traveling open your eyes to how terrible the US is in many ways?

Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:Definitely not. I live in Germany, and I have to laugh when so many Americans fantasize about moving to Europe and talk about it like some kind of utopia. It's insanely naive. Every place has its problems and issues


The problem in the US is not that we have problems. It is our obstinate refusal to solve any of them while new problems continue to crop up. While many of these problems are sort of relegated to the poorest people in our country, they are increasingly “trickling up” to the middle class.

People are routinely dying from a lack of healthcare or going bankrupt from medical problems. This should have been resolved ages ago, and is simply not such a crisis in other countries.

Same with gun violence. Yes, there are a multitude of tertiary issues related to gun violence but the main issue is simply guns.

And now, we have a huge mentally ill homeless population suffering in our cities and it’s only growing.

And I think the worst part is that people seem so lonely and unhappy.

Why do we tolerate this?

When I go to my parents’ home country, it just isn’t so miserable. I’m staying in a middle class neighborhood, not a luxury hotel. I have been here often over the last 2 decades: People are grinning and bearing it. No one is shot in the street. If I need medicine I can just walk into the pharmacy and buy it for $2. People are out past 8pm having fun. People are just enjoying being with other people more.

Something is just broken at home. I really feel like I get a break abroad, from the horrible political news and violence and apocalyptic weather events. I have not felt this way before.


Totally disagree. The American personality is a go getter, problem solving one and if anything we are overly optimistic about our ability to change things particularly when utilizing the government. PP had it right, you’re entitled to your opinions but I don’t believe your take on things is widely viewed.


our infrastructure development is demonstrably behind other peer nations, as is our education and health care system. this is objective fact not feeling. In a healthy political climate we could work together to solve this but American individualism has turned into toxic culture wars. ironically not individualism at all but banding together to tribally reject whatever the other guys do.


I don’t agree with this either. You can’t compare our infrastructure in such a huge country with that of something dense like Western European countries. We do have a very good interstate highway system and our air travel is probably the best. Our rail is less developed, sure, but there are reasons for that.


our cities should be just as good as European cities.


Ah, so now I think we have come to an agreement. You aren’t comparing America as a whole to other nations as a whole, just our cities. Unfortunately, you have to look who is running American cities to place the blame for that. We used to have shining examples of well run, clean cities until wackos took over (looking at you, San Francisco).


No we are not in agreement because you’re still trying to make what is the common national good into a partisan political issue.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:Taiwan is about the size of MD and Delaware combined. Of course it's easy to run cross-country trains for cheap in a place that small.

The king of Thailand is the richest monarch in the world (estimated net worth $30-70 billion) and Thailand has the strictest Lèse-majesté laws in the world, meaning criticizing the king carries a sentence of 3-15 years in prison.

I've lived abroad in a few countries and traveled to nearly 100. What I look at is things like innovation, economy and standard of living. Thailand's economy is nearly 50% from tourism (it's 3% in the US). For the most part, tourism does not require innovation. Name any innovations from Thailand that you use. They have 0 Nobel prize winners. Compare that to the US, where more than half of all Nobel prizes awarded in 2024 went to Americans, despite having less than 5% of the world's population.

Taiwan does a little better on the innovation scale -- TSMC is a massive semiconductor manufacturing company and you probably have at least one of their chips in some device in your house. But I think people would struggle to name even one major Taiwanese company.

Then look at standard of living. In the US, even low-income people live in a house with air conditioning and usually a dishwasher and a garbage disposal. Meanwhile, every time there's a heat wave in Paris and scores of people die from the heat.. because not all places have air conditioning. Compare that to for example, Montgomery County, where air conditioning has been _required_ in all rental properties since 2020.

Yes, the US has many downsides, crime and violence in particular. I think we as a society choose to live with it because those who are middle class and above are mostly isolated from it, and ther lower class do not have a strong enough voice. Compare that to many countries, especially in Asia, where you can walk around alone at night down dark alleys with zero fear.

The US is by no means perfect, but it's hardly terrible. A 1-week vacation to some tourist land in another country is hardly a typical experience of how real life is like there.


