Wow how do you juggle both homework and Kumon? Overload?

[Anonymous]

Two different questions have emerged in this thread and a few false dichotomies.

One question involves remediation, the other acceleration.

The remediation question has two parts -- one is where do you seek help when your kid is behind (school vs Kumon) and when do you conclude that you've got the kid in the wrong school. From a workload perspective, help from school, at least initially, makes sense in that it doesn't introduce an additional set of imperatives/objectives/requirements. It would be oriented toward helping your DC do better on the work your DC is already expected to do. As a first recourse, it also makes sense in terms of helping you think through the second question. If the school can't or won't help or has a very different set of expectations for your child than you do, then that's good to know ASAP.

The second question -- acceleration -- is different. And there the alternatives and issues are different. One issue is where the force propelling the kid forward is coming from. Another is what forward looks like and how you get there. And the trade-offs aren't typically TV/videogames/the country club vs Kumon. It's Kumon vs. camps and courses (CTY, Davidson, Duke) vs. competitions vs. projects (self-initiated, teams, family) vs. change of school (inc. grade skipping). Or some combination of the above.

I understand the utility of Kumon for certain kinds of temporary remediation (e.g. mastering math facts). I don't get it as an approach to acceleration unless it's the only game in town (clearly not true here).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kumon mom is sock puppeting.

But it's fun to watch her somewhat off-kilter responses to her own already off-kilter posts.

Does Kumon work on a franchise model? I'm starting to wonder if this is a viral marketing campaign, LOL! My fave used bookseller and I used to joke that whenever business got bad he should just put an ad in the window with an image of a preschooler reading Plato or Hegel (in German) and the tagline: "Is Your Child Already Behind?" Too bad that, for so many people, anxiety rather than pleasure is what motivates learning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Two different questions have emerged in this thread and a few false dichotomies.

One question involves remediation, the other acceleration.

The remediation question has two parts -- one is where do you seek help when your kid is behind (school vs Kumon) and when do you conclude that you've got the kid in the wrong school. From a workload perspective, help from school, at least initially, makes sense in that it doesn't introduce an additional set of imperatives/objectives/requirements. It would be oriented toward helping your DC do better on the work your DC is already expected to do. As a first recourse, it also makes sense in terms of helping you think through the second question. If the school can't or won't help or has a very different set of expectations for your child than you do, then that's good to know ASAP.

Excellent advice PP.

To the OP -- if your child is behind in reading and is struggling in school, I think it would be a good idea to meet with the teachers and get their detailed understanding of where your child needs extra help. Teachers and reading and other learning specialists should be able to diagnose reading difficulties and suggest/prescribe remediation activities in specific areas; sadly, some cannot. they may offer vague generalizations such as "Be sure to read with your child every night" or "He needs to use his strategies" or "He needs to learn his sight words" (when the bigger problem is that the child lacks the ability to decode and is especially confused with short vowel sounds.

If you can get good agreement from the classroom teacher(s) and specialists on where you child needs extra help, you MIGHT be able to work out an arrangement with them that you and the tutor(s) (Kumon, etc) will work with your child intensively on those skills at home for a period of, say 6-8 weeks; during this time, your child will focus less on homework that doesn't target those skills, especially if the skills the homework does target are obviously too hard for your child. Perhaps you can get permission to modify the HW assignment (you reading to your child, or scribing) for this period of time, with the understanding that the child IS working on skills appropriate for him.

ABSOLUTELY this is the best time to plug away and get your child up to grade level as soon as possible. Everything will be easier once your child is reading and writing on grade level.

[Anonymous]

Good point -- if your child is struggling because of a learning difference, the sooner it is diagnosed and addressed, the better off your child will be. And that's not something Kumon can do. Some local privates have learning specialists on staff, others will make referrals and, of course, all public school systems have/provide access to these resources.

[Anonymous]

But it's fun to watch her somewhat off-kilter responses to her own already off-kilter posts.

Does Kumon work on a franchise model? I'm starting to wonder if this is a viral marketing campaign, LOL! My fave used bookseller and I used to joke that whenever business got bad he should just put an ad in the window with an image of a preschooler reading Plato or Hegel (in German) and the tagline: "Is Your Child Already Behind?" Too bad that, for so many people, anxiety rather than pleasure is what motivates learning.

Wonder and whine. Who is really driving this viral marketing campaign?

[Anonymous]

Good point -- if your child is struggling because of a learning difference, the sooner it is diagnosed and addressed, the better off your child will be. And that's not something Kumon can do. Some local privates have learning specialists on staff, others will make referrals and, of course, all public school systems have/provide access to these resources

I have a different experience. Early Kumon works wonders in certain learning disabilities. Anecdotal evidence, no blinded prospective randomized studies here, and if this intervention in an otherwise failing math student with a learning disability takes the child to the head of math class after a few years I would recommend Kumon without any reservation in the least. Forget the fancy analysts and tests. Anecdotal evidence also confirms positive outcomes in above average kids. Like with most pharmaceutical drugs and agents (also backed by Phase 3 randomised clinical trials) --they only work in 40 percent of subjects. Wise parents and students therefore will use what intervention works with their children.

