HS language choice —does it matter

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Colleges don't care, but you're an idiot if you take a language that isn't Spanish.

My kids who took Russian certainly aren't idiots. Maybe you're talking about yourself?

A lot of good that’s gonna do them since Americans can’t even travel to Russia.

The UN, State Dept, and intel agencies have LOTS of job openings for people who know Russian or Mandarin. As an example, NSA only wants them to be able to listen/read and translate; NSA explicitly does not want their people to go to any high risk country. NGIC in Charlottesville and NASIC in Ohio also want those people.

Langley HS in FCPS has a full Russian language program as a first foreign language. Every year there are students who transfer to Langley HS from some other FCPS HS in order to study Russian. It can be a great move career wise. Same applies to Mandarin Chinese, which some schools in MCPS offer (e.g., Potomac’s ES in MCPS has a Mandarin Chinese immersion program that people fight and claw to get their DC into).

The State Department barely exists anymore. Spanish speakers aren’t going anywhere.

UN and the IC still have lots of openings for Russian and Mandarin linguists. I get that Spanish is useful for many. However, it is not the only valid choice. You are just trolling. Bye.

I’m not trolling in the least. I’m just supporting my view that from a practical standpoint it makes the most sense for an American high school student to study Spanish as a second language. I am not saying it is the only choice, I am saying it is far away the most practical choice. And I sometimes think that the students whose parents have their children study languages other than Spanish or doing it for classist reasons or competitive ones. And that’s sad.

What's sad is your very narrow, very myopic view of why someone should learn a foreign language. You clearly have zero imagination. The PPP listed many reasons difficult languages such as Russian and Mandarin are in demand. But that's ok. Your kids will be able to understand Dora the Explorer nicely.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges don't care, but you're an idiot if you take a language that isn't Spanish.

My kids who took Russian certainly aren't idiots. Maybe you're talking about yourself?

A lot of good that’s gonna do them since Americans can’t even travel to Russia.

The UN, State Dept, and intel agencies have LOTS of job openings for people who know Russian or Mandarin. As an example, NSA only wants them to be able to listen/read and translate; NSA explicitly does not want their people to go to any high risk country. NGIC in Charlottesville and NASIC in Ohio also want those people.

Langley HS in FCPS has a full Russian language program as a first foreign language. Every year there are students who transfer to Langley HS from some other FCPS HS in order to study Russian. It can be a great move career wise. Same applies to Mandarin Chinese, which some schools in MCPS offer (e.g., Potomac’s ES in MCPS has a Mandarin Chinese immersion program that people fight and claw to get their DC into).

The State Department barely exists anymore. Spanish speakers aren’t going anywhere.

UN and the IC still have lots of openings for Russian and Mandarin linguists. I get that Spanish is useful for many. However, it is not the only valid choice. You are just trolling. Bye.

I’m not trolling in the least. I’m just supporting my view that from a practical standpoint it makes the most sense for an American high school student to study Spanish as a second language. I am not saying it is the only choice, I am saying it is far away the most practical choice. And I sometimes think that the students whose parents have their children study languages other than Spanish or doing it for classist reasons or competitive ones. And that’s sad.

But you are saying it’s the only choice, because people are giving you reasons why studying other languages can make sense and you are refusing to accept any of them.

No, I accept that parents can offer reasons for other languages -- but I think they're generally, for want of better terms, snobby or strider ones. Not practical ones. But, again, this is DCUM, so I'm not surprised.

Except most of the reasons people are giving you are not snobby or strider ones. But I get it, you have to be the most “practical.” That’s fine. And I’m sure you will force your kid into the most “practical” college and career choices and then they’ll be frustrated Trump-type voters when they’re older because other people have more than them and they don’t understand why. Because they did all of the most “practical” things.

LOL, you've made quite the stretch there.

First, the OP herself asked whether certain languages may be "more impressive" for college admissions. That's striving.

Second, many of the responses suggested that certain languages are better for training to become doctors or lawyers or working at the state department or UN. That's striving.

Third, others suggested that other languages are better for traveling to obscure places or studying the classics. That's snobby.

There is, without question, a bias among the educated elite against having their kids study Spanish over other second languages because they're snobby and don't think native Spanish speakers are worth their time. There's no doubt about it.

As for my own family, every one of my (four) kids has a masters degree and none is employed in a remotely "practical" field. And we all bleed deeply, deeply blue. That you read into my posts that I'm a Trump supporter not only says a lot about you -- it says a lot about what's wrong with the (or what I assume is our) Democratic party. Our collective heads are in the clouds and we've lost touch and we are living in a bubble.

