out. If Muriel Bowser gets elected, well we'll see but the Hilda Mason legacy is dying out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:



DC officials are not going to cater to AU families who pay maybe a few thousand year more in taxes at the cost the diverse, HHI of Shepherd Park because a few Ward 3 families are threatening to leave.

NP here. As of 2012, Janney IB is 92% and Shepherd IB is 28%. Given that the overwhelming majority of the neighborhood isn't using the school, I don't think you are going to get it's residents into a lather over moving boundaries. Now, no one is going to change Janney's boundaries because it is too close to Deal. However, for hypothetical purposes if that were to happen you can imagine the ruckus parents and residents would make.

Just because SP kids don't go to SP elementary doesn't mean they don't go to Deal. I would wager that there is as much % kids in SP going to Deal vs Private as Janney. The argument is moot, SP will not get zoned out of Deal no matter how much you will/wish it to happen. If you think Janney families would cause more ruckus than SP/CV you are sadly mistaken and have no clue about how DC works.

Shepherd Park and Colonial Village are filled with old people, Orthodox Jews and high SES AAs who attend privates. None of these people are going to fight to the death over boundary changes the way that AU people would. For God sakes, Janney is getting its second addition in three years. They know how to pull the levers of power in this town. The gold coast as a power base is dying out. If Muriel Bowser gets elected, well we'll see but the Hilda Mason legacy is dying out.

We shall see...I am not saying Janney will get booted (in fact I am certain they won't). I am saying SP will not. Hardy is too good of a school as an alternative to others than Takoma would be for SP.

PS, I don't think you've seen SP in a while, is not filled with Jewish families and old folks. In fact, I'd argue that SP is one of if not the most diverse neighborhoods in DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When did taking responsibility for your own children become considered "Every man for himself"? We would have liked to have 4 kids, but we knew we could only properly support and educate two. I have neither the time nor inclination to educate somebody else's kids.

Taking responsibility for your own children, and no one else's, is almost literally "Every man for himself" -- it's "every parent for his/her own." It didn't "become" that way, it already was that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My question is whether the election next year will just end this entire process. As in, Mayor Gray never gets out from under the cloud and therefore never runs, and Bowser runs and wins and can therefore never do anything that takes guts with regard to Ward 4 (where I live by the way).

That's a sad thought because this process is important, and I think a key aspect will be breathing new life into the schools in Wards 1 and 4 to make middle class families go there, both with carrots and sticks.

With Bowser in charge I don't think this process will do anything to create a system broader than one working feeder.

In my view, an election or changing council/mayor will not stop this process. I think its important to understand that the whole boundary issue really rests with the Chancellor and DCPS - it is not decided by Mayor or Council although they have input.

[Anonymous]

The failure of parents to take responsibility for their kids or in some cases not have kids at all is EXACTLY the reason we have to go through this whole boundary exercise. If the parents WofTP are so horrible, why is the rest of the city beating down the gates to come to our schools? It's not for the bricks and mortar or the teachers at the schools because that can be replicated elsewhere. No, you want your kids to be near our kids who we have taken the time to be prepared and motivated to learn. Just admit it. Stop using these 1960's equity arguments that have no application to 2014 DC where AA leaders sill control the council and DCPS and the schools EofTP are well funded.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The failure of parents to take responsibility for their kids or in some cases not have kids at all is EXACTLY the reason we have to go through this whole boundary exercise. If the parents WofTP are so horrible, why is the rest of the city beating down the gates to come to our schools? It's not for the bricks and mortar or the teachers at the schools because that can be replicated elsewhere. No, you want your kids to be near our kids who we have taken the time to be prepared and motivated to learn. Just admit it. Stop using these 1960's equity arguments that have no application to 2014 DC where AA leaders sill control the council and DCPS and the schools EofTP are well funded.

No, it's the us vs them attitude that most WOTP parents exhibit that make the rest of the city resent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The failure of parents to take responsibility for their kids or in some cases not have kids at all is EXACTLY the reason we have to go through this whole boundary exercise. If the parents WofTP are so horrible, why is the rest of the city beating down the gates to come to our schools? It's not for the bricks and mortar or the teachers at the schools because that can be replicated elsewhere. No, you want your kids to be near our kids who we have taken the time to be prepared and motivated to learn. Just admit it. Stop using these 1960's equity arguments that have no application to 2014 DC where AA leaders sill control the council and DCPS and the schools EofTP are well funded.

