Anonymous wrote:We are currently in a nanny-share and there are 4 kids total. The plan has been for a couple of months now to leave the nanny share with the other family and have the nanny come to our home. We have been looking for another family who have just 1 child so that the nanny will only care for 2 kids total with the understanding that this will grow to 3 kids in the next 2 years as my family hopefully grows. I'm willing to pay a little extra to ensure that there is a spot for my future child and my current child will be able to be taken back and forth to preschool. We have said that we would love for her to care for my child until at least kindergarten but maybe longer too and she said that she wants to stay with us at least until my child is school-age. We have gotten along wonderfully and my child just ADORES her and doesn't want her to leave at the end of the day. She has honestly become a friend and we had her over for Christmas dinner, brought her chicken noodle soup over, and genuinely care about her well-being. She is like a 3rd Grandma to my child and we have treasured the relationship they have developed as we have no local family.

The problem: We've had tons of talks about how unhappy she is with the other family and how much she wants to work for me and my family in our home. I then created a rough draft contract that I sent her to edit as I want it to be mutually agreed upon and equitable, then I posted ads and finally we met with a family at my home who were lovely! There is even a 2nd family who are interested and they seem lovely as well so we've got some options!

I've done all this work myself (which has been rather stressful) and kept her in the loop and then all of a sudden, she began saying that she is not sure about watching a 3rd child. I reminded her that I am planning to have a 2nd and will need childcare for that child too and that my older child would be in preschool at least half-time by that point. She began giving me mixed signals which made me uncomfortable and then I flat out told her that we are on a waitlist for a daycare/preschool and should hear something in March that will start over the summer. We said that we can't give up that spot unless we have a really solid plan worked out that includes our possible 2nd child. She knows we cannot afford to pay her just ourselves so she would eventually have 3 kids even if she has just 2 for 1 year. I asked if she is comfortable caring for a 3 year old, 2 year old, and a newborn with the newborn being the only full-time child.

She said that she would have to think about it. I asked her if she felt like she needed a refresher course on childcare and she said, no, that she reads plenty. I felt pretty uncomfortable with her response as she is currently caring for 3 sometimes 4 kids currently but she said she would give me a response the following day. No response came. I questioned her this morning and she said that she was too busy to think about it. She then asked if the question was for her to stay with the other family come June since a daycare spot might open for me and I said no, that wasn't the question at all. I reminded her of the question and she said that she would have to think about it.

Clearly, she is avoiding responding to me and the answer is a big, fat, no. I feel very upset that I've spent all this time and effort into putting together a better situation and felt badly for her that the other family wasn't treating her well. I feel like I've just been played....she never wanted to care for 3 kids and it sounds like if and when I end up having a 2nd child, she would leave me high and dry.

I need to address this with her. I'm debating whether to just be blunt and tell her how hurt we are by her behavior and that we will have to move on this summer. I need to give a response to this other family who are waiting on the contract to send them.

Why don't you try a few full days alone with children of that age? I bet you just won't. Why?

I don't know if I got lucky that my child was not a significant biter but i think it just depends onthe kid's personality and not a reflection of parenting.

Back in 2014, my just turned 2 year old almost bit a toddler due to toy sharing, right in front of me. I caught it in time and was mortified. But then I learned toddlers do do that before they learn how to control their emotions. It happened again about 6 months later and one last time when the child was a little over 3, then none thereafter.

The OP seems to intend well, but her over planning, risk averse, rational, and detail oriented personality is not meshing with others personalities. I happen to be analytical, worry, plan, try to prepare for/control various scenarios, plan ahead, all that. I learned that others might find me difficult in that I try to prepare for too many contingencies and it tires them out. Even my DH hints at it. I have a passive, does not think ahead or anticipate other's needs nanny (including anticipating a child's needs). There are many things she does differently than I would. But I have to remind myself she is also flexible and all of her positive traits.

A good personality fit is crucial. After reading more posts and getting more details, I am changing my PP and saying OP might want to find a new family and a new nanny.

Anonymous wrote:It's a recurring problem on this board, that moms are upset that a nanny doesn't want to change the scope of their work, or nannies are upset that families want to change it. Everyone just needs to step back and not take it personally. Nanny jobs are constantly changing as a family's needs change. Sometimes that means one or both sides are unhappy. Sure, it's stressful and frustrating, but don't read ill intent in on either side.

I am MB and I agree with this. I don't think the nanny has any ill intent but is in denial about her reality (new city does not pay as much, she doesn't want to care for 3 but she needs the income).

