Daycare caregivers masking with infants

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OH NO! A poster said something wasn’t perfect about daycare!!! Call troll! Call her insane! This is DCUM and everything about daycare is perfect and wonderful! Daycare is better than anything in the world!!

+1. So true.

Nobody said that you losers

Stop embarrassing yourself, PP.

I have a child in daycare and that is absolutely the DCUM sentiment and you know it.

+1. I like daycare. I also see the value of SAH parents and nannies with young kids. All have pros and cons. Not sure why that sentiment is controversial?

You're arguing against a straw man. Who said there are no cons to daycare? Nobody on this thread.

[Anonymous]

If there are no o developmental or emotional drawbacks to teachers and daycare workers being masked, I wonder if it will continue post-covid. It would certainly cut down and on colds and flus among the teachers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If there are no o developmental or emotional drawbacks to teachers and daycare workers being masked, I wonder if it will continue post-covid. It would certainly cut down and on colds and flus among the teachers.

Masking the teachers would protect the kids from the teachers like a surgeon’s mask protect the patient from the surgeon or a masked dentist from his patient. I wouldn’t be opposed if daycare childcare providers stayed masked (if there was no harm to the babies).

I’m hoping waiters and food preparers keep masking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If there are no o developmental or emotional drawbacks to teachers and daycare workers being masked, I wonder if it will continue post-covid. It would certainly cut down and on colds and flus among the teachers.

I really doubt there's no drawback. I think most people saying 'your kid will be OK just like our kids are' say this in order to be reassuring. I.e., she can rest easy and doesn't have to be super anxious about it because it's probably not going to be devastating in a life altering type of way. That's not the same thing as saying the kid wouldn't be better off if there were no masks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If there are no o developmental or emotional drawbacks to teachers and daycare workers being masked, I wonder if it will continue post-covid. It would certainly cut down and on colds and flus among the teachers.

Masking the teachers would protect the kids from the teachers like a surgeon’s mask protect the patient from the surgeon or a masked dentist from his patient. I wouldn’t be opposed if daycare childcare providers stayed masked (if there was no harm to the babies).

I’m hoping waiters and food preparers keep masking.

Do you not fact check anything? Surgeons and dentists do not mask to protect themselves and others from respiratory pathogens.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4480558/

"An increasingly prevalent belief, in favour of mask usage, is the idea that they also confer some degree of protection to the operating staff from patient-derived infectious material.18 Most obviously, they can act as a physical barrier against blood and bodily fluid splashes during surgery. One prospective study revealed that facemasks prevented blood/bodily fluid splashes that would have otherwise contaminated the surgeon’s face in 24% of procedures.19 The incidence of blood/bodily fluid splashes varies substantially between settings and between individuals. The risk is modified by the role of surgical staff (lead surgeons are at higher risk than first assistants, who in turn have a higher risk than scrub nurses),

"The use of surgical facemasks is ubiquitous in surgical practice. Facemasks have long been thought to confer protection to the patient from wound infection and contamination from the operating surgeon and other members of the surgical staff. More recently, protection of the theatre staff from patient-derived blood/bodily fluid splashes has also been offered as a reason for their continued use. In light of current NHS budget constraints and cost-cutting strategies, we examined the evidence base behind the use of surgical facemasks.

Examination of the literature revealed much of the published work on the matter to be quite dated and often studies had poorly elucidated methodologies. As a result, we recommend caution in extrapolating their findings to contemporary surgical practice. However, overall there is a lack of substantial evidence to support claims that facemasks protect either patient or surgeon from infectious contamination. More rigorous contemporary research is needed to make a definitive comment on the effectiveness of surgical facemasks."

So you are advocating for masking along the lines of social class, or do you want to include children who lack agency as well?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If there are no o developmental or emotional drawbacks to teachers and daycare workers being masked, I wonder if it will continue post-covid. It would certainly cut down and on colds and flus among the teachers.

