AP Bio, AP Chem, AP Phys: order, difficulty, prerequisites?

[Anonymous]

DC is in 8th grade, currently in Alg2 and planning his high school track. He's sick of middle school science and can't wait to do more challenging STEM subjects.

When do you recommend he take AP Bio, AP Chem and AP Physics? Is it possible to start in 9th? His high school website says Bio is a prerequisite for AP Bio, and a co-requisite is Chem. Is that usually enforced? Can he take Bio as a summer class this year, and would that be accepted as a prerequisite? Can he do AP Bio and AP Chem at the same time, or is that utter madness?

In math, I except he'll do Honors precal, AP Calc BC, MVC, then something else.

Thank you for your suggestions.

[Anonymous]

He can take AP Physics 1 without a prerequisite (it is a substitute for honors physics.). Otherwise, all of the AP science courses you mentioned have the 'honors' (or 'regular') version of the same class as a prerequisite.

All of the 'honors' versions seem quite easy-- at least according to my kids (who are A students, but not science-y students).

According to my kids, AP Bio is the easiest of the ones you mentioned, and AP Chem is the hardest. But this may be school (or kid) dependent.

A few years ago, they let kids at our school go straight to AP Bio without doing honors bio first, but they stopped allowing that (I guess because too many kids were unprepared?) If your kid is top 1% of the school and science oriented, you could try to make a case for that.

[Anonymous]

Definitely follow the school requirements. My kids did Honors Bio 9th, Honors Chem 10th, AP Bio 11th, AP Physics (different versions) 12th. One also did AP Environmental Science in 12th.

Here's the percent that get a 5 on the AP exam:
Bio 14.3%
Chem 16%
Environment 8.3%
Physics 1 8.8%
Physics 2 16.5%
Physics C magnetism 33.6%
Physics C mechanics 26.4%

Here's the percent that get a 3+ on the AP exam:
Bio 64.4%
Chem 75.1%
Environment 53.7%
Physics 1 45.6%
Physics 2 69.8%
Physics C magnetism 70.2%
Physics C mechanics 73.5%

(Physics C is higher level, but the students who take it have the higher math skills, etc., to succeed.)

[Anonymous]

I would do AP Physics 1 first because it is very related to pre calculus and algebra 2. Especially if your kids is very good at math. Then Chem (ap or honor) then ap bio. Then what ever other science class senior year. Do not do AP Bio and Chem at the same time. There is no point, just more stressful.

[Anonymous]

AP Physics 1 goes well with pre-Cal. That said, I recommend completing the pre-requisites for AP Bio and AP Chem.

Also do not under estimate how tough Honors Pre-Cal can be. Many a student drops down at that level. So be sure your student has time to devote the appropriate attention.

[Anonymous]

My son took AP Physics 1 in 9th, Honors Chem in 10th, AP Bio in 9th.

Still deciding between AP Chem and AP ES or AP Physics C and AP ES for senior year.

He thinks AP Bio is easy w/o taking Honors Bio but glad he took Honors Chemistry and Physics 1 first because the content builds on each other—hope that makes sense!?

[Anonymous]

DP: I’m so confused by the science pathway/options.
Do some of these have lab periods you need to fit in the schedule simultaneously? Or no?
What is a good four-year sequence for a strong student who can handle top rigor in science but whose interest is more history/humanities for any extra elective slots? Like the regular GT pathway of yore.

[Anonymous]

AP chem and AP Bio are both double period, so nearly impossible to take at the same time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:AP chem and AP Bio are both double period, so nearly impossible to take at the same time.

Some schools offer single period. I posted earlier that my son finds AP Bio easy and he is in single period. The teacher warned students and parents in the beginning of the year that the content would move quickly to fit in lab.

[Anonymous]

I can speak for science in general and chemistry specifically - I teach honors and AP Chemistry in an MCPS school.

The regular MCPS progression for science now is: 1st year: Hon Bio, 2nd year: Hon Chem, 3rd year: AP something, I recommend AP chemistry as this is harder than AP Bio, and frankly I haven't a lot of use for AP Bio in general as the curriculum still has far too much memorization tied to it, something which has largely been extracted from the AP chem syllabus. If you've a go-getter AP Physics 1 is possible and doable, or honors physics. 4th year: AP Physics in Mechanics or Electricity and Magnetism, or AP Bio (I don't recommend this if a student has taken AP Chemistry, students don't tend to like AP Bio after being pushed in AP chemistry).

Depending on the performance of your student in general this can usually be mixed up depending on the ability of the student, i.e. you can double up here or there, but you'll usually get pushback from counseling so you'll have to be a strong student advocate and your kid should have the aptitude for it and have a record that reflects this, a parent's "say so" isn't going to cut it and counseling does take a perspective of wanting to protect students from unreasonable parental academic pressure and consequent overload of the student in question.

