How do you relate Faith vs. Grace to experiences in your life?

[Anonymous]

I don't connect grace to specific events but rather to my self and my state of being. Grace to me is like getting an unexpected special bonus gift. If you got it all the time, it would no longer to unexpected or special or a gift. I see it as a bonus gift that goes along with having a personal relationship with JC.

To me grace is when I am going through something difficult and God just fills my heart and mine with peace. It doesn't mean the difficulty is gone but that I have a stillness, a calmness and a peace that encompasses me. Other times I really have to work hard to get to a place of peace and calm and I may never get there or I partially get there then something happens and my peace is gone. The gift of peace is just amazing compared to the hard earned peace so I consider it grace.

Same might be true of forgiveness. Sometimes when I am burdened by guilt or shame, it is just lifted from me. Gone. I have wrestled with the feelings related to an issue for a long time to have all those feelings just vanish in an instant and never return. That is grace. Other times I have to really work and wallow through the guilt or shame or pain and slowly figure it out and come out the other side, often still with lingering feelings.

Faith to me is just trust. Not trust that certain things will or won't happen but trust in a relationship. So far in my 40 years of living nothing I have accomplished, noting I have desired, nothing I have acquired, nothing I have experienced compares to my relationship with JC so I have trust or faith in Him and in that relationship. And that relationship is founded on faith.

I don't believe that God ever promised a smooth easy life. He promised strength, rest, peace, love, grace, light, and to be there with us as we go through the highs and lows, the peaks and valleys of life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't connect grace to specific events but rather to my self and my state of being. Grace to me is like getting an unexpected special bonus gift. If you got it all the time, it would no longer to unexpected or special or a gift. I see it as a bonus gift that goes along with having a personal relationship with JC.

To me grace is when I am going through something difficult and God just fills my heart and mine with peace. It doesn't mean the difficulty is gone but that I have a stillness, a calmness and a peace that encompasses me. Other times I really have to work hard to get to a place of peace and calm and I may never get there or I partially get there then something happens and my peace is gone. The gift of peace is just amazing compared to the hard earned peace so I consider it grace.

Same might be true of forgiveness. Sometimes when I am burdened by guilt or shame, it is just lifted from me. Gone. I have wrestled with the feelings related to an issue for a long time to have all those feelings just vanish in an instant and never return. That is grace. Other times I have to really work and wallow through the guilt or shame or pain and slowly figure it out and come out the other side, often still with lingering feelings.

Faith to me is just trust. Not trust that certain things will or won't happen but trust in a relationship. So far in my 40 years of living nothing I have accomplished, noting I have desired, nothing I have acquired, nothing I have experienced compares to my relationship with JC so I have trust or faith in Him and in that relationship. And that relationship is founded on faith.

I don't believe that God ever promised a smooth easy life. He promised strength, rest, peace, love, grace, light, and to be there with us as we go through the highs and lows, the peaks and valleys of life.

I get all of that without JC.

Also, I have my family and friends (and nurses and doctors and public servants, when needed) to be there for me - and they are actually visible and can provide concrete assistance.

[Anonymous]

NP here. That's nice for you 11:38 PP, but I am far from the only person who has gone through parts of life without family or friends and with nobody to turn to, but personally I feel at those times I was sustained by grace. Didn't really have faith at those times either. Being sustained through very difficult passages built my faith.

Nothing you could opine would really impact my assessment of my personal experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is Grace the indescribable feeling of forgiveness and faith more the action on the part of the person?

Would Faith be believing you will have a child after experiencing infertility?

OP, I do not believe that this is an example of faith. It may be your hope, but just because we want something very badly does not mean that it will come to pass. You have hope, but not faith, in this situation.

Faith is trusting that no matter what happens, God's will is perfect and will be fulfilled in your life, no matter what the circumstances.

According to this line of thinking, all the praying in the world to have a baby won't work if God, in his perfect will, doesn't want it to happen. He has his reasons and you won't understand them until you get to heaven -- if you're good.

