MB here w/ my two cents:

- wait a couple of weeks before trying to have any significant conversation with your MB. A new baby is a huge adjustment, even when it isn't your first.
- allow time for her to get a sense of the scope of work, realities of parenting a toddler AND a newborn, etc... I can understand her "wait and see" attitude and I don't necessarily think it's bad. It's extremely difficult to give two high needs kids (which a toddler and a newborn are, regardless of any other behavioral concerns) sufficient attention. Let her see the challenge, and then see how she's feeling about your tenure.
- I think $13/hr in Portland is a reasonable rate for one child. I would expect a request of $2/hour increase for the addition of a newborn to be perfectly fair. I would not consider a $5/hr request reasonable - that's almost a 40% raise. Could she replace you easily at the $15/hr rate? You need to think about that.

I understand you wanting to be paid fairly, and compensated for an additional child, of course. However, you have a lot of judgment in your posts (like "shifty-eyed", stingy, etc...) so I think you need to tread a little more lightly.

Maybe she's thinking about staying home now. Maybe she's thinking about putting the toddler in daycare and having you stay with the newborn.

Maybe she's not as happy with you as you think and wants to get her sea legs after the second baby to figure things out.

I'd be careful if you want to keep the job.

Good luck.

Anonymous wrote:My guess is that she is weighing how much it would cost to keep you on with the new baby vs. staying home. Or, that she is deciding between daycare and full-time nanny, or some mix of you, preschool, and daycare. I can't image she can take both kids to work with her!

If they haven't talked to you about full time, they are probably stretching to pay you as it is, and they just added a new person to the family. I would expect either no change (1 kid, though it could be either one), or MB decided to stay home.

Saw OP's update. This family doesn't sound so "rich" to me otherwise why would the mother be trekking a kid to/from her office twice a week.
She is either going to need full-time childcare (5 days a week) or may quit over the next several months after evaluating all the costs.

Just politely inquire how you'd like to help and if you have any preferences (be their full time nanny, find another job, ask the other family for FT), now is the time. This first family is likely just pondering everything while trying to adjust to a (hopefully healthy) new infant.

"...family you won't work 3 days/wk for..."

should read "family you only work 3 days/wk for".

I also find it hard to believe you have 11 years of professional nanny work. You sound very young and inexperienced to think it is appropriate to discuss this issue with the 2 day MB. That is completely inappropriate. Your issue is with the 3 day MB and that is the only person you should be dealing with.

Leaving out all the drama in your long posts, your request is pretty simple. You want a $5/hr increase for a second baby, and 5 days of PTO for a family you won't work 3 days/wk for. This is a large increase in total compensation. I'm the MB who said I would not give such an increase for a second baby. It also sounds like your MB is not all that happy with the idea of you watching the two kids for whatever reason due to her "wait and see" comments.

So, talk to her. See how she reacts to your increase request and be prepared for her to decline. Then decide to stay or look for a new job at the rate you want. It's your job to find a way to make two part time jobs work...or to get one FT job. It's not the 2 day MB's problem. It's yours.

All these other details you share are not important. Your problem is simple and the solution is simple. I'm not sure why you keep coming back here when most of the posters have already given you the same, direct, advice. If it's for sympathy, it isn't really working for you. Your situation is of your own making and your MB is doing nothing wrong.

Your rate is based on what a nanny of your calibre in Portland earns.
It is not your employers job to figure out your bills.
That is on you.
You accepted this job knowing the terms.
I am a little surprised that a nanny with as my much experience as you claim to have would make the rookie mistakes of accepting a job without guaranteed pay, without standard benefits, and with pay so low it is difficult to pay your bills.
I also find it hard to believe a nanny with your 11 years of experience does not know it is inappropriate to involve your other MB in this issue.

You should know that families do what is best and convenient for them all the time.

Just as you have suddenly discovered after 11 years of nanny we work the basics of nanny benefits perhaps this family has discovered after 2.5 years there are better childcare options than you.

My guess is that she is weighing how much it would cost to keep you on with the new baby vs. staying home. Or, that she is deciding between daycare and full-time nanny, or some mix of you, preschool, and daycare. I can't image she can take both kids to work with her!

