Private sector people - do people at your co send emails during off hours? A number of the business clients I serve do

[Anonymous]

OP, this is a you problem. No one cares or sympathizes.

Understand now?

[Anonymous]

What are off hours? I send emails when I have time. You read them when you have time. Sometimes we may not be in the same time zone even.

[Anonymous]

Ex Govt People I work with newly hired have Imaginary Work Hours. This women I hired as non-exempt announced her hours are
8am to 430 pm. She takes a lunch break at a certain time each day and a break at a certain time each day.

She also WFH three days a week. It is all imaginary. I had a few ex govt workers and they all do same thing and none ever get promoted or move up. They can do there job but they put themselves in a box.

They are glorified clerks for life. So I dont care if I email after imaginary work hours.

[Anonymous]

OP has a really weird view of company policy.

I'm also chucking at her insistence that it's rude to ping someone with the "Do you have a minute for a question?" without identifying the question. She clearly is not a lawyer and doesn't work with legal. That is usually code for "I'd really rather not put this all in writing -- just give me a call." Often times that is for your benefit (sometimes it's because you've screwed something up, and the person is being kind not putting it in writing). If you get on the call and don't know the answer, find to say "Huh, good question. Let me think about that and get back to you." It's really not a big deal, and weird that you are making it a big deal.

If you have individual employees/subordinates that are pests about it, then you need to deal with them. I had a subordinate that was extremely needy and wanted to check in with me about everything -- it was like a year of coaching about when he should contact me, saving up questions for once a day, not expecting immediate replies, etc. But that's a management problem, not a policy problem.

[Anonymous]

I send you don’t need to respond, you send to me I don’t need to respond. What is difficult about that?

Even during work hours I intentionally delay sending replies, or I will draft response and schedule send for 2 or 3 hours later. It helps mange peoples expectations.

[Anonymous]

Delayed response doesn’t work in our office - emails will only send while we’re logged in even if timed for another time.

My colleagues and I work in different time zones. My DH and his colleagues work around the world. For both of us, the annoyance is setting up / inviting us to a 5 or 6 am meeting when the email inviting us is sent at 2 am or something like that. But that’s not about the email - it’s about poor planning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, this is a you problem. No one cares or sympathizes.

Understand now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP has a really weird view of company policy.

I'm also chucking at her insistence that it's rude to ping someone with the "Do you have a minute for a question?" without identifying the question. She clearly is not a lawyer and doesn't work with legal. That is usually code for "I'd really rather not put this all in writing -- just give me a call." Often times that is for your benefit (sometimes it's because you've screwed something up, and the person is being kind not putting it in writing). If you get on the call and don't know the answer, find to say "Huh, good question. Let me think about that and get back to you." It's really not a big deal, and weird that you are making it a big deal.

If you have individual employees/subordinates that are pests about it, then you need to deal with them. I had a subordinate that was extremely needy and wanted to check in with me about everything -- it was like a year of coaching about when he should contact me, saving up questions for once a day, not expecting immediate replies, etc. But that's a management problem, not a policy problem.

I'm actually chuckling of how you think you're technologically modern and know better. I worked at two SaaS before my current role, one on the senior executive team. Fast paced companies typically follow this policy about bothering someone with an asynchronous 'hi, can I ask you something?', which apparently you've never heard of....https://nohello.net/en/ I suggest you read it and take note.

Yes, of course there is the occasional reason to not want to put something in writing, but a lawyer (who tend to be expert communicators) will know how to indicate that or specifically privilege the communication (other comm can still be privileged, but lawyers like to mark certain ones so they're easy to designate if there's a hold or turnover of docs). In fact, if you communicate with lawyers as you claim, you should know your communications to them are probably safer than those to other people if you're concerned about legal risk. But IME 99% of the time it is not anything that can't be put in writing (especially to a lawyer). It's often (foreign born, if I'm going to be honest) lower level tech people and unschooled junior people who often don't understand these workplace 'rules'... and apparently YOU. So here's a tip. Don't bother really busy and certainly not senior level people with 'Hi, do you have a minute?' Its unprofessional and disruptive. Just send them the question and if its too long to discuss quickly, schedule a meeting (but for god's sakes, send them a note about why you're scheduling the meeting and/or include some details in the invite so the meeting is productive). Seriously, you think you're being normal and friendly, but you are wasting people's time, and it is noticed by those above you.

