This definitely should have been discussed before taking the job. I wouldn't take a job without a guaranteed salary, including paid holidays and all other days off paid.

I know this. Even though I would like to take the advice of speaking with/ writing to them- I know the mom well enough at this point to know that my requests will be rejected. She already conveyed to me that if I didn't like the arrangements that we should probably part ways.

It's so ridiculous when she- the dad --& the gramma- go on & on about how amazing I am. That they don't know what they'd do w/o me. Yet it is just this week that she's showing me how it really is. (The 2 day notice re Veteran's Day)

My plan is to start looking. We all know how exhausting that is. But like you all- I need & deserve guaranteed pay. This is not my hobby. I love what i do- but I do it for pay.

If you address this, be prepared for them to replace tou without warning, since they will almost certainly reject your request and will then know that you aren't satisfied.

Thank you "Another MB" & "Nanny".

More great advice, suggestions, shared experiences & best wishes. ALL very much appreciated!!!

It's a shame that this has to be so difficult. I look forward to sharing my results.

Nanny here. I like 21:21s advice as far as what to say, it's worded well and gets the point across.

While I agree with the idea that you should talk to them and give them a chance to consider everything, I just want you to be prepared, because, there is a very good chance they will not be able or willing to change your total compensation package at this point.

I've made this mistake twice (I know, definitely my fault, especially when it happened a second time). The first time I was a relative newbie and just naive. When I finally made some nanny friends and realized I was being taken advantage of by not getting guaranteed hours or PTO (and, at $12/hr and no raise even after two years of employment, was not being paid well either), I approached MB and asked her if we could discuss things. Her initial reaction was anger that I was trying to "take advantage" of them. Then she laughed about it and told me I could be replaced by someone for even less money "like that." Finally, she told me she wanted me to stay, but they weren't financially able to offer guaranteed hours or PTO.

The second time, I felt a little desperate for the job, so I opted not to bring up guaranteed hours in the interview. That MB told me, upon offering me the job, she'd draw up a basic work agreement with no benefits for the first three months of employment, then, after that, there would be a review, raise, and they would offer me benefits. They were a very affluent family so I figured money wouldn't be an issue, and they offered me a high hourly rate to start, so I took the job.

At the three month review they did give me a $1 raise, bringing me up to $18/hr for one child and no chores required. She also offered 1 week of PTO per year. She did not offer guaranteed hours. When I asked for them to be included, she kept saying it didn't make sense to her, because nannies are hourly employees, not salaried, so why should I be paid for hours I didn't actually work. I feel like I could have gone into greater detail, so she might've actually understood the connection (if you decide not to pay me for two weeks out of the month, it makes it very difficult for me to pay rent); she was from a wealthy family so I don't think she understood what it's like living essentially paycheck to paycheck. Anyway, the hourly rate was high for the area and they ended up not taking too many vacations (maybe 3 weeks total each year) so I stayed with them another year, but it was obviously very frustrating that they were so unwilling to even consider offering something as simple as guaranteed hours.

I wanted you to hear about my personal experience with negotiating for guaranteed hours after you've started working together with a family. In my personal experience with those two particular families, neither of them was willing to consider offering guaranteed hours after I'd already started.

In fact, one more thing to think about: The last time I went job hunting, a little less than a year ago now, I went on many interviews with families. And, I had almost the same experience with every single family: I brought up guaranteed hours and PTO in the interview. Every family acted surprised. Every interview went well overall, and each and every family told me I was the most qualified nanny they'd interviewed, and invited me back for a short paid trial day. And each and every family told me it was between me and one other candidate, but they ended up hiring the other candidate, even though in most cases the other candidate was less experienced, because the other candidate did not ask for guaranteed hours or paid time off. Ultimately I found a great family to work with who pays me a great rate and gives me guaranteed hours and PTO, but it was difficult hearing the same thing over and over from all the other families (we hired the less experienced candidate pretty much for the sole reason that she didn't ask for any PTO or guaranteed hours).