Masking the teachers would protect the kids from the teachers like a surgeon’s mask protect the patient from the surgeon or a masked dentist from his patient. I wouldn’t be opposed if daycare childcare providers stayed masked (if there was no harm to the babies).

I’m hoping waiters and food preparers keep masking.

Do you not fact check anything? Surgeons and dentists do not mask to protect themselves and others from respiratory pathogens.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4480558/

"An increasingly prevalent belief, in favour of mask usage, is the idea that they also confer some degree of protection to the operating staff from patient-derived infectious material.18 Most obviously, they can act as a physical barrier against blood and bodily fluid splashes during surgery. One prospective study revealed that facemasks prevented blood/bodily fluid splashes that would have otherwise contaminated the surgeon’s face in 24% of procedures.19 The incidence of blood/bodily fluid splashes varies substantially between settings and between individuals. The risk is modified by the role of surgical staff (lead surgeons are at higher risk than first assistants, who in turn have a higher risk than scrub nurses),

"The use of surgical facemasks is ubiquitous in surgical practice. Facemasks have long been thought to confer protection to the patient from wound infection and contamination from the operating surgeon and other members of the surgical staff. More recently, protection of the theatre staff from patient-derived blood/bodily fluid splashes has also been offered as a reason for their continued use. In light of current NHS budget constraints and cost-cutting strategies, we examined the evidence base behind the use of surgical facemasks.

Examination of the literature revealed much of the published work on the matter to be quite dated and often studies had poorly elucidated methodologies. As a result, we recommend caution in extrapolating their findings to contemporary surgical practice. However, overall there is a lack of substantial evidence to support claims that facemasks protect either patient or surgeon from infectious contamination. More rigorous contemporary research is needed to make a definitive comment on the effectiveness of surgical facemasks."

So you are advocating for masking along the lines of social class, or do you want to include children who lack agency as well?

You’re saying the same thing as the PP. Like surgeons, masking teachers would protect the kids.

[Anonymous]

I doubt surgeon, surgical staffs, and dentists will drop masking anytime soon.

And what social class are they in?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If there are no o developmental or emotional drawbacks to teachers and daycare workers being masked, I wonder if it will continue post-covid. It would certainly cut down and on colds and flus among the teachers.

Masking the teachers would protect the kids from the teachers like a surgeon’s mask protect the patient from the surgeon or a masked dentist from his patient. I wouldn’t be opposed if daycare childcare providers stayed masked (if there was no harm to the babies).

I’m hoping waiters and food preparers keep masking.

Do you not fact check anything? Surgeons and dentists do not mask to protect themselves and others from respiratory pathogens.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4480558/

"An increasingly prevalent belief, in favour of mask usage, is the idea that they also confer some degree of protection to the operating staff from patient-derived infectious material.18 Most obviously, they can act as a physical barrier against blood and bodily fluid splashes during surgery. One prospective study revealed that facemasks prevented blood/bodily fluid splashes that would have otherwise contaminated the surgeon’s face in 24% of procedures.19 The incidence of blood/bodily fluid splashes varies substantially between settings and between individuals. The risk is modified by the role of surgical staff (lead surgeons are at higher risk than first assistants, who in turn have a higher risk than scrub nurses),

"The use of surgical facemasks is ubiquitous in surgical practice. Facemasks have long been thought to confer protection to the patient from wound infection and contamination from the operating surgeon and other members of the surgical staff. More recently, protection of the theatre staff from patient-derived blood/bodily fluid splashes has also been offered as a reason for their continued use. In light of current NHS budget constraints and cost-cutting strategies, we examined the evidence base behind the use of surgical facemasks.

Examination of the literature revealed much of the published work on the matter to be quite dated and often studies had poorly elucidated methodologies. As a result, we recommend caution in extrapolating their findings to contemporary surgical practice. However, overall there is a lack of substantial evidence to support claims that facemasks protect either patient or surgeon from infectious contamination. More rigorous contemporary research is needed to make a definitive comment on the effectiveness of surgical facemasks."

