Anonymous wrote:OP here,

I know I could go to my nanny and ask her. But it's awkward. I am incredibly lucky to have such a fantastic nanny. My nanny loves my daughter, and all my kids. She'd throw herself in front of a train for my daughter. My guess is that if I didn't say anything, she'd simply figure out when I was alone with the kids and stay home, and then show up when she heard the siren. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if part of the reason why she was home the last two times was because she was doing just that.

So, it's really important to me that she's not taken advantage of. Not because I am worried that she'll leave, but because she deserves it. So, I'm asking what other people would want if they weren't already loyal to the family, so I can get a sense of what would be fair.

FFS, have a conversation with the woman:

"Larla, I am incredibly lucky to have such a fantastic nanny. [You] love[] my daughter, and all my kids. I know you'd throw herself in front of a train for my daughter. My guess is that if I didn't say anything, [you]'d simply figure out when I was alone with the kids and stay home, and then show up when [you] heard the siren. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if part of the reason why [you were] home the last two times was because [you were] doing just that.

So, it's really important to me that [you're] not taken advantage of. Not because I am worried that [you]'ll leave, but because [you] deserves it.

We need more help this year, and I'm hoping you'd be willing to take on a more formal overnight on-call role. How do you feel about that? Here is what it would entail. Think about it tonight, and let me know tomorrow if you're willing to do it, and if so, what you'd charge for those nights. We were thinking we'd pay you a flat rate for the inconvenience, and then we would of course pay you your regular or OT rate for any time that you actually had to get up and come to work."

As a MB, I generally figure out what's fair this way: How much would I like to pay (maybe $50/night in this case)? How much do I feel like is the absolute maximum I think is reasonable given that she already lives there and the chances of getting called are slim, but that I also know she's reliable and able to step in at a moment's notice (maybe $150 in this case)? So, if she names a number between $50 and $125, then we're good. If she says she has no idea what to ask for, I'd probably offer $75-$100.

I use this same technique to determine how much I pay in general: the least I can imagine paying and the amount I think is too much. I set the rate somewhere in there, and if I can't find someone willing to do the job for that rate, then I explore other options.

OP here,

I know I could go to my nanny and ask her. But it's awkward. I am incredibly lucky to have such a fantastic nanny. My nanny loves my daughter, and all my kids. She'd throw herself in front of a train for my daughter. My guess is that if I didn't say anything, she'd simply figure out when I was alone with the kids and stay home, and then show up when she heard the siren. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if part of the reason why she was home the last two times was because she was doing just that.

So, it's really important to me that she's not taken advantage of. Not because I am worried that she'll leave, but because she deserves it. So, I'm asking what other people would want if they weren't already loyal to the family, so I can get a sense of what would be fair.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But technically the nanny is always on call overnight Right? What happens if she and her girlfriends wanted a weekend away in NYC? What if she wants to take overnight gigs? She can't do that because she's on call.

OP here,

My DH generally travels 2 - 3 nights at a time, and not every week, and never on weekends. My thought is that the nanny would have first right of refusal, so if she's planning on staying home those nights then she gets some extra money for doing nothing. If she isn't interested, then I ask the college student who is our regular babysitter. If neither is available, then I'd ask our back up babysitters.

My mom has usually flown into town when the nanny has taken her vacation time in the past, so if nanny was out of town then grandma would probably be here.

But on nights when she would be staying home anyway, then it doesn't seem like a horrible thing to offer her a little extra money for being on call. I'm just not sure how much money. $200 seems like a lot to me, but then I'm having trouble seeing this as a horrible thing to ask of someone.

It's a live-in position, folks. No one is being asked to leave their own bed or family.

If you could truly make it an optional part of the job, I bet most people would be happy to do it most of the time for something minimal, like $50-$75 + hourly if they have to get up. I know au pairs who do this all the time.

I do think you should be very up front about what you think the frequency will be, and also realistic with yourself if it turns out to be a lot more often than you thought.

Our nanny has worked with us for years, and both my DH's schedule and my daughter's health needs have been consistent during that time. My oldest is leaving for college, previously he's been the one "on call", which is why we're making a change.