I believe that is true, but only to a point. Remember that ultimately, we are supposed to be praying "thy will be done." Of course God wants to hear our deepest desires and wants, and understands more fully than any human ever could the longing to have a child. He created us, after all. I know this: If it still doesn't work out, despite hours/ years of prayer, God will provide comfort and the peace that passes all understanding, as He shows us the way that He has for our lives.

And going to Heave, BTW, is not about being "good." It is about chosing to follow Jesus Christ all the way to the cross, and to Heaven for eternity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't connect grace to specific events but rather to my self and my state of being. Grace to me is like getting an unexpected special bonus gift. If you got it all the time, it would no longer to unexpected or special or a gift. I see it as a bonus gift that goes along with having a personal relationship with JC.

To me grace is when I am going through something difficult and God just fills my heart and mine with peace. It doesn't mean the difficulty is gone but that I have a stillness, a calmness and a peace that encompasses me. Other times I really have to work hard to get to a place of peace and calm and I may never get there or I partially get there then something happens and my peace is gone. The gift of peace is just amazing compared to the hard earned peace so I consider it grace.

Same might be true of forgiveness. Sometimes when I am burdened by guilt or shame, it is just lifted from me. Gone. I have wrestled with the feelings related to an issue for a long time to have all those feelings just vanish in an instant and never return. That is grace. Other times I have to really work and wallow through the guilt or shame or pain and slowly figure it out and come out the other side, often still with lingering feelings.

Faith to me is just trust. Not trust that certain things will or won't happen but trust in a relationship. So far in my 40 years of living nothing I have accomplished, noting I have desired, nothing I have acquired, nothing I have experienced compares to my relationship with JC so I have trust or faith in Him and in that relationship. And that relationship is founded on faith.

I don't believe that God ever promised a smooth easy life. He promised strength, rest, peace, love, grace, light, and to be there with us as we go through the highs and lows, the peaks and valleys of life.

I get all of that without JC.

Also, I have my family and friends (and nurses and doctors and public servants, when needed) to be there for me - and they are actually visible and can provide concrete assistance.

I am the Pp you are quoting and I also have great family and friends and many others there to support me and provide assistance. None of that even remotely comes close to what I get from JC. Basically if you only have had the experience of friends and family then you can't compare the two. My relationship with JC is obviously a faith-based one and not the same as how I relate to the people who are around me, - they compliment each other.

I have a pretty great life and a strong support network. It isn't to fill something missing in my life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't connect grace to specific events but rather to my self and my state of being. Grace to me is like getting an unexpected special bonus gift. If you got it all the time, it would no longer to unexpected or special or a gift. I see it as a bonus gift that goes along with having a personal relationship with JC.

To me grace is when I am going through something difficult and God just fills my heart and mine with peace. It doesn't mean the difficulty is gone but that I have a stillness, a calmness and a peace that encompasses me. Other times I really have to work hard to get to a place of peace and calm and I may never get there or I partially get there then something happens and my peace is gone. The gift of peace is just amazing compared to the hard earned peace so I consider it grace.

Same might be true of forgiveness. Sometimes when I am burdened by guilt or shame, it is just lifted from me. Gone. I have wrestled with the feelings related to an issue for a long time to have all those feelings just vanish in an instant and never return. That is grace. Other times I have to really work and wallow through the guilt or shame or pain and slowly figure it out and come out the other side, often still with lingering feelings.

Faith to me is just trust. Not trust that certain things will or won't happen but trust in a relationship. So far in my 40 years of living nothing I have accomplished, noting I have desired, nothing I have acquired, nothing I have experienced compares to my relationship with JC so I have trust or faith in Him and in that relationship. And that relationship is founded on faith.

I don't believe that God ever promised a smooth easy life. He promised strength, rest, peace, love, grace, light, and to be there with us as we go through the highs and lows, the peaks and valleys of life.

