What the Lancet says about near death experiences

[Anonymous]

PP with the NDE mom here --

I think you have to allow for the individual's socially and culturally influenced interpretation of the NDE after awakening.

Raymond Moody has collected many stories of NDEs from people of all/no faiths, and each person tends to assign meaning to the experience that aligns with his or her belief system. Some felt the presence of God, some of Jesus, some of departed family. A few even felt they experienced "Hell."

It's like remembering and explaining a dream -- a lot is lost/twisted in the telling.

[Anonymous]

To the PP who asked about the miracles: well, I don't think it is necessary to believe in the virgin birth to believe in God, and to follow Jesus. So I don't get hung up on it. But if God did cause a virgin birth, I'd guess that it happened in a material way. Babies and pregnancies are flesh and blood, biological. Jesus needed an egg and a placenta and the rest. But really, faith for me becomes much more logical when you stop needing to believe in literal miracles. The point, the purpose, the moral of the story, is rarely in the miracle itself, but in the story arc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP with the NDE mom here --

I think you have to allow for the individual's socially and culturally influenced interpretation of the NDE after awakening.

Raymond Moody has collected many stories of NDEs from people of all/no faiths, and each person tends to assign meaning to the experience that aligns with his or her belief system. Some felt the presence of God, some of Jesus, some of departed family. A few even felt they experienced "Hell."

It's like remembering and explaining a dream -- a lot is lost/twisted in the telling.

It would be interesting to do a study of brain waves during NDE's -- to see if they are basically all the same, or differ by religion or other factors.

I've heard that studies done with different types of religious meditators (Buddhist/Catholic monks) show exactly the same kind of activity in the same location in the brain -- indicating that it's a mental thing, not a religious thing,

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To the PP who asked about the miracles: well, I don't think it is necessary to believe in the virgin birth to believe in God, and to follow Jesus. So I don't get hung up on it. But if God did cause a virgin birth, I'd guess that it happened in a material way. Babies and pregnancies are flesh and blood, biological. Jesus needed an egg and a placenta and the rest. But really, faith for me becomes much more logical when you stop needing to believe in literal miracles. The point, the purpose, the moral of the story, is rarely in the miracle itself, but in the story arc.

You don't have to believe in the virgin birth or any of the miracles to "follow" Jesus, or any other human philosopher or teacher. It gets a little confusing, though when God is brought into it. If God is not supernatural, what is it? What is the relationship of your God to the Jesus that you follow?

[Anonymous]

I don't know what God is. Do you? I believe Jesus was uniquely filled with God, and made of God. And so I do my best to follow Jesus' teachings. If I had been born in a family that followed the Buddha I'd probably be doing my best to follow him, instead. But Jesus is my path to God.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know what God is. Do you? I believe Jesus was uniquely filled with God, and made of God. And so I do my best to follow Jesus' teachings. If I had been born in a family that followed the Buddha I'd probably be doing my best to follow him, instead. But Jesus is my path to God.

You don't know what God is, but you think Jesus is your path to whatever it is, is that right? How did you reach this conclusion

Do you know where you got your idea that Jesus was uniquely filled with God and made of God? I'm guessing in a Christian church that taught Jesus was the son of god, sent to redeem humans of their sins. Bu that God was definitely supernatural and so was his son.

[Anonymous]

My grandmother had this happen when she had a heart issue - similar to the Lancet article - she was in the upper corner of the room watching them work on her. She told me about it and I did question if there was anything "religious" about it - she said no - she didn't go to the tunnel, see white light or feel the presence of anyone. If I recall correctly, she wasn't devoutly religious and has some ambiguous feelings about Christianity.

DH's mom however had some NDEs with her severe breathing issues (died in her early 60s) where her dead son came to visit and said it wasn't her time yet during one episode.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My grandmother had this happen when she had a heart issue - similar to the Lancet article - she was in the upper corner of the room watching them work on her. She told me about it and I did question if there was anything "religious" about it - she said no - she didn't go to the tunnel, see white light or feel the presence of anyone. If I recall correctly, she wasn't devoutly religious and has some ambiguous feelings about Christianity.

DH's mom however had some NDEs with her severe breathing issues (died in her early 60s) where her dead son came to visit and said it wasn't her time yet during one episode.

It's starting to sound quite individual, based on cultural beliefs and personal experiences. Sort of like dreams. People have them and will talk about them to their friends, but rarely do they "believe" them, as coming from God or indicating evidence for specific religious belief. Dreams mean something - to the person having them.

there are some generic dreams that a lot of people have - of flying or running away from danger or having sex. They seem real, but when the dram is over people don't think they actually happened.