The US is uniquely bad in infrastructure development compared to peer countries and I bet also compared to many “poorer” countries. We just don’t invest in it; and leaving decisions to fragmentary states and municipalities results in an uncoordinated and ineffecient system. What OP was seeing in terms of superior transportation was real. In the US we just accept things like regular air travel delays of hours and cancelled flights; and the lack of rail options in most of the country.

https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/state-us-infrastructure


When it comes to roads, you seem to be overlooking the interstate highway system. The federal govenrment funds most major transporation infrastructure projects in the US, and for good reason -- the nation's economy overall benefits from having a well-connected country. Yes, states are the ones to propose and implement such projects, but typicallly the feds put in the majority of the funding.

Even with "local" rail, like Metro's silver line, the Feds put in about 40% of government funding.

As for rail infrastructure, the US is just so much bigger and with lower population density than most countries. Why would anyone sit 2+ days on a train from New York to LA when they can fly in 5 hours? The same is in Europe -- Copenhagen to Athens is a shorter distance but no one is going to sit 2 days on a train and bus (there are no inter-city trains to Athens) when they can fly it in 3 hours.




Shhh don’t tell him about high speed trains …

But the point is not only long haul trains but also regional rail. Imagine if instead of the patchwork of WMATA, MARC and VRE we had a comprehensive regional rail system like Madrid?


Just get a car


And then join the wailing and gnashing of teeth about beltway traffic and the cost of parking … ?


Honest question as someone who hasn’t lived in DC in decades, what’s wrong with the metro? I’ve never had bad experiences on it?


oh I’m a big fan of the metro! it’s just not extensive enough to meaningfully reduce beltway traffic.


Do you mean it should reach farther out geographically? Because that’s an example of America making progress as things changes, not a complaint about our transit system per se. But it does take time.


yes that is what I mean. But developing rail in the US is painfulllllly slow compared to other nations - that’s the point. The purple line took how long?
. Do you know how long it has taken to expand rail in other countries? Because in the areas I’ve traveled to, those stations have been existing for decades and aren’t expansions.


yes, it take much less time in other countries. This is objective fact. https://worksinprogress.co/issue/how-madrid-built-its-metro-cheaply/


Who cares. Trains are really important to you. But they is you.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:Definitely not. I live in Germany, and I have to laugh when so many Americans fantasize about moving to Europe and talk about it like some kind of utopia. It's insanely naive. Every place has its problems and issues


The problem in the US is not that we have problems. It is our obstinate refusal to solve any of them while new problems continue to crop up. While many of these problems are sort of relegated to the poorest people in our country, they are increasingly “trickling up” to the middle class.

People are routinely dying from a lack of healthcare or going bankrupt from medical problems. This should have been resolved ages ago, and is simply not such a crisis in other countries.

Same with gun violence. Yes, there are a multitude of tertiary issues related to gun violence but the main issue is simply guns.

And now, we have a huge mentally ill homeless population suffering in our cities and it’s only growing.

And I think the worst part is that people seem so lonely and unhappy.

Why do we tolerate this?

When I go to my parents’ home country, it just isn’t so miserable. I’m staying in a middle class neighborhood, not a luxury hotel. I have been here often over the last 2 decades: People are grinning and bearing it. No one is shot in the street. If I need medicine I can just walk into the pharmacy and buy it for $2. People are out past 8pm having fun. People are just enjoying being with other people more.

Something is just broken at home. I really feel like I get a break abroad, from the horrible political news and violence and apocalyptic weather events. I have not felt this way before.


Totally disagree. The American personality is a go getter, problem solving one and if anything we are overly optimistic about our ability to change things particularly when utilizing the government. PP had it right, you’re entitled to your opinions but I don’t believe your take on things is widely viewed.


our infrastructure development is demonstrably behind other peer nations, as is our education and health care system. this is objective fact not feeling. In a healthy political climate we could work together to solve this but American individualism has turned into toxic culture wars. ironically not individualism at all but banding together to tribally reject whatever the other guys do.