I get all of that without JC.

Also, I have my family and friends (and nurses and doctors and public servants, when needed) to be there for me - and they are actually visible and can provide concrete assistance.

Perhaps. For now, maybe. But there will come a time in your life -- if you're lucky, and live long enough -- that you will need more than what you are getting from these family members and friends. Or they may no longer be there for you. And ultimately, they will disappoint you, because they are only human too. And, they can't provide eternal life and the route to God the Father.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is Grace the indescribable feeling of forgiveness and faith more the action on the part of the person?

Would Faith be believing you will have a child after experiencing infertility?

OP, I do not believe that this is an example of faith. It may be your hope, but just because we want something very badly does not mean that it will come to pass. You have hope, but not faith, in this situation.

Faith is trusting that no matter what happens, God's will is perfect and will be fulfilled in your life, no matter what the circumstances.

According to this line of thinking, all the praying in the world to have a baby won't work if God, in his perfect will, doesn't want it to happen. He has his reasons and you won't understand them until you get to heaven -- if you're good.

so birth control is pointless because if God wants conception to result, it will?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is Grace the indescribable feeling of forgiveness and faith more the action on the part of the person?

Would Faith be believing you will have a child after experiencing infertility?

OP, I do not believe that this is an example of faith. It may be your hope, but just because we want something very badly does not mean that it will come to pass. You have hope, but not faith, in this situation.

Faith is trusting that no matter what happens, God's will is perfect and will be fulfilled in your life, no matter what the circumstances.

According to this line of thinking, all the praying in the world to have a baby won't work if God, in his perfect will, doesn't want it to happen. He has his reasons and you won't understand them until you get to heaven -- if you're good.

so birth control is pointless because if God wants conception to result, it will?

Please don't twist my words around. We were talking about infertility and wanting a baby. Of course contraception is important, if appropriate in family planning. It yet another tool God has given us through medicine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't connect grace to specific events but rather to my self and my state of being. Grace to me is like getting an unexpected special bonus gift. If you got it all the time, it would no longer to unexpected or special or a gift. I see it as a bonus gift that goes along with having a personal relationship with JC.

To me grace is when I am going through something difficult and God just fills my heart and mine with peace. It doesn't mean the difficulty is gone but that I have a stillness, a calmness and a peace that encompasses me. Other times I really have to work hard to get to a place of peace and calm and I may never get there or I partially get there then something happens and my peace is gone. The gift of peace is just amazing compared to the hard earned peace so I consider it grace.

Same might be true of forgiveness. Sometimes when I am burdened by guilt or shame, it is just lifted from me. Gone. I have wrestled with the feelings related to an issue for a long time to have all those feelings just vanish in an instant and never return. That is grace. Other times I have to really work and wallow through the guilt or shame or pain and slowly figure it out and come out the other side, often still with lingering feelings.

Faith to me is just trust. Not trust that certain things will or won't happen but trust in a relationship. So far in my 40 years of living nothing I have accomplished, noting I have desired, nothing I have acquired, nothing I have experienced compares to my relationship with JC so I have trust or faith in Him and in that relationship. And that relationship is founded on faith.

I don't believe that God ever promised a smooth easy life. He promised strength, rest, peace, love, grace, light, and to be there with us as we go through the highs and lows, the peaks and valleys of life.

I get all of that without JC.

Also, I have my family and friends (and nurses and doctors and public servants, when needed) to be there for me - and they are actually visible and can provide concrete assistance.

I am the Pp you are quoting and I also have great family and friends and many others there to support me and provide assistance. None of that even remotely comes close to what I get from JC. Basically if you only have had the experience of friends and family then you can't compare the two. My relationship with JC is obviously a faith-based one and not the same as how I relate to the people who are around me, - they compliment each other.

I have a pretty great life and a strong support network. It isn't to fill something missing in my life.

It's adding an imaginary friend -- and if it makes you feel better, why not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is Grace the indescribable feeling of forgiveness and faith more the action on the part of the person?