DP. With every post, you're proving to be even less imaginative than initially thought. "Practicality" is in the eye of the beholder. If a student knows they want a job within the intelligence community or State Dept., then choosing a critical language is very practical. Knowledge of that language will help them land the job they want. How is that "striving" or "snobby"? We get that you just want to argue, but you've made no salient points. You just sound like a rube, insisting Spanish is the only "practical" language American students could possibly take.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges don't care, but you're an idiot if you take a language that isn't Spanish.

My kids who took Russian certainly aren't idiots. Maybe you're talking about yourself?

A lot of good that’s gonna do them since Americans can’t even travel to Russia.

The UN, State Dept, and intel agencies have LOTS of job openings for people who know Russian or Mandarin. As an example, NSA only wants them to be able to listen/read and translate; NSA explicitly does not want their people to go to any high risk country. NGIC in Charlottesville and NASIC in Ohio also want those people.

Langley HS in FCPS has a full Russian language program as a first foreign language. Every year there are students who transfer to Langley HS from some other FCPS HS in order to study Russian. It can be a great move career wise. Same applies to Mandarin Chinese, which some schools in MCPS offer (e.g., Potomac’s ES in MCPS has a Mandarin Chinese immersion program that people fight and claw to get their DC into).

In our Middle School traditionally kids are transfers to Langley “to study Russian” when they don’t get into TJ. 25 years living here and I’ve only known kids to use Russian as the excuse not to have to go to Chantilly, Westfield, or South Lakes.

DP. My kids attended Langley (in boundary, not transfers) and took Russian. They all went on to continue Russian in college and have used it in various ways in their careers. It was one of the best and most useful classes they ever took. You trying to speak for 25 years worth of kids you don't even know is a really bad look.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges don't care, but you're an idiot if you take a language that isn't Spanish.

My kids who took Russian certainly aren't idiots. Maybe you're talking about yourself?

A lot of good that’s gonna do them since Americans can’t even travel to Russia.

The UN, State Dept, and intel agencies have LOTS of job openings for people who know Russian or Mandarin. As an example, NSA only wants them to be able to listen/read and translate; NSA explicitly does not want their people to go to any high risk country. NGIC in Charlottesville and NASIC in Ohio also want those people.

Langley HS in FCPS has a full Russian language program as a first foreign language. Every year there are students who transfer to Langley HS from some other FCPS HS in order to study Russian. It can be a great move career wise. Same applies to Mandarin Chinese, which some schools in MCPS offer (e.g., Potomac’s ES in MCPS has a Mandarin Chinese immersion program that people fight and claw to get their DC into).

Oh, really? They do that in Potomac? You've proven my point.

You have such a chip on your shoulder about this, it’s really weird.

+100
I have to wonder what the PP's motive here is. Totally bizarre.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Language for College Admissions is a different topic then which language is practical. Consensus seems to be: No it does not matter for Admissions.

Finally - I never met a person that got fluent by taking HS Language. I never met a person that got fluent by taking College Language.

I do see a lot of over confident kids that get a reality check when landing in a country of the targeted language.

The people that say Spanish was helpful - the exercise of interacting with native speakers is where you actually made progress. The HS Spanish just gave you a starting point.

Hi! I took 2 years of middle school French, 4 years of high school French, and 2 years of college French, and I am now fluent; I consumer Francophone media on a regular basis and have been able to hold sustained conversations with French speakers about relatively high-level topics, such as college majors.

+1
My daughter took the same years of French as you, but four years in college and is minoring in French. She is also fluent. It's been a terrific experience for her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid chose French in middle school and I wish she hadn’t because a teacher shortage in our area means she has to complete French 4 online. Apparently this is not uncommon. Spanish seems like the safest bet.

I wish I had better understanding of this for my child. They are a big foreign language enthusiast, but after deciding to skip French 4, AP French is only offered asynchronously online this coming year. They are really bummed about losing the chance for an interactive class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid chose French in middle school and I wish she hadn’t because a teacher shortage in our area means she has to complete French 4 online. Apparently this is not uncommon. Spanish seems like the safest bet.

I wish I had better understanding of this for my child. They are a big foreign language enthusiast, but after deciding to skip French 4, AP French is only offered asynchronously online this coming year. They are really bummed about losing the chance for an interactive class.

They?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Language for College Admissions is a different topic then which language is practical. Consensus seems to be: No it does not matter for Admissions.

Finally - I never met a person that got fluent by taking HS Language. I never met a person that got fluent by taking College Language.

I do see a lot of over confident kids that get a reality check when landing in a country of the targeted language.