And as far as the email thing, no, don't send dumb unclear emails over the weekend or late at night, unless you give some sort of timing clarification, or better yet, use email delay - its really not that hard, and as some people on here apparently didn't seem to realize, it can be deleted or revised. As I said earlier, the old or un tech savvy folks (which apparently much of dcum is- trust me, the answers would be very different on a SV board) will get a pass on this, but the tech folks do not.

You can argue with me until the cows come home about how wrong I am, but I am senior level at a major company, so I'm pretty sure I know better than some low level staff which clearly you are (although of course your response will be that you're a CEO . I know I sound snotty here, but really. It's time you hear it, especially if you're ever promoted and start having to communicate with more senior people. These semi unspoken communication rules are an important skill.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP has a really weird view of company policy.

I'm also chucking at her insistence that it's rude to ping someone with the "Do you have a minute for a question?" without identifying the question. She clearly is not a lawyer and doesn't work with legal. That is usually code for "I'd really rather not put this all in writing -- just give me a call." Often times that is for your benefit (sometimes it's because you've screwed something up, and the person is being kind not putting it in writing). If you get on the call and don't know the answer, find to say "Huh, good question. Let me think about that and get back to you." It's really not a big deal, and weird that you are making it a big deal.

If you have individual employees/subordinates that are pests about it, then you need to deal with them. I had a subordinate that was extremely needy and wanted to check in with me about everything -- it was like a year of coaching about when he should contact me, saving up questions for once a day, not expecting immediate replies, etc. But that's a management problem, not a policy problem.

I'm actually chuckling of how you think you're technologically modern and know better. I worked at two SaaS before my current role, one on the senior executive team. Fast paced companies typically follow this policy about bothering someone with an asynchronous 'hi, can I ask you something?', which apparently you've never heard of....https://nohello.net/en/ I suggest you read it and take note.

Yes, of course there is the occasional reason to not want to put something in writing, but a lawyer (who tend to be expert communicators) will know how to indicate that or specifically privilege the communication (other comm can still be privileged, but lawyers like to mark certain ones so they're easy to designate if there's a hold or turnover of docs). In fact, if you communicate with lawyers as you claim, you should know your communications to them are probably safer than those to other people if you're concerned about legal risk. But IME 99% of the time it is not anything that can't be put in writing (especially to a lawyer). It's often (foreign born, if I'm going to be honest) lower level tech people and unschooled junior people who often don't understand these workplace 'rules'... and apparently YOU. So here's a tip. Don't bother really busy and certainly not senior level people with 'Hi, do you have a minute?' Its unprofessional and disruptive. Just send them the question and if its too long to discuss quickly, schedule a meeting (but for god's sakes, send them a note about why you're scheduling the meeting and/or include some details in the invite so the meeting is productive). Seriously, you think you're being normal and friendly, but you are wasting people's time, and it is noticed by those above you.

And as far as the email thing, no, don't send dumb unclear emails over the weekend or late at night, unless you give some sort of timing clarification, or better yet, use email delay - its really not that hard, and as some people on here apparently didn't seem to realize, it can be deleted or revised. As I said earlier, the old or un tech savvy folks (which apparently much of dcum is- trust me, the answers would be very different on a SV board) will get a pass on this, but the tech folks do not.

You can argue with me until the cows come home about how wrong I am, but I am senior level at a major company, so I'm pretty sure I know better than some low level staff which clearly you are (although of course your response will be that you're a CEO . I know I sound snotty here, but really. It's time you hear it, especially if you're ever promoted and start having to communicate with more senior people. These semi unspoken communication rules are an important skill.

Lol. Senior exec that is this long winded? 😆

[Anonymous]

Yes, people email during non-business hours. Sometimes people respond, sometimes they don't. I've never had a problem identifying what's urgent and what's not - I will respond if it's urgent. I've also sent emails on off hours and have zero expectation that i will get a response during that time.

OP, you say the company policy is to only send off-hours emails if urgent. Is there a policy about marking an email urgent so the recipient knows? Is there a policy about responding to emails marked urgent?

Maybe you beef is more about the policy than people sending emails? If you're having a problem identifying when emails are urgent ask HR about the policy being updated. If you are receiving non urgent emails just respond on the next work day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP has a really weird view of company policy.

I'm also chucking at her insistence that it's rude to ping someone with the "Do you have a minute for a question?" without identifying the question. She clearly is not a lawyer and doesn't work with legal. That is usually code for "I'd really rather not put this all in writing -- just give me a call." Often times that is for your benefit (sometimes it's because you've screwed something up, and the person is being kind not putting it in writing). If you get on the call and don't know the answer, find to say "Huh, good question. Let me think about that and get back to you." It's really not a big deal, and weird that you are making it a big deal.