So you are advocating for masking along the lines of social class, or do you want to include children who lack agency as well?

You’re saying the same thing as the PP. Like surgeons, masking teachers would protect the kids.

DP. No, PP is saying surgeons use masks to protect against blood and bodily fluid splashes, not respiratory pathogens. Obviously, a surgeon is more at risk of splashes of infectious bodily fluids like blood, than a daycare teacher (urine is sterile and poop is unlikely to splash on a teacher's face, though I'm sure it has happened).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I doubt surgeon, surgical staffs, and dentists will drop masking anytime soon.

And what social class are they in?

They do not mask to protect themselves from respiratory viruses is the point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If there are no o developmental or emotional drawbacks to teachers and daycare workers being masked, I wonder if it will continue post-covid. It would certainly cut down and on colds and flus among the teachers.

Masking the teachers would protect the kids from the teachers like a surgeon’s mask protect the patient from the surgeon or a masked dentist from his patient. I wouldn’t be opposed if daycare childcare providers stayed masked (if there was no harm to the babies).

I’m hoping waiters and food preparers keep masking.

Do you not fact check anything? Surgeons and dentists do not mask to protect themselves and others from respiratory pathogens.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4480558/

"An increasingly prevalent belief, in favour of mask usage, is the idea that they also confer some degree of protection to the operating staff from patient-derived infectious material.18 Most obviously, they can act as a physical barrier against blood and bodily fluid splashes during surgery. One prospective study revealed that facemasks prevented blood/bodily fluid splashes that would have otherwise contaminated the surgeon’s face in 24% of procedures.19 The incidence of blood/bodily fluid splashes varies substantially between settings and between individuals. The risk is modified by the role of surgical staff (lead surgeons are at higher risk than first assistants, who in turn have a higher risk than scrub nurses),

"The use of surgical facemasks is ubiquitous in surgical practice. Facemasks have long been thought to confer protection to the patient from wound infection and contamination from the operating surgeon and other members of the surgical staff. More recently, protection of the theatre staff from patient-derived blood/bodily fluid splashes has also been offered as a reason for their continued use. In light of current NHS budget constraints and cost-cutting strategies, we examined the evidence base behind the use of surgical facemasks.

Examination of the literature revealed much of the published work on the matter to be quite dated and often studies had poorly elucidated methodologies. As a result, we recommend caution in extrapolating their findings to contemporary surgical practice. However, overall there is a lack of substantial evidence to support claims that facemasks protect either patient or surgeon from infectious contamination. More rigorous contemporary research is needed to make a definitive comment on the effectiveness of surgical facemasks."

So you are advocating for masking along the lines of social class, or do you want to include children who lack agency as well?

You’re saying the same thing as the PP. Like surgeons, masking teachers would protect the kids.

DP. No, PP is saying surgeons use masks to protect against blood and bodily fluid splashes, not respiratory pathogens. Obviously, a surgeon is more at risk of splashes of infectious bodily fluids like blood, than a daycare teacher (urine is sterile and poop is unlikely to splash on a teacher's face, though I'm sure it has happened).

So mask during diaper changes. Definitely wear gloves.

[Anonymous]