In the past year, my husband has traveled 73 nights. We had incidents on 2 of those nights. Both times, my nanny was home and woke up when the ambulance arrived, and came over and offered her help, I accepted her offer and paid her for it at her hourly OT rate. So, she definitely knows what she's getting into, but in the past we haven't paid her to be at home.

I'm pretty sure if I asked her she'd tell me I didn't need to pay her, which is why I asked here. I'm thinking that $100 a night sounds fair.

Wait a minute -- this is a long-time nanny? I think everyone on this board assumed you were either hiring new, or this was someone who you barely know. Why are you asking us? Just talk to her. After all these years, surely she would be straight with you about what she would need to make it work. And if she says, "Oh! I wouldn't charge extra for that," you would of course insist on something. You could also offer a full day off the next day instead of compensation if that would work.

This is why I'm asking. Because I don't know what "something" to insist on.

Unfortunately, if I call on her in this situation, it means that the next day I'm likely still at the hospital with my daughter, and with DH out of town that's not a great day for the nanny to be off.

One more question: Why would knowing that she's worked for us for a while make a difference in the answer to how much one would expect to be paid?

Because this is a person with whom you have a pre-existing relationship, and presumably you know her fairly well. You know if she would see this additional duty as a huge burden and only agree to it for a lot of money for each call night (in which case you might decide to go another route), or if she would be generally happy to do it for a modest cost. You also know what you are currently paying her, what she has done in the past, what her benefits are, etc., etc., etc.. You aren't negotiating a new job with an unknown person.

You aren't trying to attract a new applicant, not knowing how this overnight call schedule will affect your applicant pool. In that case, you have to guess what amount of compensation would yield the best group of candidates (reliable and good enough with the children).

As for why the "something" would be different whether or not she has worked for you before, see the above: some people wouldn't take this job at any cost. Some would take it, but only for a lot of money. Some would take it for the promise of a modest amount of extra cash 73 nights a year, and probably only having to get up for two of them. Again, you can presumably have a conversation with this person you already know and ask her what she thinks. Maybe she'll say she would be willing to do up to 5 nights a month and no more. Who knows?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have several young children. One of my children has a medical issue that can lead to sudden unexpected ambulance rides and E.R. visits. On average, this happens about once a month, usually in the middle of the night. Because of this, when my DH travels, I need to arrange to have someone else spend the night, so that I can accompany my child to the E.R. if need be.

How much would you expect to pay for each of these situations:

1) Live in nanny, with separate apartment, who is asked to stay home from the end of one work day until the beginning of the next (about 14 hours), and to be available by phone if need be, but wouldn't actually need to do anything other than be able to respond quickly in an emergency (e.g. keep phone on, don't get drunk)

2) High school or college babysitter who does not live in, but would stay in the guest room. Would need to be in the home for 14 hours, and would be invited to join us for dinner and breakfast, but could choose whether to stay and be with the family, or to retreat to a bedroom to study or watch TV if they preferred.

Note: I am not talking about the rate if there is an actual incident. In that case, I would wake the nanny or babysitter and let them know I was leaving. Nanny would need to move to the guest bedroom. From that point, until they were relieved, they'd be paid either their hourly rate or their OT rate as appropriate, including for hours they were asleep.

I ink the live in nanny arrangement is best but the staying home for 14 hours might be too much. Could you say limit outings to places within a five mile radius?

And if the nanny only has to stay home with the kids, then no need for exhorbitant pay. It's just overtime assuming you would be ok with the nanny going back to sleep in the main part of the house or bedroom near the kids.

Unfortunately, if we need someone, then we need them in 5 minutes. The point is really to beat the ambulance to the house. A 5 mile radius wouldn't achieve that goal. It wouldn't always be 14 hours, there are many factors.

We're not choosing between the nanny and a babysitter. We already have both working set schedules. Because of my kids' needs, there are 2 adults in the house and working whenever all the kids are home and awake. My assumption is that they'd take turns covering nights when Dad's away.