Bottom line: Kuman math is one of many types of interventions that works for some children. There is no single intervention that provides all the components that makes an individual "successful" in the "long run". No one should feel compelled to enroll their kid in Kumon math if the child or parent doesn't like it. If the child and parent like it then follow your inclination. Kumon, like violin, tennis, reading, attending private schools, can be done for it's own sake with or without motivation or ulterior motive.

[Anonymous]

It's a shame you've lost your own capacity to wonder. Seldom right, but never in doubt!

[Anonymous]

Kumon can be done for it's own sake? People pay to have their kids do worksheets on a weekly, scheduled basis because they find worksheets intrinsically valuable or meaningful? No, it's a means to an end and the question is what the end is (we've now heard remediation, acceleration, Ivy League admissions, and overcoming learning disabilities) and whether it's an appropriate, effective, necessary, and/or sufficient means.

[Anonymous]

Kumon can be done for it's own sake? People pay to have their kids do worksheets on a weekly, scheduled basis because they find worksheets intrinsically valuable or meaningful? No, it's a means to an end and the question is what the end is (we've now heard remediation, acceleration, Ivy League admissions, and overcoming learning disabilities) and whether it's an appropriate, effective, necessary, and/or sufficient means.

Of course Kumon can be done for it's own sake? Just like reading, doing puzzles, going to museums, playing the violin, taking on-line computer courses and exercises on the web and tutoring. Don't all these activities require a fee and a venue? None of these activities intrinsically harm our children. What's your beef? You prefer some activities over others? Fine. Permit others their preferences then.

[Anonymous]

It's a shame you've lost your own capacity to wonder. Seldom right, but never in doubt!

Not in the least. After reading the thread here I wonder whether everyone is petrified the invading KUMON KIDDIES will take over the world!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Kumon can be done for it's own sake? People pay to have their kids do worksheets on a weekly, scheduled basis because they find worksheets intrinsically valuable or meaningful? No, it's a means to an end and the question is what the end is (we've now heard remediation, acceleration, Ivy League admissions, and overcoming learning disabilities) and whether it's an appropriate, effective, necessary, and/or sufficient means.

Of course Kumon can be done for it's own sake? Just like reading, doing puzzles, going to museums, playing the violin, taking on-line computer courses and exercises on the web and tutoring. Don't all these activities require a fee and a venue? None of these activities intrinsically harm our children. What's your beef? You prefer some activities over others? Fine. Permit others their preferences then.

Just because you string all these activities together in a list doesn't mean they are of equal value.

[Anonymous]

Just because you string all these activities together in a list doesn't mean they are of equal value.

I agree with you. Value is in the eye of the beholder and what the client, customer or consumer is prepared to pay.

[Anonymous]

Which, apparently, is why you have to convince the customer that she's putting her kids' futures at risk if she doesn't buy your product (and paving their way into the Ivy League if she does).

[Anonymous]

Ugh. Why does every post about Kumon turn into a debate about whether Kumon is appropriate or not? When I was looking into signing up my child, I tried to search past Kumon threads to see if it was worth it to spend 120 dollars a month. I saw perhaps five responses from parents who put their kids in Kumon and how they progressed, whether they liked the program, etc. Unfortunately, the other 200 responses were debating the merits of doing any tutoring with the seemingly same people chiming in pro or con.
The OP is probably not even checking back here. OP probably gave up since the original question isn't being answered. So if the OP is back here, what levels of Kumon did your child place into in reading and math? That would give an indication of how much help your child needs and how long the Kumon homework will take. If your child placed into Reading level 4A or 3A your child still needs to master all the phonemes and vowel combinations in English, and I would really prioritize reading now.

[Anonymous]

Which, apparently, is why you have to convince the customer that she's putting her kids' futures at risk if she doesn't buy your product (and paving their way into the Ivy League if she does).

Not at all. You are confused. I have no skin in this game. Freedom of choice is one of the founding principles of this land. If a citizen sees value in an activity (play, cooking, lacrosse, kumon, legos, reading) that citizen has the right to make that choice. No one is convincing any customer to put her child's future at risk to sign up (or not sign up) for Kumon? Where do you get this impression? One hopes you are convinced, though, the choice of Kumon (or whatever other intervention or pasttime) chosen or preferred is an individual decision. You need not feel any more threatened by children who like doing Kumon math than children who prefer wandering the museums of the world. The relative value of any of these activities is not static and is in the eye of the beholder.

But, I along with others, will continue to share our anecdotal observations and these observations are just that. Take it or leave it. Many have already expressed comfort with their alternatives.