Is this residency fraud?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She can own two homes and have one permanent residency. It can be either the Shaw house or the condo. She will go to either place daily.

Yeah but you can't claim to be inbounds for both. Most jurisdictions will find that your legal residence is where you sleep over 180 nights a year. If her kid is going to be doing a lot of overnights at his grandmothers and claim that to be his residence, fine, but it doesn't like that is the case at all.

Right, you can't claim to be IB for both. And she isn't planning to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So you skipped the word “occupy” in that definition. Not convenient for you?

Do you believe that a person who is rich enough to afford two residences can take a spot from a kid whose family can’t afford the house AND the condo but tries to lottery into the school? That second kid is your victim.

She is occupying both residences.

So are you upset because she can find a legal way to circumvent the system? Petition your representatives to put forth a bill to change it. I could name (for hours) countless things I disagree with -doesn't make them unlawful. I'm only pointing out that she isn't committing residency fraud. I feel bad for that second kid. Heck- It may even be my child, but try separate your feelings from what is lawful. Now I ask you...have you ever wondered why the entire city is trying to get in to one non-selective high school? I don't hear you complaining about that aspect of it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So you skipped the word “occupy” in that definition. Not convenient for you?

Do you believe that a person who is rich enough to afford two residences can take a spot from a kid whose family can’t afford the house AND the condo but tries to lottery into the school? That second kid is your victim.

She is occupying both residences.

So are you upset because she can find a legal way to circumvent the system? Petition your representatives to put forth a bill to change it. I could name (for hours) countless things I disagree with -doesn't make them unlawful. I'm only pointing out that she isn't committing residency fraud. I feel bad for that second kid. Heck- It may even be my child, but try separate your feelings from what is lawful. Now I ask you...have you ever wondered why the entire city is trying to get in to one non-selective high school? I don't hear you complaining about that aspect of it.

I'm not sure what your agenda is, but it's weird. You're literally just making up stuff and claiming it's a "legal way to circumvent the system."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Where's the part about your residence being where you sleep 180 days a year in the DC Code? I've looked hard - it's not there. Sounds like OP could easily make it the case if she wants. She might do that, who are we to say that she can't and won't. But then I could care less if she does, like most reasonably happy people, and my kid attends a crowded DCPS program, very crowded.

[phone] I looked too and couldn't find it in any DC code. If someone knows where it is for DC (AND NOT OTHER JURISDICTIONS) please post!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is NOT Residency Fraud because her principal residence is in DC. She will not violate any laws of falsifying documents if she makes the condo her principal home for legal purposes.
DCPS Only states that you attest to “residing” at the particular address. DC does not have a definition of the word RESIDE. Merriam-Webster's definition of "reside" is to dwell permanently or continuously- occupy a place as one's legal domicile or have one's permanent home in a particular place.
Now let’s move to the word domicile - a person's fixed, permanent, and principal home for legal purposes.
So as long as you define the IB home as your principal home for legal purposes you have not broken any laws. Make it your “legal” home (with all documents DC uses to verify residency) and you will have not committed perjury or lied under oath or section of the DC code.
Enjoy Wilson and much success to you, your family and your child!

That's nice how you think you can just make up the laws and facts. Changing your address on your tax forms and drivers license =/= making it your legal residence. You can't just change your address and make that your place of legal domicile. And even if we're going by the Merriam-Webster definition (which is hysterical that you think that's probative of anything), OP is not meeting that definition, because she does not dwell there at all.

Who made up anything? Please find the DCPS list to determine residency. I'm sorry...where are your facts?

Proof of Current District of Columbia Residency

You must provide 2 of the documents listed below (in which the address matches EXACTLY on both documents) to satisfy proof of current District of Columbia residency. DC DMV will NOT accept documents that are not listed below to satisfy proof of DC residency.

NOTE: Source documents (2 required) must be original AND contain a valid DC address (PO boxes not acceptable). Computer printouts of online bills are considered original.
•Utility bill (water, gas, electric, oil, or cable), with name and address, issued within the last 60 days (disconnect notices/bills are not accepted)
•Telephone bill (cell phone, wireless, or pager bills acceptable), reflecting applicant's name and current address, issued within the last 60 days (disconnect notices/bills are not accepted)
•Deed, mortgage, or settlement agreement reflecting applicant's name and property address
•Unexpired lease or rental agreement with the name of the applicant listed as the lessee, permitted resident, or renter (may be a photocopy). The unexpired lease or rental agreement must be signed by all parties.
•Unexpired Sublease accompanied by the original unexpired Lease with the name of the certifier as sub-lessor
•DC property tax bill or tax assessment issued within the last 12 months reflecting the applicant's name and property address.
•Unexpired homeowner's or renter’s insurance policy reflecting name and address
•**Letter with picture from Court Services and Offender Supervision Agency (CSOSA) or DC Department of Corrections (DC DOC) certifying name and DC residency issued within the last 60 days
•Bank/credit union/credit card/investment account statement issued within the last 60 days reflecting name and address
•Official mail—received from ANY government agency (with full name and address) to include contents and envelope received within the last 60 days, excluding mail from DC DMV. DC DMV does not accept change of address forms from the United States Postal Service.
•**DC DMV-approved form from certified social service provider
•Medical bill issued within the last 60 days reflecting name and address. An Explanation of Benefits is not a medical bill and will not be accepted.
•Student loan statement issued within the last 60 days reflecting name and address
•Home line of equity statement issued within the last 60 days reflecting name and address
•Car/personal loan statement (no coupon books/vouchers accepted) issued within the last 60 days reflecting name and address
•Home security system bill issued within the last 60 days reflecting name and address
•Letter on official letterhead issued by DC Universities and Colleges reflecting the customer’s name and address


