7/24/23 Trial of Usman Shahid -- driver who killed two Oakton teens

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only place I’ve seen it written that he was unlicensed was in that Reddit thread. Even NBC4’s report yesterday didn’t say that. I’m not believing that “fact” until I see it reported on a legitimate site.

He wasn't unlicensed. He had a learner's permit.

a "learner's PERMIT" is not a license. it is a "permit" --- those are DIFFERENT THINGS.

The "permit" means you are PERMITTED to drive ONLY with an actual LICENSED driver in the car. Your insurance company does not increase the rates for having a person with a learners permit using the vehicle because they cannot drive without a licensed driver in the car. Insurance companies do not consider a permit holder to be an actual licensed driver. The legal system makes a distinction.

Shahid was NOT a licensed driver. He did not have a license to drive. He had a permit to use a vehicle ONLY when a licensed driver was in the car.

In Virginia, all drivers are required to have insurance. Usually people with a learner's permit are covered under their parents' car insurance but not always, in which case they need to get their own car insurance. Everyone requires a driver to be a licensed driver, including car insurance, police, etc. Someone with a learner's permit has a restricted license otherwise they would be driving without a license.

In Virginia, a person with a learners permit is NOT required to be included on your insurance as a driver, and the charges do not go up while you have a permit. The person who is the licensed SUPERVISING driver (supervising the permit holder) and/or the owner of the car carry the insurance.


You are wrong, PP. Just admit it. As far as the law is concerned, in VIRGINIA, Shahid is Not a "licensed driver".

Per the VIRGINIA DMV: "A learner’s permit allows individuals to practice driving with a licensed driver."

https://www.dmv.virginia.gov/licenses-ids/learners/apply#:~:text=A%20learner's%20permit%20allows%20individuals%20to%20practice%20driving%20with%20a%20licensed%20driver.

You are both wrong. In Virginia, drivers/owners can pay $500. to NOT have insurance. This will change on July 1, 2024:

https://www.wsls.com/news/virginia/2024/04/23/all-virginia-drivers-will-be-required-to-have-car-insurance-by-july-1/

Do you really think this kid's parents bought him a BMW for a graduation present but then did not either put him/the car on their insurance or provide for him/require him to have separate car insurance?

I suppose it's possible that they paid the $500 for the uninsured motorist fund.

You can notify your insurance company that you have a child with a permit, but the insurance company does not include them on their list of insured drives because they are not legally licensed drivers. The parents' insurance premium does not increase until they add the kid as an actually licensed driver.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Update: the jurors went home at 5 after deliberating 1.5 hours. This article also provides confirmation he got the BMW a few days prior.

https://www.dcnewsnow.com/news/local-news/virginia/fairfax-county/jury-deliberating-in-trial-of-teen-driver-charged-in-deadly-fairfax-county-crash/

Recent juror here. 1.5 hours is nothing for a serious case like this with so much testimony/evidence. I bet they continue through most of tomorrow as well.

Sometimes they end deliberations because of their personal schedules, or they have a decision but they agree to sleep on it overnight and make sure they are comfortable with it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Update: the jurors went home at 5 after deliberating 1.5 hours. This article also provides confirmation he got the BMW a few days prior.

https://www.dcnewsnow.com/news/local-news/virginia/fairfax-county/jury-deliberating-in-trial-of-teen-driver-charged-in-deadly-fairfax-county-crash/

Hung jury or not guilty. Congratulations to his attorney.

Hope you’re wrong. Hard to have faith in the justice system if he gets away with it. Maybe victims’ families will have to take matters into their own hands.

If the jury is anything like the posters on this thread, they will be suffering from "reasonable doubt" about his guilt.

Ehh…if only those posters weren’t from his family or lawyer’s office

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is it too late for Shahid to take a plea deal? I’d imagine a plea deal being better than a guilty sentence.