The people that say Spanish was helpful - the exercise of interacting with native speakers is where you actually made progress. The HS Spanish just gave you a starting point.

Hi! I took 2 years of middle school French, 4 years of high school French, and 2 years of college French, and I am now fluent; I consumer Francophone media on a regular basis and have been able to hold sustained conversations with French speakers about relatively high-level topics, such as college majors.

So - you did activities that forced you to interact with French outside the classroom? Let me expand - you need to speak with a native speaker or listen to native speakers on a regular basis. You showed interest in the language. I've known kids that watched so much Anime that they are fluent in Japanese, no classes just listen to the natives in their native tongue. Keep it just in class - you think you would've been fluent after scoring a 5 on the AP?

Taking out the statistical outliers - of all the entering freshman that took 4+ years of the language. There are very few that are fluent and fewer that remember a portion of it past college. Anyone have stats that 1/2(or 1/3 or 1/4) are fluent because of HS Language? I think this is why AOs don't care about language; the kids are not fluent. If you did activities that demonstrates fluency that would be worth something.

This is the same is taking AP CS - sure does that mean you can code? The activates outside the classroom demonstrate that.

[Anonymous]

My kids are Spanish heritage speakers. Their private middle school only offered Spanish. As expected they breezed through those courses. For high school, they ended up continuing with Spanish, and took AP Spanish in their junior year. We considered they take French instead, but from listening to other adult’s experiences, “l took four years of (insert language), and cannot remember a thing”, we decided it would be best to have them continue with Spanish. They needed to learn how to read and write in the language. Currently, one of my kids is double majoring in Spanish and another area of study. I expect my kids to be able to work in a professional setting using both languages.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges don't care, but you're an idiot if you take a language that isn't Spanish.

My kids who took Russian certainly aren't idiots. Maybe you're talking about yourself?

A lot of good that’s gonna do them since Americans can’t even travel to Russia.

The UN, State Dept, and intel agencies have LOTS of job openings for people who know Russian or Mandarin. As an example, NSA only wants them to be able to listen/read and translate; NSA explicitly does not want their people to go to any high risk country. NGIC in Charlottesville and NASIC in Ohio also want those people.

Langley HS in FCPS has a full Russian language program as a first foreign language. Every year there are students who transfer to Langley HS from some other FCPS HS in order to study Russian. It can be a great move career wise. Same applies to Mandarin Chinese, which some schools in MCPS offer (e.g., Potomac’s ES in MCPS has a Mandarin Chinese immersion program that people fight and claw to get their DC into).

The State Department barely exists anymore. Spanish speakers aren’t going anywhere.

UN and the IC still have lots of openings for Russian and Mandarin linguists. I get that Spanish is useful for many. However, it is not the only valid choice. You are just trolling. Bye.

I’m not trolling in the least. I’m just supporting my view that from a practical standpoint it makes the most sense for an American high school student to study Spanish as a second language. I am not saying it is the only choice, I am saying it is far away the most practical choice. And I sometimes think that the students whose parents have their children study languages other than Spanish or doing it for classist reasons or competitive ones. And that’s sad.

What's sad is your very narrow, very myopic view of why someone should learn a foreign language. You clearly have zero imagination. The PPP listed many reasons difficult languages such as Russian and Mandarin are in demand. But that's ok. Your kids will be able to understand Dora the Explorer nicely.

This response is just classic. You're dismissing Spanish as an easy language and insulting and belittling Latino culture all in the same paragraph. You're a perfect illustration of exactly what I'm talking about. And the funny part is, you don't even know it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges don't care, but you're an idiot if you take a language that isn't Spanish.

My kids who took Russian certainly aren't idiots. Maybe you're talking about yourself?

A lot of good that’s gonna do them since Americans can’t even travel to Russia.

The UN, State Dept, and intel agencies have LOTS of job openings for people who know Russian or Mandarin. As an example, NSA only wants them to be able to listen/read and translate; NSA explicitly does not want their people to go to any high risk country. NGIC in Charlottesville and NASIC in Ohio also want those people.

Langley HS in FCPS has a full Russian language program as a first foreign language. Every year there are students who transfer to Langley HS from some other FCPS HS in order to study Russian. It can be a great move career wise. Same applies to Mandarin Chinese, which some schools in MCPS offer (e.g., Potomac’s ES in MCPS has a Mandarin Chinese immersion program that people fight and claw to get their DC into).

The State Department barely exists anymore. Spanish speakers aren’t going anywhere.

UN and the IC still have lots of openings for Russian and Mandarin linguists. I get that Spanish is useful for many. However, it is not the only valid choice. You are just trolling. Bye.