Op can find a new nanny but that is a stressful and time consuming process. I'd push that off when OP actually gets pregnant with another child. Reassess then. Toddler behavioral problems come and go. It may be a few weeks or a few months but most resolve themselves.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, there is a big difference between a mix of kids and three kids under three. She is older and may realize her limitations. You are asking a lot, especially with car seats, strollers and pick up/drop off with preschool.

Well, by the time I actually have my 2nd child, my 1st will be about 3 years old. As it stands, the daycare that I am on the waitlist for does not have an opening for the fall and there really aren't any other daycares that I could get my child into right now. I could get him into a Montessori program at 2.5 but that's about it. There really aren't many good in-home daycares around me either and I just gave us up a spot almost 2 months ago that was literally in my neighborhood because things were going well with the nanny.

It's possible we could go ahead with the nanny share with the new family for a period of 1 year only and then my child should get into the childcare program at the local daycare or we could re-evaluate. I could offer to help pay for a short training course as a refresher. The last option is to try and find an entirely new nanny which I'm looking into but the options are not great where I am and it feels pretty intimidating!

How can you know this? Man proposes, God disposes. Don't count your chickens yet.

I'm sorry, OP. I hope it works out. It sounds like she isn't working out. And for a 1:4 ratio, with kids biting each other, I think I'd rather try my chances in day care.

Anonymous wrote:OP here: I know I'm also being emotional about this but the stress of this is becoming really overwhelming to ME. I've been juggling addressing (developmentally appropriate) behavioral issues in my own child and feeling like a horrible mother because I am NOT able to stop this behavior even though I'm doing EVERYTHING I can possibly do coupled with trying to ensure I have a safe and healthy childcare situation for my child so we don't end up losing out on our childcare, while juggling issues with this nanny who can't seem to be able to communicate what she needs or wants or perhaps doesn't know coupled with coordinating care with the other Mom. I have anxiety and it's all becoming just too much for me!

I suspect that you are the real reason she doesn't want to take care of three children! You sound totally crazy.

Anonymous wrote:I think people should give OP a break. She made a few mistakes, but sounds well-meaning. How many NFs would extend an invitation to their nanny for Christmas Eve dinner or any special occasion dinner? OP, sounds like you are cutting your losses and moving on, good. Think everything through before you find your new nanny and prepare a contract, even then, you'll still forget something.

Thanks! I am. I appreciate you sticking up for me.

I think people should give OP a break. She made a few mistakes, but sounds well-meaning. How many NFs would extend an invitation to their nanny for Christmas Eve dinner or any special occasion dinner? OP, sounds like you are cutting your losses and moving on, good. Think everything through before you find your new nanny and prepare a contract, even then, you'll still forget something.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the same OP who wrote the post in the general nanny discussion forum about toddlers and biting in nanny share, in which it became clear that this "third grandmother" nanny is doing a piss poor job of even supervising the children and also has not been proactive or responded well to the parents concerns regarding that issue.

This is also the same OP who wrote in the nanny job advice forum about this situation, stating that she pays said nanny $150/week and the other family (with 3 kids) pays her $250/week so this poor nanny who is with 3-4 kids at a time is making only $400/week for full time care!

This whole situation is completely insane. The nanny is clearly A) unqualified to care for more than 2 young kids at a time and B) no longer interested in doing a share (can you blame her?). The OP is paying the nanny less than the fees for an unlicensed in home daycare facility, and has said in her posts that she can't afford much more than that. Meanwhile OP is drawing nanny away from the family who she has worked with longer and who pays the majority of her paycheck, because OP wants nanny in her own home for when this possible second baby enters the picture, even though nanny has been clearly hesitant about starting a new share with a new family.

Are you even disclosing to the new share families that the MAIN reason you're leaving the other share is because your child has a biting problem and the nanny was UNABLE to handle it or even communicate effectively with the parents about it??

OP here- I do not live in northern VA so the prices are different down here. The main reason for the nanny share was not the biting. I wanted my child engaged in a little bit more structure, activities, transportation and I wanted to work with another parent who shared a similar parenting style and wanted to communicate. The other mother has been ugly to me. There is a lot more to this situation but ultimately I did my best to be kind, empathetic and try to create a situation that met everyone's needs (the nanny approached me about coming to my home). I offered to pay for a childcare class. I had in fact talked with the new possible families who still want to work with me. Long story short, the nanny told me this morning she does not want to work anymore for my family. The situation seemed like it was getting out of control later in the morning and I felt like it had become a potentially dangerous situation for my child and knowing that she doesn't want to care for him and is so overwhelmed, I came home and got him. I tried to end it without hostility but the nanny became extremely hostile towards me. the other mother thus far has continued being terribly cold to me and refused to admit that her children play a role in the dynamics. Anyone who thinks my child is some demon child and terrorizes others impacting her mental health does not need to be caring for my child. It's over. It's done.