Ick. Isolationism is gross. Honestly, I'm pretty sure I don't want your child anywhere near mine considering the biased, entitled blather that you're putting into your child's brain. It's sad. I bet you outwardly you put on a really good face and hardly anyone knows what
a self-interested bigot you really are. But rest assured, some can see through you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My question is whether the election next year will just end this entire process. As in, Mayor Gray never gets out from under the cloud and therefore never runs, and Bowser runs and wins and can therefore never do anything that takes guts with regard to Ward 4 (where I live by the way).

That's a sad thought because this process is important, and I think a key aspect will be breathing new life into the schools in Wards 1 and 4 to make middle class families go there, both with carrots and sticks.

With Bowser in charge I don't think this process will do anything to create a system broader than one working feeder.

In my view, an election or changing council/mayor will not stop this process. I think its important to understand that the whole boundary issue really rests with the Chancellor and DCPS - it is not decided by Mayor or Council although they have input.

According to a Post article on Nov 15, the Mayor has the ultimate authority to change the boundaries and he/she can do without the input of the Council. The Chancellor and DCPS are running the process but the Mayor is not without power or influence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:According to a Post article on Nov 15, the Mayor has the ultimate authority to change the boundaries and he/she can do without the input of the Council. The Chancellor and DCPS are running the process but the Mayor is not without power or influence.

The process is run by the Deputy Mayor for Education.

http://dme.dc.gov/DC/DME/Initiatives+and+Priorities/Statewide+Commission+on+Children+Youth+and+Their+Families/Student+Assignment+and+School+Boundaries+Review+Process

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My question is whether the election next year will just end this entire process. As in, Mayor Gray never gets out from under the cloud and therefore never runs, and Bowser runs and wins and can therefore never do anything that takes guts with regard to Ward 4 (where I live by the way).

That's a sad thought because this process is important, and I think a key aspect will be breathing new life into the schools in Wards 1 and 4 to make middle class families go there, both with carrots and sticks.

With Bowser in charge I don't think this process will do anything to create a system broader than one working feeder.

In my view, an election or changing council/mayor will not stop this process. I think its important to understand that the whole boundary issue really rests with the Chancellor and DCPS - it is not decided by Mayor or Council although they have input.

Not true. At Catania's hearing on Nov. 15, Abigail Smith was asked directly who had final authority over the boundaries and her answer was "the mayor". According to her, the mayor could veto, change, overule, etc. any "recommendations" that her group puts together. Kaya was never mentioned in that back and forth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

PS, I don't think you've seen SP in a while, is not filled with Jewish families and old folks. In fact, I'd argue that SP is one of if not the most diverse neighborhoods in DC.

You can try arguing this, but I don't believe the data bear your argument.

As a simple measure of diversity, we can use the Herfindahl Index (from industrial organization) that measures concentration within an industry. The previously liked site contains ethnic information on different neighborhoods. Since calculating the HHI (Herfindahl Index, not high household income) for each neighborhood is time-consuming, let's do it at the Ward level.

While it's true that Ward 4 is less concentrated (so more diverse, according to this measure) than Wards 2 or 3, it is far less diverse than Wards 1 and 6. (Wards 7 and 8 are the least diverse.)

So, you're argument suggests that we should be shuttling students into Ward 4 from Wards 1 and 6, all for the sake of diversity. Yeah, let's talk about doing that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The failure of parents to take responsibility for their kids or in some cases not have kids at all is EXACTLY the reason we have to go through this whole boundary exercise. If the parents WofTP are so horrible, why is the rest of the city beating down the gates to come to our schools? It's not for the bricks and mortar or the teachers at the schools because that can be replicated elsewhere. No, you want your kids to be near our kids who we have taken the time to be prepared and motivated to learn. Just admit it. Stop using these 1960's equity arguments that have no application to 2014 DC where AA leaders sill control the council and DCPS and the schools EofTP are well funded.

Ick. Isolationism is gross. Honestly, I'm pretty sure I don't want your child anywhere near mine considering the biased, entitled blather that you're putting into your child's brain. It's sad. I bet you outwardly you put on a really good face and hardly anyone knows what
a self-interested bigot you really are. But rest assured, some can see through you.

So. Mr./Ms. Ick....where do your kids go to school? If you live eotp, do your kids stay eotp for school? If not, they may very well be sitting right next to Mr./Ms. wotp "our schools".
As bigoted as the "our schools" poster may sound, there is truth there. We all say it, it's the concentration of higher ses families that matter the most.