Sidwell Junior - GPA concerns

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is this the same way at other private schools in the area- do only a handful of students have 3.9/4.0 at NCS, GDS, Potomac, Holton etc.?

GDS gives A+ grades, so I would think the distribution is higher.

Who at GDS is getting A+s???

Yes, who???

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell 2022/2023 school profile is public on their site and does not have class or grade distributions:
https://www.sidwell.edu/academics/college-counseling

Wait, is this the same one they send to colleges?

Because at the Fall meeting for senior parents, CCO said that parents can't see the college profile that Sidwell sends to schools. It was quickly followed by "this is an administrative decision" to deflect any further discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell senior parent here of kid with slightly higher GPA. 3.7 is excellent for the school. Your DD is correct that there will be a handful of kids > 3.9, but it’s a tiny group in each grade for the reasons PP said.

Our experience this year is that these “low” compared to public schools GPAs only hold you back if you apply to giant public universities **that are unknown to Sidwell specifically** Places with a well worn pathway— Michigan, UVA, Wisconsin, W&M — are no issue. Problems arise with competitive flagships where kids from Sidwell never apply. They seem to take a dim view of a 3.7-3.9 compared to the thousands of applicants with 4.7s. Let’s use Florida, Texas and Georgia as examples. California schools are their own beast and just made huge admissions changes this year …. UNC admits no one, so.

The > 3.5 doesn’t hold your kid back from very competitive LACs or T20 if the rest of their package is very good. “Very good” need not mean URM or recruited athlete btw. There are a lot of kids this year not in those groups and not 3.9+ according to my son who will attend some very very top schools next year. Keeping it vague for their privacy

What about the UC schools? They are on our radar and I am afraid they won't look twice at my very hardworking and top student.

The UC’s are very difficult to get into for out-of-state students. Not impossible, but very difficult. Especially the top tier, such as UCLA and UC Berkeley. Some of the less prestigious ones are understandably easier to get into, but still offer a great education, such as Santa Cruz, San Luis Obispo, Davis. But there’s also some over crowdedness there and a lot of kids can’t get all the course work done in less than five years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell 2022/2023 school profile is public on their site and does not have class or grade distributions:
https://www.sidwell.edu/academics/college-counseling

Wait, is this the same one they send to colleges?

Because at the Fall meeting for senior parents, CCO said that parents can't see the college profile that Sidwell sends to schools. It was quickly followed by "this is an administrative decision" to deflect any further discussion.

It’s part of what they send. The part that reveals more or less where the kid stands in relation to peers is only shown to colleges. This may include the breakdown of grades in each math, history, English, etc class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell senior parent here of kid with slightly higher GPA. 3.7 is excellent for the school. Your DD is correct that there will be a handful of kids > 3.9, but it’s a tiny group in each grade for the reasons PP said.

Our experience this year is that these “low” compared to public schools GPAs only hold you back if you apply to giant public universities **that are unknown to Sidwell specifically** Places with a well worn pathway— Michigan, UVA, Wisconsin, W&M — are no issue. Problems arise with competitive flagships where kids from Sidwell never apply. They seem to take a dim view of a 3.7-3.9 compared to the thousands of applicants with 4.7s. Let’s use Florida, Texas and Georgia as examples. California schools are their own beast and just made huge admissions changes this year …. UNC admits no one, so.

The > 3.5 doesn’t hold your kid back from very competitive LACs or T20 if the rest of their package is very good. “Very good” need not mean URM or recruited athlete btw. There are a lot of kids this year not in those groups and not 3.9+ according to my son who will attend some very very top schools next year. Keeping it vague for their privacy

What about the UC schools? They are on our radar and I am afraid they won't look twice at my very hardworking and top student.

The above states that “UNC admits no one.” Apparently, that not exactly the case. Sidwell’s website shows that at least four Sidwell kids enrolled at UNC in the period 2018-2022. It could be more, but the website does not give exact numbers, on indicating where’re four or more enrolled at a particular school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell 2022/2023 school profile is public on their site and does not have class or grade distributions:
https://www.sidwell.edu/academics/college-counseling

Wait, is this the same one they send to colleges?

Because at the Fall meeting for senior parents, CCO said that parents can't see the college profile that Sidwell sends to schools. It was quickly followed by "this is an administrative decision" to deflect any further discussion.

It’s part of what they send. The part that reveals more or less where the kid stands in relation to peers is only shown to colleges. This may include the breakdown of grades in each math, history, English, etc class.

Please stop spreading false information. At least as of 2021 (and this year) there is no additional part sent to colleges, this is the profile sent along with the SFS transcript to all colleges. Ask your child's college counselor and they will tell you that Sidwell does not have any report that breakdowns grades in classes or gpa distributions at all. SFS does not even report a gpa on the transcript or on any documentation to colleges (like the secondary school report) except for applicants to the military academies because they require it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell 2022/2023 school profile is public on their site and does not have class or grade distributions:
https://www.sidwell.edu/academics/college-counseling

Wait, is this the same one they send to colleges?