I worked in a daycare. The babies sneeze, cough, and spit up on you. Also, a few times every teacher gets vomited on by a sick child. A few times we had a sick toddler who vomits all over the place before the parents could come and get him, all within 1 hr after we called them, and we have to literally disinfect the entire place. I am more worried about teachers since parents NEVER care and just send a sick child to daycare even if they know he may be sick (like oh, no big deal, he threw up once this morning, must have choked and just threw up once, nothing bad), and then it turns out the child has a stomach virus and all teachers sick next day. So, no, not just diaper change exposure but every single minute teachers are exposed and if parent ignores covid symptoms of their child (oh it's just runny nose, who caress), that's it, the teachers will be exposed no matter what unless they wear N95s all day which is not possible. Why the whole nation does not make weekly tasting obligatory for any child under 12 attending any school, it's beyond my comprehension. We could be out of pandemic in months with weekly testing of all kids in schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I worked in a daycare. The babies sneeze, cough, and spit up on you. Also, a few times every teacher gets vomited on by a sick child. A few times we had a sick toddler who vomits all over the place before the parents could come and get him, all within 1 hr after we called them, and we have to literally disinfect the entire place. I am more worried about teachers since parents NEVER care and just send a sick child to daycare even if they know he may be sick (like oh, no big deal, he threw up once this morning, must have choked and just threw up once, nothing bad), and then it turns out the child has a stomach virus and all teachers sick next day. So, no, not just diaper change exposure but every single minute teachers are exposed and if parent ignores covid symptoms of their child (oh it's just runny nose, who caress), that's it, the teachers will be exposed no matter what unless they wear N95s all day which is not possible. Why the whole nation does not make weekly tasting obligatory for any child under 12 attending any school, it's beyond my comprehension. We could be out of pandemic in months with weekly testing of all kids in schools.

No, we can't test our way out of the pandemic unfortunately, and certainly not by just testing children under 12. The tests are imperfect (even PCR), plus with the delays in results mean the virus still spreads. I don't doubt it would help to do weekly testing but it would not end the pandemic.

Nurses wear N95s all day. There also isn't a shortage of N95s (https://www.npr.org/2021/06/25/1009858893/u-s-companies-shifted-to-make-n95-respirators-during-covid-now-theyre-struggling ). The problem is they are uncomfortable and expensive.

[Anonymous]

Here's the thing. Humans are exceedingly adaptable. The baby isn't going to just not see mouths and think, "guess I just don't know what's going on" and play with his feet for the rest of his life. I think we may end up with a generation that is really good at reading face and body language because they don't have the luxury of the mouth and lower part of the face. Who knows. There's really nothing to do but keep moving forward.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here's the thing. Humans are exceedingly adaptable. The baby isn't going to just not see mouths and think, "guess I just don't know what's going on" and play with his feet for the rest of his life. I think we may end up with a generation that is really good at reading face and body language because they don't have the luxury of the mouth and lower part of the face. Who knows. There's really nothing to do but keep moving forward.

Or we could recommend that people caring for non-verbal toddlers wear clear masks or face shields. There are other options you know. And it is far from clear that there are not going to be negative outcomes for some kids because of masking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I worked in a daycare. The babies sneeze, cough, and spit up on you. Also, a few times every teacher gets vomited on by a sick child. A few times we had a sick toddler who vomits all over the place before the parents could come and get him, all within 1 hr after we called them, and we have to literally disinfect the entire place. I am more worried about teachers since parents NEVER care and just send a sick child to daycare even if they know he may be sick (like oh, no big deal, he threw up once this morning, must have choked and just threw up once, nothing bad), and then it turns out the child has a stomach virus and all teachers sick next day. So, no, not just diaper change exposure but every single minute teachers are exposed and if parent ignores covid symptoms of their child (oh it's just runny nose, who caress), that's it, the teachers will be exposed no matter what unless they wear N95s all day which is not possible. Why the whole nation does not make weekly tasting obligatory for any child under 12 attending any school, it's beyond my comprehension. We could be out of pandemic in months with weekly testing of all kids in schools.

No, we can't test our way out of the pandemic unfortunately, and certainly not by just testing children under 12. The tests are imperfect (even PCR), plus with the delays in results mean the virus still spreads. I don't doubt it would help to do weekly testing but it would not end the pandemic.

Nurses wear N95s all day. There also isn't a shortage of N95s (https://www.npr.org/2021/06/25/1009858893/u-s-companies-shifted-to-make-n95-respirators-during-covid-now-theyre-struggling ). The problem is they are uncomfortable and expensive.

And they have to be fit tested. Here, the title says it all:
“ More than half of front-line healthcare workers unknowingly used an N95/P2 mask without adequate airborne protection: An audit in a tertiary institution”
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34325537/

Germany mandated medical grade masks in January. Cases have continued to rise.