Would Faith be believing you will have a child after experiencing infertility?

OP, I do not believe that this is an example of faith. It may be your hope, but just because we want something very badly does not mean that it will come to pass. You have hope, but not faith, in this situation.

Faith is trusting that no matter what happens, God's will is perfect and will be fulfilled in your life, no matter what the circumstances.

According to this line of thinking, all the praying in the world to have a baby won't work if God, in his perfect will, doesn't want it to happen. He has his reasons and you won't understand them until you get to heaven -- if you're good.

so birth control is pointless because if God wants conception to result, it will?

Please don't twist my words around. We were talking about infertility and wanting a baby. Of course contraception is important, if appropriate in family planning. It yet another tool God has given us through medicine.

Makes you wonder why He waited so long to provide this tool through medicine -- part of his incomprehensible plan, I suppose, along with all those miscarriages He causes, or lets happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't connect grace to specific events but rather to my self and my state of being. Grace to me is like getting an unexpected special bonus gift. If you got it all the time, it would no longer to unexpected or special or a gift. I see it as a bonus gift that goes along with having a personal relationship with JC.

To me grace is when I am going through something difficult and God just fills my heart and mine with peace. It doesn't mean the difficulty is gone but that I have a stillness, a calmness and a peace that encompasses me. Other times I really have to work hard to get to a place of peace and calm and I may never get there or I partially get there then something happens and my peace is gone. The gift of peace is just amazing compared to the hard earned peace so I consider it grace.

Same might be true of forgiveness. Sometimes when I am burdened by guilt or shame, it is just lifted from me. Gone. I have wrestled with the feelings related to an issue for a long time to have all those feelings just vanish in an instant and never return. That is grace. Other times I have to really work and wallow through the guilt or shame or pain and slowly figure it out and come out the other side, often still with lingering feelings.

Faith to me is just trust. Not trust that certain things will or won't happen but trust in a relationship. So far in my 40 years of living nothing I have accomplished, noting I have desired, nothing I have acquired, nothing I have experienced compares to my relationship with JC so I have trust or faith in Him and in that relationship. And that relationship is founded on faith.

I don't believe that God ever promised a smooth easy life. He promised strength, rest, peace, love, grace, light, and to be there with us as we go through the highs and lows, the peaks and valleys of life.

I get all of that without JC.

Also, I have my family and friends (and nurses and doctors and public servants, when needed) to be there for me - and they are actually visible and can provide concrete assistance.

Perhaps. For now, maybe. But there will come a time in your life -- if you're lucky, and live long enough -- that you will need more than what you are getting from these family members and friends. Or they may no longer be there for you. And ultimately, they will disappoint you, because they are only human too. And, they can't provide eternal life and the route to God the Father.

When I've been alone and disappointed with my friends, I didn't feel the need to make up a very powerful friend who could not only help me through the tough time (which was really me talking to myself) but also claimed to provide eternal life. It's a nice story, but that's about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't connect grace to specific events but rather to my self and my state of being. Grace to me is like getting an unexpected special bonus gift. If you got it all the time, it would no longer to unexpected or special or a gift. I see it as a bonus gift that goes along with having a personal relationship with JC.

To me grace is when I am going through something difficult and God just fills my heart and mine with peace. It doesn't mean the difficulty is gone but that I have a stillness, a calmness and a peace that encompasses me. Other times I really have to work hard to get to a place of peace and calm and I may never get there or I partially get there then something happens and my peace is gone. The gift of peace is just amazing compared to the hard earned peace so I consider it grace.

Same might be true of forgiveness. Sometimes when I am burdened by guilt or shame, it is just lifted from me. Gone. I have wrestled with the feelings related to an issue for a long time to have all those feelings just vanish in an instant and never return. That is grace. Other times I have to really work and wallow through the guilt or shame or pain and slowly figure it out and come out the other side, often still with lingering feelings.