I’m not trolling in the least. I’m just supporting my view that from a practical standpoint it makes the most sense for an American high school student to study Spanish as a second language. I am not saying it is the only choice, I am saying it is far away the most practical choice. And I sometimes think that the students whose parents have their children study languages other than Spanish or doing it for classist reasons or competitive ones. And that’s sad.

But you are saying it’s the only choice, because people are giving you reasons why studying other languages can make sense and you are refusing to accept any of them.

No, I accept that parents can offer reasons for other languages -- but I think they're generally, for want of better terms, snobby or strider ones. Not practical ones. But, again, this is DCUM, so I'm not surprised.

Except most of the reasons people are giving you are not snobby or strider ones. But I get it, you have to be the most “practical.” That’s fine. And I’m sure you will force your kid into the most “practical” college and career choices and then they’ll be frustrated Trump-type voters when they’re older because other people have more than them and they don’t understand why. Because they did all of the most “practical” things.

LOL, you've made quite the stretch there.

First, the OP herself asked whether certain languages may be "more impressive" for college admissions. That's striving.

Second, many of the responses suggested that certain languages are better for training to become doctors or lawyers or working at the state department or UN. That's striving.

Third, others suggested that other languages are better for traveling to obscure places or studying the classics. That's snobby.

There is, without question, a bias among the educated elite against having their kids study Spanish over other second languages because they're snobby and don't think native Spanish speakers are worth their time. There's no doubt about it.

As for my own family, every one of my (four) kids has a masters degree and none is employed in a remotely "practical" field. And we all bleed deeply, deeply blue. That you read into my posts that I'm a Trump supporter not only says a lot about you -- it says a lot about what's wrong with the (or what I assume is our) Democratic party. Our collective heads are in the clouds and we've lost touch and we are living in a bubble.

DP. With every post, you're proving to be even less imaginative than initially thought. "Practicality" is in the eye of the beholder. If a student knows they want a job within the intelligence community or State Dept., then choosing a critical language is very practical. Knowledge of that language will help them land the job they want. How is that "striving" or "snobby"? We get that you just want to argue, but you've made no salient points. You just sound like a rube, insisting Spanish is the only "practical" language American students could possibly take.

What percentage of 12 to 14 years -- which is when most are expected to pick a language -- "knows they want a job within the intelligence community or State Dept?" Every kid I've ever met at that age wants to be a professional athlete, singer, or actor -- but they'll settle for being a doctor or lawyer or engineer.

I've never suggested that Spanish is the only practical language. It's unquestionably the most practical one, though. But, again, this is DCUM. Everyone is always looking for an edge.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If kid is considering pre med or healthcare, then definitely take Spanish. In nyc and other major cities, Spanish is very useful in health care. My kid was interested in international relations so chose mandarin. It was a good fit for them, they enjoy the challenge and it helped their application narrative bc they plan to continue that path. Choose what makes sense for your kid and their interests/goals. Some premed kids take Latin bc it can help with vocabulary but Spanish is more practical from a patient care perspective.

Also helpful for education jobs.

[Anonymous]

Learn Spanish to work in customer service with low income people. There are a lot of them, so this is very "practical".

Learn Mandarin or Russian to work at a 3 letter agency.

Honestly not everyone wants to work with the poor and not everyone wants to work at a 3 letter agency, so this debate can go on forever depending on your priors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Learn Spanish to work in customer service with low income people. There are a lot of them, so this is very "practical".

Learn Mandarin or Russian to work at a 3 letter agency.

Honestly not everyone wants to work with the poor and not everyone wants to work at a 3 letter agency, so this debate can go on forever depending on your priors.

Your racism and prejudices are showing. Not all native Spanish speakers are either (1) poor or (2) living in the USA. There are tremendous opportunities for Spanish speakers in dozens of countries in law, business, etc. That you can actually communicate with Spanish speakers in the USA is a nice plus too.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:DS took Spanish in MS and hated it. He switched to Latin in HS and liked it so much that he's considering majoring in it.

She should take what she thinks will be most interesting.

Congrats to your DS! Now he can speak with the, um . . . ancient Romans? Oh, wait! He can understand the Latin Mass! That's the ticket!

Lol this wins for most ignorant DCUM comment today.

Why? What good does taking high school Latin do other than prepare you for the SAT? Who do you talk to?

Latin is great prep for lawyers; all kinds of legal terms are Latin. Ditto for medicine.

I am a lawyer and... no? You learn about 5 Latin terms in law school, it's not remotely necessary to have studied Latin to be a lawyer or a MD.