I don’t agree with this either. You can’t compare our infrastructure in such a huge country with that of something dense like Western European countries. We do have a very good interstate highway system and our air travel is probably the best. Our rail is less developed, sure, but there are reasons for that.


our cities should be just as good as European cities.


Ah, so now I think we have come to an agreement. You aren’t comparing America as a whole to other nations as a whole, just our cities. Unfortunately, you have to look who is running American cities to place the blame for that. We used to have shining examples of well run, clean cities until wackos took over (looking at you, San Francisco).


No we are not in agreement because you’re still trying to make what is the common national good into a partisan political issue.


No this is your opinion.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:US is an undeveloped S hole of backwater rednecks with very low education.

Tens of thousands of their people die per year from guns and go bankrupt for epipens. What a laughably bad society.


Nobel Prizes in 2024:

Physics: American and a Brit
Chemistry: 2 Americans, 1 Brit
Medicine: 2 Americans
Economics: 1 Turk, 1 Brit, 1 American (all from MIT)

At least one American won every Nobel prize this last year for prizes in science and innovation (I left out literature and peace).

Yes, there are many Americans with poor education, but we also have some of the most brilliant people in the world. Look at technology -- the majority of software and devices you use every day are from American companies. Which country can match that?


And yet the US does nothing after a classroom of 8 year olds are blown away into meat piles with an AR-15, it happens over and over, 50,000 people die per year from guns, and they can't afford epipens.

Bit you got a Nobel prize for theoretical physics! Yay!


Ok you have a comeback for everything. Fine. The U.S. is bad. We all need to be and miserable as an obligation. If we are not, we are bad. We need to have another country come set us straight. Even if we think we know what is best we are deceived, we don't. If we are happy we are confused we really aren't happy our brains are just tricking us.

I am a good student of yours, right? Happy now?
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:Recently went to Taiwan, where they rank higher on the freedom index than even the US. It's amazing how things function when everyone obeys the law and it is clean everywhere. Never worried about crimes and guns anywhere. Public transport? Amazing. Regional railways that took over one hour long cost a grand total of about $2.80 FOR TWO TICKETS. Amazing when infrastructure is not built around cars and catering to car culture. Food, much higher quality. Next stop was in Thailand, where one in our party got sick. Went to the hospital and was seen immediately. Got checked out by the attending physician, took a stool sample to determine if there was an infection, and had the results in less than one hour. All of this without using insurance cost a grand whopping total of $83. Imagine how terrible it'd be in the US. Probably at least over $2000 for the same treatment and it'd take triple the amount of time. Even Thailand is so much safer with respect to gun violence and crime. Traveling really opens your eyes to how terrible the US has gotten. I honestly think we are borderline 2nd world. We aren't really that free, healthcare is unaffordable, zero guaranteed vacations, high cost of living, toxic food, terrible infrastructure, severely obese population, and out of control crime and gun problems.


Look beyond the surface and the main economic issues that dominate Taiwan are the same as those in the U.S. - high cost of living, affordable housing, lack of employment opportunities, lack of quality health care. From someone who has been visiting Taiwan since the 1980s, the comparisons are not always what they seem.



Also, traveling to a foreign country and looking at the cost of goods/healthcare through what I assume is your U.S. income level is not the same lens as those who live locally.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:What is scary is traveling to places that are seen as far worse than US and beginning to realize that our comparative standard of living is also going down.

I have been traveling to the same second world country to visit family for 20 years and while it has stayed largely the same, the US has gotten dirtier, meaner, and more expensive. When I go to the other country I feel other people are more easygoing and less on edge despite the many issues in the country. Our lack of social cohesion and shared values is beginning to have a very hard impact.



True. Ask many Americans who’ve never been to Taiwan or Thailand what they think they’re like. They’ll conjure up images in their heads of backwater country where people live in straw huts and off of $2 per day. Reality is that they’re far more advanced than the U.S. now in many ways. Public infrastructure is ahead. Public safety, crime, and gun violence are far better. There are many Thais with such higher standards of living that they have inordinate numbers of super high end luxury brands all over multiple cities n the country. Taiwan sets an example that the U.S. should follow with respect to freedom and democracy, not the other way around. It’s honestly shocking how little influence the U.S. has now in spheres like Asia, because everyone now perceives the U.S. as backwater hillbillies who only export death, global warming fossil fuels, and are extreme uneducated fools to the point they’re anti-vax and anti-science. We are are borderline 2nd world country at this point controlled by oligarchs.