You were saying?

major dunning-krieger effect going on here.

the form you fill out requires that you attest the address is where you "reside." Your residence is not determined by where you (fraudulently) change your paperwork to list that address. your residence is where you actually reside, and OP admits that would be the Shaw house. if you could change your legal residence just by falsifying your address, then there would be no such thing as residency fraud, much less boundary fraud!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where's the part about your residence being where you sleep 180 days a year in the DC Code? I've looked hard - it's not there. Sounds like OP could easily make it the case if she wants. She might do that, who are we to say that she can't and won't. But then I could care less if she does, like most reasonably happy people, and my kid attends a crowded DCPS program, very crowded.

[phone] I looked too and couldn't find it in any DC code. If someone knows where it is for DC (AND NOT OTHER JURISDICTIONS) please post!

Look, it may or may not be in the code, but there are certainly parallels in the case law that would be used. And although there may be some wiggle room in definitions (are 180 days required? Or would weekends be enough?) what we can say with certainty is that in a case where OP has no intention to actually LIVE in the dwelling, and admits she's just using the address to obtain a public benefit she would not otherwise be entitled do, she does not reside there.

[Anonymous]

I'm not from this area- but I *think* residency is where ever the child resides most of the time. I also think that, unless there is a documented reason, the child's residence is with a legal guardian- usually one or both parents. I think to be entirely "clean" OP would have to establish the condo as her primary residence and her current home as a second home. That might be hard to do if her DH lives in the second home.

Domicile/residence are complicated issues and states/jurisdictions will tend to go with whatever answer benefits them for tax/residency purposes. We're going through this headache in a lot of respects due to permanent job relocation for a spouse and a home that we're having trouble selling quickly. It's a headache and we know that either state could claim grounds to tax all of our income.

Anyway, that's how it works almost everywhere--it's where the child legally resides. I don't think just staying with grandma for a few nights a week is going to cut it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She can own two homes and have one permanent residency. It can be either the Shaw house or the condo. She will go to either place daily.

Yeah but you can't claim to be inbounds for both. Most jurisdictions will find that your legal residence is where you sleep over 180 nights a year. If her kid is going to be doing a lot of overnights at his grandmothers and claim that to be his residence, fine, but it doesn't like that is the case at all.

Right, you can't claim to be IB for both. And she isn't planning to.

Right but it seems that everyone here would agree that she is inbound for Shaw. She can’t also be inbound somewhere else.

[Anonymous]

I wouldn't blink an eye if I saw gma dropping off and picking up dear children.

What happens afterwards in none of my business.

[Anonymous]

OP, nothing is keeping you from moving IB for the school you want and having your mom live nearby. Nothing is keeping you from sending your kid to school in Shaw and buying a place for your mother to live near you.

But if you do what you're planning to do I hope someone reports it and your child is disenrolled from the WoTP school.

[Anonymous]

Fact is if OP can produce the requisite residency docs, OSSE isn't coming at her. Even if they were to investigate her for DCPS residency fraud (very unlikely), they'd simply give her several days to produce more residency docs than she gave at the time of enrollment. Certified tax returns showing DC withholding and multiple utilities bills bearing the in-boundary address top their list. OP could also also give them car registration, credit card bills, drivers license, voter registration etc. with the condo address on them in the hopes of being cleared.

I know this because I was investigated by OSSE and cleared, fairly recently. You may hate this state of affairs. But, sorry, you aren't going to change it by trying to frighten and shame OP from using the condo address as her in-boundary address on this thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, nothing is keeping you from moving IB for the school you want and having your mom live nearby. Nothing is keeping you from sending your kid to school in Shaw and buying a place for your mother to live near you.

But if you do what you're planning to do I hope someone reports it and your child is disenrolled from the WoTP school.

Not happening. Somebody could report OP but her child won't be disenrolled if she can produce extra residency docs within a few days.

OSSE goes at low-hanging fruit, e.g. PG County address cheaters, not a DC resident like OP with a strong legal case. Even if OSSE was to do a home visit, which they almost never do for DC residents, OP could bring extra toys and kids clothes over to mom's for an investigator to photograph and things would be fine.

[Anonymous]

You’ll be fine if you own both places.

Make it a two bedroom condo and make sure the kids have a bedroom.

It’s similar to if OP and the spouse were divorced and had shared custody. The kids would be IB for both schools in separate locales.

If you really wanted to go the extra mile, get a shared custody agreement with grandma done in DC court. Costs less than 30 bucks.

Sounds like Grandmas on board for pickups/drop offs and shared time anyway. Since you’ll be paying all the taxes, kudos. Welcome WTOP neighbor!

[Anonymous]

Hate to sound morbid, but if anything were to happen to OP and spouse, a shared custody agreement would ensure kids were placed with Grandma and that grandma could have rights over the kids.

[Anonymous]

...and they could stay IB for the school