[Anonymous]

I don't think that most people with NDEs equate them with dreams. My NDE (when I was 24), felt more real, and changed me a bit. I had no idea it was an NDE. When I read up on NDEs of others 15 yrs later, I knew thats what I had. Usually in dreams people are not clinically dead either. The brain can not dream during death. But I can see how to others who can not explain it, it may be thought of as a dream.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't think that most people with NDEs equate them with dreams. My NDE (when I was 24), felt more real, and changed me a bit. I had no idea it was an NDE. When I read up on NDEs of others 15 yrs later, I knew thats what I had. Usually in dreams people are not clinically dead either. The brain can not dream during death. But I can see how to others who can not explain it, it may be thought of as a dream.

How did it change you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't think that most people with NDEs equate them with dreams. My NDE (when I was 24), felt more real, and changed me a bit. I had no idea it was an NDE. When I read up on NDEs of others 15 yrs later, I knew thats what I had. Usually in dreams people are not clinically dead either. The brain can not dream during death. But I can see how to others who can not explain it, it may be thought of as a dream.

How did it change you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP with the NDE mom here --

I think you have to allow for the individual's socially and culturally influenced interpretation of the NDE after awakening.

Raymond Moody has collected many stories of NDEs from people of all/no faiths, and each person tends to assign meaning to the experience that aligns with his or her belief system. Some felt the presence of God, some of Jesus, some of departed family. A few even felt they experienced "Hell."

It's like remembering and explaining a dream -- a lot is lost/twisted in the telling.

It would be interesting to do a study of brain waves during NDE's -- to see if they are basically all the same, or differ by religion or other factors.

I've heard that studies done with different types of religious meditators (Buddhist/Catholic monks) show exactly the same kind of activity in the same location in the brain -- indicating that it's a mental thing, not a religious thing,

I might be wrong but this was done, many times I think. There are no brain waves during an NDE. This is what perplexes doctors. And why the Lancet wrote about NDE's- medical science can not explain the phenomena yet there is clearly some consciousness after death.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think that most people with NDEs equate them with dreams. My NDE (when I was 24), felt more real, and changed me a bit. I had no idea it was an NDE. When I read up on NDEs of others 15 yrs later, I knew thats what I had. Usually in dreams people are not clinically dead either. The brain can not dream during death. But I can see how to others who can not explain it, it may be thought of as a dream.

How did it change you?

I was young and never spiritual or religious. My therapist said I was anorexic and my weight kept plummeting. She used to weigh me at every appointment. At the last appointment before my NDE, she said if I lost one more pound she would have to admit me to the hospital. It was a very painful time for me as my boyfriend of five yrs had just dumped me and quickly began seeing other girls. I lost all appetite and lost 27 lbs in one summer. I never considered that anorexia. Depression, maybe. But I was already thin to begin with and losing 27 lbs really weakened me to the point of making even breathing difficult. Anyhow, I changed over the course of time. I learned to value myself and not let anyone affect my sense of self worth. I learned that intentionally denying my body nourishment was tantamount to suicide and my life is not mine to take at will. God had a purpose for my life and there was reason for my suffering. However, I was not told the reason and was asked to trust God's plan. At the time I could not fathom a future life. But I got through that time, and met a wonderful man who I have now been married to for 15 yrs. Overall, I learned to trust God and not take the bad in life too seriously. I learned we are like travelers through life, and its a very short trip anyway. My real home is in the after life. I learned God will remove any memory of hardship we suffered in our life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think that most people with NDEs equate them with dreams. My NDE (when I was 24), felt more real, and changed me a bit. I had no idea it was an NDE. When I read up on NDEs of others 15 yrs later, I knew thats what I had. Usually in dreams people are not clinically dead either. The brain can not dream during death. But I can see how to others who can not explain it, it may be thought of as a dream.

How did it change you?

I was young and never spiritual or religious. My therapist said I was anorexic and my weight kept plummeting. She used to weigh me at every appointment. At the last appointment before my NDE, she said if I lost one more pound she would have to admit me to the hospital. It was a very painful time for me as my boyfriend of five yrs had just dumped me and quickly began seeing other girls. I lost all appetite and lost 27 lbs in one summer. I never considered that anorexia. Depression, maybe. But I was already thin to begin with and losing 27 lbs really weakened me to the point of making even breathing difficult. Anyhow, I changed over the course of time. I learned to value myself and not let anyone affect my sense of self worth. I learned that intentionally denying my body nourishment was tantamount to suicide and my life is not mine to take at will. God had a purpose for my life and there was reason for my suffering. However, I was not told the reason and was asked to trust God's plan. At the time I could not fathom a future life. But I got through that time, and met a wonderful man who I have now been married to for 15 yrs. Overall, I learned to trust God and not take the bad in life too seriously. I learned we are like travelers through life, and its a very short trip anyway. My real home is in the after life. I learned God will remove any memory of hardship we suffered in our life.

Fascinating -- Are you saying this came to you during your NDE?

[Anonymous]

Nderf.org has a ton of incredible accounts. Be prepared to get sucked in!