Because at the Fall meeting for senior parents, CCO said that parents can't see the college profile that Sidwell sends to schools. It was quickly followed by "this is an administrative decision" to deflect any further discussion.

After the fall senior parent meeting, the profile became public and is now on the college counseling website at the link already posted in this thread. This is the first year the profile has been available for viewing by Sidwell parents as well as the general public.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell 2022/2023 school profile is public on their site and does not have class or grade distributions:
https://www.sidwell.edu/academics/college-counseling

Wait, is this the same one they send to colleges?

Because at the Fall meeting for senior parents, CCO said that parents can't see the college profile that Sidwell sends to schools. It was quickly followed by "this is an administrative decision" to deflect any further discussion.

It’s part of what they send. The part that reveals more or less where the kid stands in relation to peers is only shown to colleges. This may include the breakdown of grades in each math, history, English, etc class.

Please stop spreading false information. At least as of 2021 (and this year) there is no additional part sent to colleges, this is the profile sent along with the SFS transcript to all colleges. Ask your child's college counselor and they will tell you that Sidwell does not have any report that breakdowns grades in classes or gpa distributions at all. SFS does not even report a gpa on the transcript or on any documentation to colleges (like the secondary school report) except for applicants to the military academies because they require it.

This isn't right. The PP is correct about the break down/distributions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell 2022/2023 school profile is public on their site and does not have class or grade distributions:
https://www.sidwell.edu/academics/college-counseling

Wait, is this the same one they send to colleges?

Because at the Fall meeting for senior parents, CCO said that parents can't see the college profile that Sidwell sends to schools. It was quickly followed by "this is an administrative decision" to deflect any further discussion.

It’s part of what they send. The part that reveals more or less where the kid stands in relation to peers is only shown to colleges. This may include the breakdown of grades in each math, history, English, etc class.

Please stop spreading false information. At least as of 2021 (and this year) there is no additional part sent to colleges, this is the profile sent along with the SFS transcript to all colleges. Ask your child's college counselor and they will tell you that Sidwell does not have any report that breakdowns grades in classes or gpa distributions at all. SFS does not even report a gpa on the transcript or on any documentation to colleges (like the secondary school report) except for applicants to the military academies because they require it.

This isn't right. The PP is correct about the break down/distributions.

If your child attends Sidwell, ask your college counselor during your family meeting if there is a form sent to colleges with grade distributions for classes and gpas that goes along with the school profile.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell senior parent here of kid with slightly higher GPA. 3.7 is excellent for the school. Your DD is correct that there will be a handful of kids > 3.9, but it’s a tiny group in each grade for the reasons PP said.

Our experience this year is that these “low” compared to public schools GPAs only hold you back if you apply to giant public universities **that are unknown to Sidwell specifically** Places with a well worn pathway— Michigan, UVA, Wisconsin, W&M — are no issue. Problems arise with competitive flagships where kids from Sidwell never apply. They seem to take a dim view of a 3.7-3.9 compared to the thousands of applicants with 4.7s. Let’s use Florida, Texas and Georgia as examples. California schools are their own beast and just made huge admissions changes this year …. UNC admits no one, so.

The > 3.5 doesn’t hold your kid back from very competitive LACs or T20 if the rest of their package is very good. “Very good” need not mean URM or recruited athlete btw. There are a lot of kids this year not in those groups and not 3.9+ according to my son who will attend some very very top schools next year. Keeping it vague for their privacy

GDS parent here. I agree w/ all of this 100%. I have a 3.8 kid who guesstimates that there are 12-15 kids (out of a class of 150 ish) higher than them in GPA/GPA combined w/ rigor.

Few things to note on how colleges view this since we are going through it now: what is above is absolutely right. The very large state schools that arent used to Sidwell, NCS, GDS kids and dont have a long history of accepting them will not have context and will be VERY tough. UC schools in particular have become all but impossible for local private school kids.

Also Cali and other students take multiple AP / AP level courses and often take college classes too while in HS so they goose their weighted GPAs to 4.6+. at UCs, GPA is a major screen (look up the public report UC schools published last year on how they screen and these days they use AI to screen as well) ...and so that make Berkeley and UCLA very tough last 2-3 years for kids from Sidwell/GDS.

Many threads on this here and you can look up UC school admit rates by high school on UC portal. Evidence is all there. Plus taking more than 2 or max 3 UL or AP level or honors level classes at GDS/Sidwell in a semester is really a beat down. All but impossible. The public school and California kids finish HS with 7 to 14 AP courses and the boost that gives the kid on weighted GPA....plus UC schools dont count "Extended" classes at GDS as honors and dont weight those.

So anyway, long answer to 3.7 is very good. In an ideal world if you are gunning SLACs or Top 30, then I would say, SAT needs to be 1500+ or ACT 34-36 to take any question off the table. Or else a hook. Otherwise, it's just the usual lottery game and try to have some real target schools. Everything we early 90s college parents thought was a safety or target is now a reach for almost any kid.