Thailand has been modernized since the Vietnam war and has great medical care. The large ex pat community of men who married Thai women and especially the tech bros who did the same bring a dynamism that the country lacked. Thais value education and law and order and it is very pleasant despite some weather issues

What Biden did in bringing in oligarchs, lowering education standards, and championing diversity rather excellence is shameful. Biden exacerbated the political divide as any third world dictator would do.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:Thailand routinely has bloodless coups. They also have some wild laws including very strong anti-defamatory laws. Try posting a negative review online and see what happens. You can be charged with a significant crime, even if it’s true.


And yet the US has almost 50,000 citizens killed per year by guns, classrooms of 8 years shot up by weapons of war, piss poor healthcare that bankrupts/kills people for things as simple as insulin, and education bankrupting people as well.


Where did you get 50,000? It’s about half that and and had are suicides
Anonymous
^^ half are suicides
Anonymous
It seems like anytime someone tries to raise real issues here, someone else tries to beat them down. I suspect the extreme flag waivers haven't traveled much.

Yes, the US is a superpower with great potential, but we do have serious problems:

*Gun violence
*People going bankrupt because of high health care costs
*Inadequate education (more than 54% of the population between 16-54 have less than a 6th grade literacy rate)
*Growing numbers of homelessness
*High college tuition costs
*Declining Democracy
*Increased range between " have and have nots"
*Declining middle class

We can do better because we have done better.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:Definitely not. I live in Germany, and I have to laugh when so many Americans fantasize about moving to Europe and talk about it like some kind of utopia. It's insanely naive. Every place has its problems and issues


The problem in the US is not that we have problems. It is our obstinate refusal to solve any of them while new problems continue to crop up. While many of these problems are sort of relegated to the poorest people in our country, they are increasingly “trickling up” to the middle class.

People are routinely dying from a lack of healthcare or going bankrupt from medical problems. This should have been resolved ages ago, and is simply not such a crisis in other countries.

Same with gun violence. Yes, there are a multitude of tertiary issues related to gun violence but the main issue is simply guns.

And now, we have a huge mentally ill homeless population suffering in our cities and it’s only growing.

And I think the worst part is that people seem so lonely and unhappy.

Why do we tolerate this?

When I go to my parents’ home country, it just isn’t so miserable. I’m staying in a middle class neighborhood, not a luxury hotel. I have been here often over the last 2 decades: People are grinning and bearing it. No one is shot in the street. If I need medicine I can just walk into the pharmacy and buy it for $2. People are out past 8pm having fun. People are just enjoying being with other people more.

Something is just broken at home. I really feel like I get a break abroad, from the horrible political news and violence and apocalyptic weather events. I have not felt this way before.


Totally disagree. The American personality is a go getter, problem solving one and if anything we are overly optimistic about our ability to change things particularly when utilizing the government. PP had it right, you’re entitled to your opinions but I don’t believe your take on things is widely viewed.


our infrastructure development is demonstrably behind other peer nations, as is our education and health care system. this is objective fact not feeling. In a healthy political climate we could work together to solve this but American individualism has turned into toxic culture wars. ironically not individualism at all but banding together to tribally reject whatever the other guys do.


I don’t agree with this either. You can’t compare our infrastructure in such a huge country with that of something dense like Western European countries. We do have a very good interstate highway system and our air travel is probably the best. Our rail is less developed, sure, but there are reasons for that.


our cities should be just as good as European cities.


Ah, so now I think we have come to an agreement. You aren’t comparing America as a whole to other nations as a whole, just our cities. Unfortunately, you have to look who is running American cities to place the blame for that. We used to have shining examples of well run, clean cities until wackos took over (looking at you, San Francisco).