Our nanny always hits or goes over 40 hours, so if she were awakened it would be time and a half from the time of the phone call, plus she'd still have the bonus for staying home that night. She's paid well, so this is a fair amount of money. For my babysitter who is paid less and doesn't hit the overtime limit, we're thinking time and a half would be fair.

Anonymous wrote:I have several young children. One of my children has a medical issue that can lead to sudden unexpected ambulance rides and E.R. visits. On average, this happens about once a month, usually in the middle of the night. Because of this, when my DH travels, I need to arrange to have someone else spend the night, so that I can accompany my child to the E.R. if need be.

How much would you expect to pay for each of these situations:

1) Live in nanny, with separate apartment, who is asked to stay home from the end of one work day until the beginning of the next (about 14 hours), and to be available by phone if need be, but wouldn't actually need to do anything other than be able to respond quickly in an emergency (e.g. keep phone on, don't get drunk)

2) High school or college babysitter who does not live in, but would stay in the guest room. Would need to be in the home for 14 hours, and would be invited to join us for dinner and breakfast, but could choose whether to stay and be with the family, or to retreat to a bedroom to study or watch TV if they preferred.

Note: I am not talking about the rate if there is an actual incident. In that case, I would wake the nanny or babysitter and let them know I was leaving. Nanny would need to move to the guest bedroom. From that point, until they were relieved, they'd be paid either their hourly rate or their OT rate as appropriate, including for hours they were asleep.

I ink the live in nanny arrangement is best but the staying home for 14 hours might be too much. Could you say limit outings to places within a five mile radius?

And if the nanny only has to stay home with the kids, then no need for exhorbitant pay. It's just overtime assuming you would be ok with the nanny going back to sleep in the main part of the house or bedroom near the kids.

Anonymous wrote:Your nanny already lives in in the nanny apartment right?

FWIW- I have a live-in nanny and if I was in this situation, I would only pay her if I had to get her up during the night. That being said, my nanny doesn't drink nor does she go out all night.
You want nanny to move upstairs during the night if you leave, so she can hear the other kids. How old are the other kids? I'm questioning why that is necessary. i might feel differently if they are very young- but why can't they go get nanny if something happens?

Nanny's apartment is over the garage, which is detached, and my other kids are very young so they definitely need someone in the same building.

Your nanny already lives in in the nanny apartment right?

FWIW- I have a live-in nanny and if I was in this situation, I would only pay her if I had to get her up during the night. That being said, my nanny doesn't drink nor does she go out all night.
You want nanny to move upstairs during the night if you leave, so she can hear the other kids. How old are the other kids? I'm questioning why that is necessary. i might feel differently if they are very young- but why can't they go get nanny if something happens?

If I were a college student or occasional babysitter and you offered $50 for dinner, breakfast and an approximately 3% chance you'd need to wake me up and pay me more; I'd be delighted. If your DH is away for 3 weekday nights, that $150 easy money when I'd likely be doing nothing anyway.

(Come to think of it, if you give me two meals and a quiet room for 3 nights in a row now, with only a 3% chance of midnight interruption,, I might pay you. )

No idea about the nanny.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But technically the nanny is always on call overnight Right? What happens if she and her girlfriends wanted a weekend away in NYC? What if she wants to take overnight gigs? She can't do that because she's on call.

OP here,

My DH generally travels 2 - 3 nights at a time, and not every week, and never on weekends. My thought is that the nanny would have first right of refusal, so if she's planning on staying home those nights then she gets some extra money for doing nothing. If she isn't interested, then I ask the college student who is our regular babysitter. If neither is available, then I'd ask our back up babysitters.

My mom has usually flown into town when the nanny has taken her vacation time in the past, so if nanny was out of town then grandma would probably be here.

But on nights when she would be staying home anyway, then it doesn't seem like a horrible thing to offer her a little extra money for being on call. I'm just not sure how much money. $200 seems like a lot to me, but then I'm having trouble seeing this as a horrible thing to ask of someone.

It's a live-in position, folks. No one is being asked to leave their own bed or family.