Also at our school anything < 25% admit rate is considered reach.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The 4.0 in top rigor classes last year went to Stanford.
That GPA from Sidwell (or similar) is truly remarkable. It takes crazy diligence and a bit of luck as well (getting fair teachers). 95% skill, 5% luck.

90% skill + 10% luck.
And outside tutors

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The 4.0 in top rigor classes last year went to Stanford.
That GPA from Sidwell (or similar) is truly remarkable. It takes crazy diligence and a bit of luck as well (getting fair teachers). 95% skill, 5% luck.

90% skill + 10% luck.
And outside tutors

On top of the 50% of being born lucky.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sidwell senior parent here of kid with slightly higher GPA. 3.7 is excellent for the school. Your DD is correct that there will be a handful of kids > 3.9, but it’s a tiny group in each grade for the reasons PP said.

Our experience this year is that these “low” compared to public schools GPAs only hold you back if you apply to giant public universities **that are unknown to Sidwell specifically** Places with a well worn pathway— Michigan, UVA, Wisconsin, W&M — are no issue. Problems arise with competitive flagships where kids from Sidwell never apply. They seem to take a dim view of a 3.7-3.9 compared to the thousands of applicants with 4.7s. Let’s use Florida, Texas and Georgia as examples. California schools are their own beast and just made huge admissions changes this year …. UNC admits no one, so.

The > 3.5 doesn’t hold your kid back from very competitive LACs or T20 if the rest of their package is very good. “Very good” need not mean URM or recruited athlete btw. There are a lot of kids this year not in those groups and not 3.9+ according to my son who will attend some very very top schools next year. Keeping it vague for their privacy

GDS parent here. I agree w/ all of this 100%. I have a 3.8 kid who guesstimates that there are 12-15 kids (out of a class of 150 ish) higher than them in GPA/GPA combined w/ rigor.

Few things to note on how colleges view this since we are going through it now: what is above is absolutely right. The very large state schools that arent used to Sidwell, NCS, GDS kids and dont have a long history of accepting them will not have context and will be VERY tough. UC schools in particular have become all but impossible for local private school kids.

Also Cali and other students take multiple AP / AP level courses and often take college classes too while in HS so they goose their weighted GPAs to 4.6+. at UCs, GPA is a major screen (look up the public report UC schools published last year on how they screen and these days they use AI to screen as well) ...and so that make Berkeley and UCLA very tough last 2-3 years for kids from Sidwell/GDS.

Many threads on this here and you can look up UC school admit rates by high school on UC portal. Evidence is all there. Plus taking more than 2 or max 3 UL or AP level or honors level classes at GDS/Sidwell in a semester is really a beat down. All but impossible. The public school and California kids finish HS with 7 to 14 AP courses and the boost that gives the kid on weighted GPA....plus UC schools dont count "Extended" classes at GDS as honors and dont weight those.

So anyway, long answer to 3.7 is very good. In an ideal world if you are gunning SLACs or Top 30, then I would say, SAT needs to be 1500+ or ACT 34-36 to take any question off the table. Or else a hook. Otherwise, it's just the usual lottery game and try to have some real target schools. Everything we early 90s college parents thought was a safety or target is now a reach for almost any kid.

Also at our school anything < 25% admit rate is considered reach.

What types of schools is your kid applying to?
If you're not comfortable naming them maybe add in some that are similar. Thank you!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You are right to be concerned.

This year's senior class is a cautionary tale. The school's rampant grade deflation is a huge problem. You may think a 3.7 is "sidwell good," but no college cares. Top colleges need to see a 3.9. When colleges get 50k applications, do you really think they care that sidwell grades tough? Nope.

The kids with sky high GPAs did great this year. the 3.7's not so much.

This is patently false. The school profile that goes with the Guidance Office recommendation provides a full curriculum assessment and places the applicant in context of the current and past year standing. The Admissions officers (and regional officers for the bigger schools) understand this context, and will place the grades and grade point in the proper context as it weigh applicants from a variety of background. The deflation doesn't matter.

Does the profile provide ranges for GPAs? Our school's does not. It does provide summary SAT/ACT/AP info and a list of all classes offered.

Sidwell does not make its profile available to anyone, so no one can answer that question. It's another aspect of their total lack of transparency.

Here is the Sidwell profile. https://resources.finalsite.net/images/v1668526756/sidwell/r6wrcvyaremtnq3fdvag/2022CollegeProfile0927.pdf

[Anonymous]

This is how the UC’s decide how to give credit for weighted classes when calculating GPA for out of state honors classes:

Honors courses are calculated differently. In calculating an out-of-state student's GPA to determine if the 3.4 minimum has been met, UC will grant honors weight for AP or IB courses only, but not for school-designated honors courses.

So it if state schools without classes designated as AP or IB means a student can’t have a UC weighted GPA over 4.0. Other applicants have far above a 4.0 at schools that have AP classes.