No we are not in agreement because you’re still trying to make what is the common national good into a partisan political issue.


But it’s not a national problem - some cities are better run and more clean and safe than others. Try comparing Charleston or Charlotte to San Francisco or Philadelphia. Or compare the San Francisco or Portland, Maines of 15 years ago to the debacle they have become today. It’s fair to look at how those cities are run. Policies matter.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:Definitely not. I live in Germany, and I have to laugh when so many Americans fantasize about moving to Europe and talk about it like some kind of utopia. It's insanely naive. Every place has its problems and issues


The problem in the US is not that we have problems. It is our obstinate refusal to solve any of them while new problems continue to crop up. While many of these problems are sort of relegated to the poorest people in our country, they are increasingly “trickling up” to the middle class.

People are routinely dying from a lack of healthcare or going bankrupt from medical problems. This should have been resolved ages ago, and is simply not such a crisis in other countries.

Same with gun violence. Yes, there are a multitude of tertiary issues related to gun violence but the main issue is simply guns.

And now, we have a huge mentally ill homeless population suffering in our cities and it’s only growing.

And I think the worst part is that people seem so lonely and unhappy.

Why do we tolerate this?

When I go to my parents’ home country, it just isn’t so miserable. I’m staying in a middle class neighborhood, not a luxury hotel. I have been here often over the last 2 decades: People are grinning and bearing it. No one is shot in the street. If I need medicine I can just walk into the pharmacy and buy it for $2. People are out past 8pm having fun. People are just enjoying being with other people more.

Something is just broken at home. I really feel like I get a break abroad, from the horrible political news and violence and apocalyptic weather events. I have not felt this way before.


^^exactly. Compared to other countries we cannot do anything to improve or solve collective problems. our infrastructure is decaying because of it - it is well known. even making the smallest improvement to traffic or public space is incredibly costly because we’ve set up a system where people can easily throw wrenches into the works - and we have become so miserable and individualistic that people seem to enjoy crusading against change.


Who.appointed you to speak on behalf of the country. You don't know what is going on in people's heads. Your entire goal is to tell people to feel despair. "You need to hate America, I say, this is why!". You have an agenda.


yes … my agenda is that we should have a transit system on par with equally wealthy countries! And for my neighbors to have more of a sense of collective good so that they don’t spend their time crusading against housing development for example.


Beta bicycle YIMBY has entered the chat. Keep your nose out of your neighbor’s business.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Definitely not. I live in Germany, and I have to laugh when so many Americans fantasize about moving to Europe and talk about it like some kind of utopia. It's insanely naive. Every place has its problems and issues


The problem in the US is not that we have problems. It is our obstinate refusal to solve any of them while new problems continue to crop up. While many of these problems are sort of relegated to the poorest people in our country, they are increasingly “trickling up” to the middle class.

People are routinely dying from a lack of healthcare or going bankrupt from medical problems. This should have been resolved ages ago, and is simply not such a crisis in other countries.

Same with gun violence. Yes, there are a multitude of tertiary issues related to gun violence but the main issue is simply guns.

And now, we have a huge mentally ill homeless population suffering in our cities and it’s only growing.

And I think the worst part is that people seem so lonely and unhappy.

Why do we tolerate this?

When I go to my parents’ home country, it just isn’t so miserable. I’m staying in a middle class neighborhood, not a luxury hotel. I have been here often over the last 2 decades: People are grinning and bearing it. No one is shot in the street. If I need medicine I can just walk into the pharmacy and buy it for $2. People are out past 8pm having fun. People are just enjoying being with other people more.

Something is just broken at home. I really feel like I get a break abroad, from the horrible political news and violence and apocalyptic weather events. I have not felt this way before.


Totally disagree. The American personality is a go getter, problem solving one and if anything we are overly optimistic about our ability to change things particularly when utilizing the government. PP had it right, you’re entitled to your opinions but I don’t believe your take on things is widely viewed.


our infrastructure development is demonstrably behind other peer nations, as is our education and health care system. this is objective fact not feeling. In a healthy political climate we could work together to solve this but American individualism has turned into toxic culture wars. ironically not individualism at all but banding together to tribally reject whatever the other guys do.