If you could truly make it an optional part of the job, I bet most people would be happy to do it most of the time for something minimal, like $50-$75 + hourly if they have to get up. I know au pairs who do this all the time.

I do think you should be very up front about what you think the frequency will be, and also realistic with yourself if it turns out to be a lot more often than you thought.

Our nanny has worked with us for years, and both my DH's schedule and my daughter's health needs have been consistent during that time. My oldest is leaving for college, previously he's been the one "on call", which is why we're making a change.

In the past year, my husband has traveled 73 nights. We had incidents on 2 of those nights. Both times, my nanny was home and woke up when the ambulance arrived, and came over and offered her help, I accepted her offer and paid her for it at her hourly OT rate. So, she definitely knows what she's getting into, but in the past we haven't paid her to be at home.

I'm pretty sure if I asked her she'd tell me I didn't need to pay her, which is why I asked here. I'm thinking that $100 a night sounds fair.

Wait a minute -- this is a long-time nanny? I think everyone on this board assumed you were either hiring new, or this was someone who you barely know. Why are you asking us? Just talk to her. After all these years, surely she would be straight with you about what she would need to make it work. And if she says, "Oh! I wouldn't charge extra for that," you would of course insist on something. You could also offer a full day off the next day instead of compensation if that would work.

This is why I'm asking. Because I don't know what "something" to insist on.

Unfortunately, if I call on her in this situation, it means that the next day I'm likely still at the hospital with my daughter, and with DH out of town that's not a great day for the nanny to be off.

One more question: Why would knowing that she's worked for us for a while make a difference in the answer to how much one would expect to be paid?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But technically the nanny is always on call overnight Right? What happens if she and her girlfriends wanted a weekend away in NYC? What if she wants to take overnight gigs? She can't do that because she's on call.

OP here,

My DH generally travels 2 - 3 nights at a time, and not every week, and never on weekends. My thought is that the nanny would have first right of refusal, so if she's planning on staying home those nights then she gets some extra money for doing nothing. If she isn't interested, then I ask the college student who is our regular babysitter. If neither is available, then I'd ask our back up babysitters.

My mom has usually flown into town when the nanny has taken her vacation time in the past, so if nanny was out of town then grandma would probably be here.

But on nights when she would be staying home anyway, then it doesn't seem like a horrible thing to offer her a little extra money for being on call. I'm just not sure how much money. $200 seems like a lot to me, but then I'm having trouble seeing this as a horrible thing to ask of someone.

It's a live-in position, folks. No one is being asked to leave their own bed or family.

If you could truly make it an optional part of the job, I bet most people would be happy to do it most of the time for something minimal, like $50-$75 + hourly if they have to get up. I know au pairs who do this all the time.

I do think you should be very up front about what you think the frequency will be, and also realistic with yourself if it turns out to be a lot more often than you thought.

Our nanny has worked with us for years, and both my DH's schedule and my daughter's health needs have been consistent during that time. My oldest is leaving for college, previously he's been the one "on call", which is why we're making a change.

In the past year, my husband has traveled 73 nights. We had incidents on 2 of those nights. Both times, my nanny was home and woke up when the ambulance arrived, and came over and offered her help, I accepted her offer and paid her for it at her hourly OT rate. So, she definitely knows what she's getting into, but in the past we haven't paid her to be at home.

I'm pretty sure if I asked her she'd tell me I didn't need to pay her, which is why I asked here. I'm thinking that $100 a night sounds fair.

Wait a minute -- this is a long-time nanny? I think everyone on this board assumed you were either hiring new, or this was someone who you barely know. Why are you asking us? Just talk to her. After all these years, surely she would be straight with you about what she would need to make it work. And if she says, "Oh! I wouldn't charge extra for that," you would of course insist on something. You could also offer a full day off the next day instead of compensation if that would work.

This is why I'm asking. Because I don't know what "something" to insist on.

Unfortunately, if I call on her in this situation, it means that the next day I'm likely still at the hospital with my daughter, and with DH out of town that's not a great day for the nanny to be off.