A defendant can plead guilty anytime before the jury reaches a verdict. The question is whether the prosecutor is willing to offer anything at this late date since they already expended all the effort of putting on a case at trial. The prosecutor has less motivation to give an enticing deal now...but there could still be some deal available.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Update: the jurors went home at 5 after deliberating 1.5 hours. This article also provides confirmation he got the BMW a few days prior.

https://www.dcnewsnow.com/news/local-news/virginia/fairfax-county/jury-deliberating-in-trial-of-teen-driver-charged-in-deadly-fairfax-county-crash/

Hung jury or not guilty. Congratulations to his attorney.

Hope you’re wrong. Hard to have faith in the justice system if he gets away with it. Maybe victims’ families will have to take matters into their own hands.

If the jury is anything like the posters on this thread, they will be suffering from "reasonable doubt" about his guilt.

Ehh…if only those posters weren’t from his family or lawyer’s office

I also assume these issues would be much more clear to juror sitting through a week-long trial vs. people reading a few snippets online.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is it too late for Shahid to take a plea deal? I’d imagine a plea deal being better than a guilty sentence.

A defendant can plead guilty anytime before the jury reaches a verdict. The question is whether the prosecutor is willing to offer anything at this late date since they already expended all the effort of putting on a case at trial. The prosecutor has less motivation to give an enticing deal now...but there could still be some deal available.

Since the prosecutor spent just ten minutes on closing I assume they’re feeling good. Maybe it will prove to be a mistake in hindsight.

[Anonymous]

Can he still flee?

[Anonymous]

The commonwealth spent no time on closing and Greenspun spent 2 hours. Never underestimate Greenspun. He’s a fantastic trial attorney who makes his living poking holes in the prosecution’s case and is very skilled at that. I saw him in closing at the trial of Kim Laroque, who absolutely was guilty of killing her husband. His closing was super long and just poked and poked enough reasonable doubt to have her aquitted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The commonwealth spent no time on closing and Greenspun spent 2 hours. Never underestimate Greenspun. He’s a fantastic trial attorney who makes his living poking holes in the prosecution’s case and is very skilled at that. I saw him in closing at the trial of Kim Laroque, who absolutely was guilty of killing her husband. His closing was super long and just poked and poked enough reasonable doubt to have her aquitted.

Is this the guy who argued he had to speed up to 80 mph to get through the yellow light? I have a different opinion on his skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The commonwealth spent no time on closing and Greenspun spent 2 hours. Never underestimate Greenspun. He’s a fantastic trial attorney who makes his living poking holes in the prosecution’s case and is very skilled at that. I saw him in closing at the trial of Kim Laroque, who absolutely was guilty of killing her husband. His closing was super long and just poked and poked enough reasonable doubt to have her aquitted.

who spoke on behalf of the common wealth?n Greenspun a $$$$$ might of spend over 50k-100k

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The commonwealth spent no time on closing and Greenspun spent 2 hours. Never underestimate Greenspun. He’s a fantastic trial attorney who makes his living poking holes in the prosecution’s case and is very skilled at that. I saw him in closing at the trial of Kim Laroque, who absolutely was guilty of killing her husband. His closing was super long and just poked and poked enough reasonable doubt to have her aquitted.

Some people have no conscience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Update: the jurors went home at 5 after deliberating 1.5 hours. This article also provides confirmation he got the BMW a few days prior.

https://www.dcnewsnow.com/news/local-news/virginia/fairfax-county/jury-deliberating-in-trial-of-teen-driver-charged-in-deadly-fairfax-county-crash/

Recent juror here. 1.5 hours is nothing for a serious case like this with so much testimony/evidence. I bet they continue through most of tomorrow as well.

Agreed. I served on a jury a few years ago. It was a minor drug possession case and we deliberated for at least an hour. We had a couple of counts we had to decide on including simple possession and possession with the intent to distribute. If it were something serious like manslaughter, I can't imagine coming back with any verdict in less than hour.

[Anonymous]

Homie going down. Verdict should be out today.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Homie going down. Verdict should be out today.

God I hope so

[Anonymous]

It’s 9:54 Am
And I’m here. There about 20 people too.
Just 3 of them are from

Usman.