I don’t agree with this either. You can’t compare our infrastructure in such a huge country with that of something dense like Western European countries. We do have a very good interstate highway system and our air travel is probably the best. Our rail is less developed, sure, but there are reasons for that.


our cities should be just as good as European cities.


Ah, so now I think we have come to an agreement. You aren’t comparing America as a whole to other nations as a whole, just our cities. Unfortunately, you have to look who is running American cities to place the blame for that. We used to have shining examples of well run, clean cities until wackos took over (looking at you, San Francisco).


No we are not in agreement because you’re still trying to make what is the common national good into a partisan political issue.


Ma’am this is the politics board. If you want politics kept out of this discussion, head to travel.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:It seems like anytime someone tries to raise real issues here, someone else tries to beat them down. I suspect the extreme flag waivers haven't traveled much.

Yes, the US is a superpower with great potential, but we do have serious problems:

*Gun violence
*People going bankrupt because of high health care costs
*Inadequate education (more than 54% of the population between 16-54 have less than a 6th grade literacy rate)
*Growing numbers of homelessness
*High college tuition costs
*Declining Democracy
*Increased range between " have and have nots"
*Declining middle class

We can do better because we have done better.


We can absolutely do better, agree.

But let’s not pretend that the countries mentioned here as comparisons don’t also have serious problems of their own. Those things can be true at the same time. And comparatively, we could still be a better place to live overall even with those issues.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:Definitely not. I live in Germany, and I have to laugh when so many Americans fantasize about moving to Europe and talk about it like some kind of utopia. It's insanely naive. Every place has its problems and issues


The problem in the US is not that we have problems. It is our obstinate refusal to solve any of them while new problems continue to crop up. While many of these problems are sort of relegated to the poorest people in our country, they are increasingly “trickling up” to the middle class.

People are routinely dying from a lack of healthcare or going bankrupt from medical problems. This should have been resolved ages ago, and is simply not such a crisis in other countries.

Same with gun violence. Yes, there are a multitude of tertiary issues related to gun violence but the main issue is simply guns.

And now, we have a huge mentally ill homeless population suffering in our cities and it’s only growing.

And I think the worst part is that people seem so lonely and unhappy.

Why do we tolerate this?

When I go to my parents’ home country, it just isn’t so miserable. I’m staying in a middle class neighborhood, not a luxury hotel. I have been here often over the last 2 decades: People are grinning and bearing it. No one is shot in the street. If I need medicine I can just walk into the pharmacy and buy it for $2. People are out past 8pm having fun. People are just enjoying being with other people more.

Something is just broken at home. I really feel like I get a break abroad, from the horrible political news and violence and apocalyptic weather events. I have not felt this way before.


Totally disagree. The American personality is a go getter, problem solving one and if anything we are overly optimistic about our ability to change things particularly when utilizing the government. PP had it right, you’re entitled to your opinions but I don’t believe your take on things is widely viewed.


our infrastructure development is demonstrably behind other peer nations, as is our education and health care system. this is objective fact not feeling. In a healthy political climate we could work together to solve this but American individualism has turned into toxic culture wars. ironically not individualism at all but banding together to tribally reject whatever the other guys do.


I don’t agree with this either. You can’t compare our infrastructure in such a huge country with that of something dense like Western European countries. We do have a very good interstate highway system and our air travel is probably the best. Our rail is less developed, sure, but there are reasons for that.


our cities should be just as good as European cities.


Ah, so now I think we have come to an agreement. You aren’t comparing America as a whole to other nations as a whole, just our cities. Unfortunately, you have to look who is running American cities to place the blame for that. We used to have shining examples of well run, clean cities until wackos took over (looking at you, San Francisco).


No we are not in agreement because you’re still trying to make what is the common national good into a partisan political issue.


No this is your opinion.


it’s not “my opinion” that we should have bridges that are in good repair; transportation that supports the economy; and well educated children.
Anonymous
In terms of standard of living, the US ranks #21:
https://www.datapandas.org/ranking/standard-of-living-by-country
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