OP, you have some mental issues please see a doctor.

I just read the whole post WOW this OP sound crazy, she is commenting on everybody's reaction. Don't give her advice or suggestions people, this is crazy .

I hear you. It sounds like there is plenty of blame to go around. It sounds like no one in this situation was willing to have a hard conversation, except over text message.

Start over. Think of yourself as an employer, not a client. Be more detached from the personalities. No contract, no job, no share. You've seen how bad this can get once there are personal feelings involved.

You will never, ever be able to force other people to agree with your perspective. They probably feel equally misunderstood. This is why you need to hammer out the details and contingency plans ahead of time.

Anonymous wrote:After reading this whole post, and now reading that you were, in fact, the mom of those other posts, I don't think the nanny was reacting to your child. She, and the other mom, are reacting to you.

In the name of trying to accommodate everyone and fix problems, I think you made them worse, and everyone got tired of working with you. You're convinced that your actions are the best possible ones, but I think other people are telling you that they're ultimately difficult and self-serving.

You need to start over, and be prepared to put some distance between yourself and the nanny, and to spell out, in a contract, all of these little details with the other mom. This needs to be more transactional, and less family-like.

I did try to accommodate everyone and collaborate to improve a situation but in their minds it was solely my child being awful and had nothing to do with them at all, period. I shouldn't have tried to work with the nanny on such a long-term plan, that was obviously a mistake. I should have just created a year-long contract and left it at that and said we could re-evaluate at that time. The other mother refused to acknowledge that the other children played a role in the situation at all. Her children were angels and mine was awful and it was this attitude of you better stop this behavior right this second or else. Well, that's not the way it works with a very young child at 1.5 years old who doesn't have the ability to understand. I could do all the talking I want at home, all the redirection and correction that I want to but I wasn't seeing these behaviors in my home.

The nanny became overwhelmed and even said that to me on multiple occasions. She repeatedly said that she hated working for this other family and it was too many kids to care for. I asked a number of times, how can I improve this for you? What can I do to make these working conditions better for you? I told them both if there is something that you think I could be doing to improve this situation that I am not currently doing, let me know and I will consider it (beyond spanking-we don't spank). Nothing. It was just this attitude of your child is bad, my child is good.

I will admit that I began to feel very anxious and panicked about this situation as it became clear that both the nanny and the other mother were blaming my child for any incident that occurred and did not take child development into consideration at all. Who wouldn't feel panicked when you are constantly being told that your child is horrible and you are doing everything in your power to stop it? Who wouldn't be anxious to stop this? Who wouldn't reach out and offer any type of resource or support available within your financial means? Who wouldn't reach out to the other parent to apologize and see if there are ways we can work together to address this amongst the two moms and nanny?

Both me and my husband witnessed numerous interactions between all the children. The other children were not 'angels' as the mother implied and had their own behavioral challenges as any child would. The older children were often very disrespectful to the nanny and were unkind to my own child. They would scream in his face, yell at him when he tried to play alongside them, rip toys out of his hands, and take his cup of breast milk and drink it (for months!). He was bit once by the older child. The older child also was wandering in amongst my bedroom and my basement where he wasn't supposed to be and were not fully childproofed and nanny failed to ever tell me. The other children didn't force my child to bite them or anything but he reacted in response to them and vice-versa. They were all just acting as children.

It was definitely my fault for not insisting on having a sit-down conversation with both the nanny and other mother instead of sending group messages (which is what they did as well). I should have removed my child when I knew that the nanny was so overwhelmed and the other mother so inflexible. I should not have become so friendly with the nanny and should not have considered her an extension of my family even as she told me that she really wanted to stay with my family until my children were well into school. I should have set better boundaries and not invited her over for Christmas eve dinner and brought over chicken noodle soup for her. I probably should have tried to take off of work to stay one day and work on addressing my child's behavior in the moment but I just didn't have the leave. When I was upset with the other Mom, I should have just called her and talked with her on the phone more and been more open with that. We should have sat down and written a contract to address any issues that might arise but NO ONE but me wanted a contract.

I won't make those mistakes again. I will not try to improve the situation with the other mother so our interactions amongst friends won't be awkward....clearly the woman doesn't like me and her behavior has indicated such for MONTHS. You can't try and resolve a conflict with someone who refuses to resolve it. Conflict resolution requires all parties to participate. So, I'm done with it. They are picking up the stuff tonight and then I'm wiping my hands of them and starting anew!