The point of that, is this: for all you know, this family may have chosen to hire you instead of other, perhaps more qualified, applicants, simply because you didn't ask for guaranteed hours or PTO, and they thought they'd be saving money by hiring you. Obviously I don't know that that is the case, but I think it's definitely a possibility.

So again, it IS worth talking to them, and maybe they will be different than most of the families I've experienced, and maybe they will say "you're right, this is your livelihood and we care about you, so let's draw up a contract with guaranteed hours and PTO right now!" But, they might balk, and they might stall and say they need to think it over, or they might just flat out say no. So, just be prepared for the possibility that you might need to walk away.

I know finding a family that is just the right fit in terms of how they raise their children and their location and schedule and all those other factors is difficult enough, let alone finding a family who understands they have an obligation to their nanny to give her a solid paycheck so she can pay rent and bills every week (or every two weeks or whatever is agreed upon). And I know it seems daunting to find just the right family; after two months of interviews and trial days, and every family saying "you're great but we found someone cheaper," I was extremely discouraged. But, eventually I did find the right fit, and so will you. Good luck.

Another MB. Yes, they do not know the "ins and outs" of having a nanny. You should not quit (bad advice) but sit down with them and explain the details that you should have in writing. As stated, most nannies are paid (just like a daycare, you pay no matter what) for federal holidays, two weeks vacation, and federal holidays (of course, not all employers pay on federal holidays, especially if you work of a private sector family). The contract can be basic:

Weekly wage
Vacation
Sick Leave
Federal Holidays

MB- Much appreciated!!

Yes- learning. :/

You live you learn hehehe. Good luck OP!

Another MB agreeing w/ 20:24. These parents clearly don't know what they are doing. And, it doesn't really sound like you did either when taking this position. Neither side should have gone into this without a document spelling out the terms, benefits, leave, etc...

I would not just quit - I think it's at least worth giving them the benefit of the doubt. Try an appproach like:

Dear Jenny and Pete, As you know, while I have 10 years of childcare experience, this is my first nanny position and I have realized that I made a rookie mistake in not discussing with you what my total compensation package would be - inclusive of guaranteed hours, overtime rates, paid holidays, vacation/sick leave, etc...

I know this is your first time hiring so I am sure it didn't even occur to you either.

I would like to sit down and talk and see if there is a way this could still be a good fit, or if I need to take this as a lesson learned. When would be a good time to talk?

Then see how they respond. Be prepared to give them sample contracts, what you would hope for in terms of full package and benefits, and be prepared to know what you will or will not accept. If you're lucky you'll all be able to start fresh. If not you've all learned a valuable lesson.

Good luck. I hope it works out!

Anonymous wrote:Did you discuss this issue with them upon hire? If so, what was the agreement?

No, I do not think it is fair that they are giving you so many days off and less pay. However they may be new parents who are experiencing their first nanny and are not quite sure of all the logistics involved.

A talk with everyone involved should be held ASAP.

-Again- my faux pas. Discussed pay rate, but not details...

Mixed feelings on "talk soon" or "get new position & give notice".

Thx all!

Thank you MB. More good info.

OP I'm an MB.

The issue of them leaving you in the lurch when the DB's father passed away is maybe understandable? I'm not saying it's right, just that they might have been clueless about what to do with a newly employed nanny who they did not need at what was also a very hard time.

But with the holiday this week, this is a perfect opportunity to clarify. When we hired our first nanny we did not have a contract that outlined everything and that was a huge mistake we never repeated.

It actually is pretty common in this area to have guaranteed hours, paid holidays, paid vacation, and sick leave. They may not know; and they may not have budgeted for all of this when hiring you. So I'd be prepared for this to be a detailed and possibly touchy conversation. But I would not put it off because if you can't come to an agreement it doesn't seem like this will work out long-term.

Did you discuss this issue with them upon hire? If so, what was the agreement?

No, I do not think it is fair that they are giving you so many days off and less pay. However they may be new parents who are experiencing their first nanny and are not quite sure of all the logistics involved.

A talk with everyone involved should be held ASAP.