Faith to me is just trust. Not trust that certain things will or won't happen but trust in a relationship. So far in my 40 years of living nothing I have accomplished, noting I have desired, nothing I have acquired, nothing I have experienced compares to my relationship with JC so I have trust or faith in Him and in that relationship. And that relationship is founded on faith.

I don't believe that God ever promised a smooth easy life. He promised strength, rest, peace, love, grace, light, and to be there with us as we go through the highs and lows, the peaks and valleys of life.

I get all of that without JC.

Also, I have my family and friends (and nurses and doctors and public servants, when needed) to be there for me - and they are actually visible and can provide concrete assistance.

I am the Pp you are quoting and I also have great family and friends and many others there to support me and provide assistance. None of that even remotely comes close to what I get from JC. Basically if you only have had the experience of friends and family then you can't compare the two. My relationship with JC is obviously a faith-based one and not the same as how I relate to the people who are around me, - they compliment each other.

I have a pretty great life and a strong support network. It isn't to fill something missing in my life.

One big difference is that your friends have an actual body and personality, like all loving people, whereas JC is an ancient figure, gone for over 2000 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
NP here. That's nice for you 11:38 PP, but I am far from the only person who has gone through parts of life without family or friends and with nobody to turn to, but personally I feel at those times I was sustained by grace. Didn't really have faith at those times either. Being sustained through very difficult passages built my faith.

Nothing you could opine would really impact my assessment of my personal experience.

I really do hope that in 100 years, maybe less, this kind of thinking will be rare that people who feel this way will be reluctant to speak up about it -- sort of the way people are about fairies now. If you thought fairies helped you sort out your life, you probably wouldn't talk about it much.

[Anonymous]

Anybody who believes they have a soul and their life matters believes in God whether they know it or not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't connect grace to specific events but rather to my self and my state of being. Grace to me is like getting an unexpected special bonus gift. If you got it all the time, it would no longer to unexpected or special or a gift. I see it as a bonus gift that goes along with having a personal relationship with JC.

To me grace is when I am going through something difficult and God just fills my heart and mine with peace. It doesn't mean the difficulty is gone but that I have a stillness, a calmness and a peace that encompasses me. Other times I really have to work hard to get to a place of peace and calm and I may never get there or I partially get there then something happens and my peace is gone. The gift of peace is just amazing compared to the hard earned peace so I consider it grace.

Same might be true of forgiveness. Sometimes when I am burdened by guilt or shame, it is just lifted from me. Gone. I have wrestled with the feelings related to an issue for a long time to have all those feelings just vanish in an instant and never return. That is grace. Other times I have to really work and wallow through the guilt or shame or pain and slowly figure it out and come out the other side, often still with lingering feelings.

Faith to me is just trust. Not trust that certain things will or won't happen but trust in a relationship. So far in my 40 years of living nothing I have accomplished, noting I have desired, nothing I have acquired, nothing I have experienced compares to my relationship with JC so I have trust or faith in Him and in that relationship. And that relationship is founded on faith.

I don't believe that God ever promised a smooth easy life. He promised strength, rest, peace, love, grace, light, and to be there with us as we go through the highs and lows, the peaks and valleys of life.

I get all of that without JC.

Also, I have my family and friends (and nurses and doctors and public servants, when needed) to be there for me - and they are actually visible and can provide concrete assistance.

I am the Pp you are quoting and I also have great family and friends and many others there to support me and provide assistance. None of that even remotely comes close to what I get from JC. Basically if you only have had the experience of friends and family then you can't compare the two. My relationship with JC is obviously a faith-based one and not the same as how I relate to the people who are around me, - they compliment each other.

I have a pretty great life and a strong support network. It isn't to fill something missing in my life.

It's adding an imaginary friend -- and if it makes you feel better, why not.

If you don't believe you don't believe. I get that. Some people believe in ghosts or in other paranormal activity - I don't. To each their own.