Something to be mindful of: MCPS Honors curriculums are NOT designed to feed kids into AP level courses. The fact is that there are NO established College Board prerequisite courses for any of the science AP classes (I'm guessing that this is true for ALL AP classes, but I can only talk to science) - a kid can, and this does happen, walk in off the street and take the test without ever taking the honors OR the AP classes. The bottom line is, a student can take the test without taking the course, and schools have no College Board standing in stating that any course is a prerequsite for enrolling in an AP Class. Might the honors curriculum be helpful for the AP class? The rigor in honors is no way near that of AP. I'd guess that MCPS would disagree, but honors is intended for ALL students, throughout the county, so it doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out that the standards/expectations for a college-level AP class are not the same as they are for an honors class. Bottom line, I teach both, for darn sure my expectations in each are very different.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can speak for science in general and chemistry specifically - I teach honors and AP Chemistry in an MCPS school.

The regular MCPS progression for science now is: 1st year: Hon Bio, 2nd year: Hon Chem, 3rd year: AP something, I recommend AP chemistry as this is harder than AP Bio, and frankly I haven't a lot of use for AP Bio in general as the curriculum still has far too much memorization tied to it, something which has largely been extracted from the AP chem syllabus. If you've a go-getter AP Physics 1 is possible and doable, or honors physics. 4th year: AP Physics in Mechanics or Electricity and Magnetism, or AP Bio (I don't recommend this if a student has taken AP Chemistry, students don't tend to like AP Bio after being pushed in AP chemistry).

Depending on the performance of your student in general this can usually be mixed up depending on the ability of the student, i.e. you can double up here or there, but you'll usually get pushback from counseling so you'll have to be a strong student advocate and your kid should have the aptitude for it and have a record that reflects this, a parent's "say so" isn't going to cut it and counseling does take a perspective of wanting to protect students from unreasonable parental academic pressure and consequent overload of the student in question.

Something to be mindful of: MCPS Honors curriculums are NOT designed to feed kids into AP level courses. The fact is that there are NO established College Board prerequisite courses for any of the science AP classes (I'm guessing that this is true for ALL AP classes, but I can only talk to science) - a kid can, and this does happen, walk in off the street and take the test without ever taking the honors OR the AP classes. The bottom line is, a student can take the test without taking the course, and schools have no College Board standing in stating that any course is a prerequsite for enrolling in an AP Class. Might the honors curriculum be helpful for the AP class? The rigor in honors is no way near that of AP. I'd guess that MCPS would disagree, but honors is intended for ALL students, throughout the county, so it doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out that the standards/expectations for a college-level AP class are not the same as they are for an honors class. Bottom line, I teach both, for darn sure my expectations in each are very different.

And therein lies the problem that parents continue to complain about and at this point are demanding be changed. The fact that we have some classes with an all honors model is ridiculous because we don’t in turn maintain the rigor that is needed.While the expectations for a Honors vs AP class should not be the same, the honors class should definitely have enough depth and rigor as to prepare students to take a AP class. Each level should be a step up in expectations, requirements, and depth of learning. No one is asking that Honors classes be gate-kept. They should be OPEN for ALL students to try and to challenge themselves and to grow from.

As you indicated, AP courses are college level class. When students start taking them they should have acquired enough background, study skills, self-advocacy and frankly interest in the content to be able to deal with the demands of the course without significant hand holding. When students take an Honors course, it should essentially be a test for them of have they acquired and developed the above, and getting support as needed in the areas where they are lacking. It also tells them if this is an subject area in which they want further study.

[Anonymous]

If he really wants to get ahead and is capable, I’d take both Honors Bio and Honors Chem in 9th (chem not on course reg card but bio is not a prerequisite). Then something like AP Bio in 10. AP Chem in 11. AP Physics C in 12.

[Anonymous]

My son will be a Junior and he will take AP Precalculus and AP Biology. He will then take AP Physics and AP Chemistry as a Senior. Is this a good mix? What about AP Env Science? He wants to be a dentist/Dr

[Anonymous]

Our HS no longer offers AP Physics 1.

AP Physics C is calculus based, so a person needs to be concurrently enrolled in calculus or already have taken it.

The pass rates are higher for AP Phys C due to the population of kids taking it.

[Anonymous]

My undergraduate degree is in physics. I do not agree with the current recommendations to take AP Physics BEFORE biology or chemistry. I don’t think a student will appreciate that physics is the exploration of the nature of the universe without having taken chemistry. I believe that AP Physics has been Frankensteined into a practical math class. I’m just furious about this.

For what it is worth My rising 8th grader is taking biology.