If you have individual employees/subordinates that are pests about it, then you need to deal with them. I had a subordinate that was extremely needy and wanted to check in with me about everything -- it was like a year of coaching about when he should contact me, saving up questions for once a day, not expecting immediate replies, etc. But that's a management problem, not a policy problem.

I'm actually chuckling of how you think you're technologically modern and know better. I worked at two SaaS before my current role, one on the senior executive team. Fast paced companies typically follow this policy about bothering someone with an asynchronous 'hi, can I ask you something?', which apparently you've never heard of....https://nohello.net/en/ I suggest you read it and take note.

Yes, of course there is the occasional reason to not want to put something in writing, but a lawyer (who tend to be expert communicators) will know how to indicate that or specifically privilege the communication (other comm can still be privileged, but lawyers like to mark certain ones so they're easy to designate if there's a hold or turnover of docs). In fact, if you communicate with lawyers as you claim, you should know your communications to them are probably safer than those to other people if you're concerned about legal risk. But IME 99% of the time it is not anything that can't be put in writing (especially to a lawyer). It's often (foreign born, if I'm going to be honest) lower level tech people and unschooled junior people who often don't understand these workplace 'rules'... and apparently YOU. So here's a tip. Don't bother really busy and certainly not senior level people with 'Hi, do you have a minute?' Its unprofessional and disruptive. Just send them the question and if its too long to discuss quickly, schedule a meeting (but for god's sakes, send them a note about why you're scheduling the meeting and/or include some details in the invite so the meeting is productive). Seriously, you think you're being normal and friendly, but you are wasting people's time, and it is noticed by those above you.

And as far as the email thing, no, don't send dumb unclear emails over the weekend or late at night, unless you give some sort of timing clarification, or better yet, use email delay - its really not that hard, and as some people on here apparently didn't seem to realize, it can be deleted or revised. As I said earlier, the old or un tech savvy folks (which apparently much of dcum is- trust me, the answers would be very different on a SV board) will get a pass on this, but the tech folks do not.

You can argue with me until the cows come home about how wrong I am, but I am senior level at a major company, so I'm pretty sure I know better than some low level staff which clearly you are (although of course your response will be that you're a CEO . I know I sound snotty here, but really. It's time you hear it, especially if you're ever promoted and start having to communicate with more senior people. These semi unspoken communication rules are an important skill.

I could get behind the dropping of “do you have a minute” and just toss the question is. Because the intent of teams is that it is for urgent and quick tasks. So a question that can wait can just be an email which has less immediacy.

But I can’t really believes OP’s racist and classist comments, and her own self-importance.

All the senior people who may warrant this level of self-regard don’t even read their email, they have staff who do that and cherry pick and summarize

[Anonymous]

OP is just digging in deeper at how unreasonable (and frankly moronic) they are. Doesn't solve anything at their own workplace, but I guess they're having fun lecturing us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Delayed response doesn’t work in our office - emails will only send while we’re logged in even if timed for another time.

My colleagues and I work in different time zones. My DH and his colleagues work around the world. For both of us, the annoyance is setting up / inviting us to a 5 or 6 am meeting when the email inviting us is sent at 2 am or something like that. But that’s not about the email - it’s about poor planning.

Agree I sometimes use delayed delivery but it really doesn’t work that well. Emails don’t send until I log back into my computer which I may not do immediately in the morning if I am in back to back in person meetings. I find the delayed send option in Teams works much better so I do use that a lot for quick requests to my team.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:this even though our HR gives regular updates about not doing this.

Ironically the people who do this most often are the men who work in technology, and who therefore should know how to delay delivery of an email so it arrives during regular hours instead of at midnight.

Fwiw these are never urgent emails, and very often any minimal urgency is caused by their delay.

How would you handle?

I don’t always respond right away, but if I see an email from work pop up, I’m going to end up thinking about it.

You can reply whenever you feel it's appropriate. What's the big deal?

[Anonymous]

OP, report them to HR every time, with a time stamp of when the email was sent.
Also, cover all your bases by having a copy of the HR policy at the ready to send to anyone who sends you an email outside the acceptable hours.

You can set up a rule in your email to trigger both every time an email comes after 5PM in your time zone.