If they haven't talked to you about full time, they are probably stretching to pay you as it is, and they just added a new person to the family. I would expect either no change (1 kid, though it could be either one), or MB decided to stay home.

It would be I'm to express to the two day MB how much you enjoy working for her and your hope that you will be with the family for a long time. That way she knows where you stand but you have no bad mouthed the other MB. If she is a good employer she probably won't be offended that you are asking for better benefits.

OP ignore the nasty PP please. I understand wanting to leave details out in your OP but it does make more sense when you fill in the details. Unfortunately it's a difficult situation though. I'd be very careful about what you say to 2 day/week MB about 3 day/week MB. Even if they aren't close friends you don't want to ever bad mouth one to the other. I think the only appropriate thing to say to 2 day/week MB is to ask if they have discussed the plans/schedule now that 3 day MB has a second child. That's all I think you can say.

I will say that given the additional information now I don't think it's as likely 3 day MB plan to let you go BUT if she doesn't want to give you the increase you are asking for she might. I'm not saying you don't deserve the increase you are asking for and even that you shouldn't ask but just be prepared, from the way you have described this MB she may be the type who would rather look for someone else instead. So with that said, I think you should continue to look for other job options just so you are prepared. Unfortunately you really can't say anything negative to 2 day MB and if 3 day MB does choose to let you go I think you may need to accept you will have to move on from 2 day family as well.

You have written so many long posts about an issue that barely qualifies as a post. Maybe the MB has noticed in you that you are indecisive, shy, immature(or inexperienced in life), and not a go-getter and she just wants someone new for her children. That is my take on it.

There is really nothing at all DCUM can help you with, your first thought should have just been to ask her and that is the only advice you will get here. It is a pretty simple situation.

Alright, well you guys are kind of sending me into a panic.

I deliberately didn't give a whole lot of details in my first post, because I was trying to keep things simple. But perhaps more information would be helpful?...

So, I work three days per week with this family. I work two days per week with another family. Within just two weeks of starting my job with the family being discussed now, they had recommended my services to their friends who have a child the same age as their own. I started working for their friends within another week or so.

So, for the past two years and three months I've been working with both of them. At first, I was working for the family being discussed now just one or two days per week, and the other family two or three days per week. They coordinated the schedule amongst themselves; they kept it pretty steady and changes in schedule happened only once or twice per year. (And having them figure it out was helpful because they were able to guarantee that I got at least 32 hours per week during weekdays between them.)

Over the last year and a half or so, the family in question here has asked for more and more of my time, first it was 1.5 days per week, then it was 2 days per week, then 2.5 days per week, and for the past four months its been 3 full days per week with them.

And, over the past two years, things have become more and more clear to me in terms of what is and isn't fair to the nanny. For example, the other family I work with pays me for sick days. If they are out of town, they still pay me for the hours I would've worked. They also go out of their way to make sure they have food for me and encourage me to help myself to their fridge (unlike the family being discussed, who has so little food on hand I have trouble finding things to feed her son, let alone myself; even though asking for her to provide food was literally the one thing I really asked for when I interviewed with them).

So, I really like working with the other family, currently the two day per week family. And aside from them just being great to work for, their daughter is awesome, too. I would really like to continue to work with them. But, if I create any sort of negativity with the family being discussed currently, I worry what sort of an impact it will have on my relationship with the other family (the two day per week family). If nothing else, if my employment with the three day per week family ends, it will be hard to find another family to work with for the specific three week days that I would be available if I continued to work with the two day per week family. (So I'd likely have to quit with them to find a full time family to work with.)

I've been pondering today on whether I could (or should) ask for help from the other family's MB. As I said, she is friends (not like super great friends, but still friends) with the three day per week family MB. It's possible that two day family MB may have some idea what three day family MB has planned. I know that she legitimately cares about my well being and if nothing else, would probably try to help me. I don't want to bring any negativity to my relationship with two day per week family because we have a good rapport (and like I said, they are great), so I'm trying to weigh whether it's worth it to talk to her about all this stuff. I want her to know how the other family treats me (poorly) without making it seem like I'm trying to throw them under the bus. Also I'm worried that if things do go south, three day per week MB may tell two day per week MB bad things about me (not that I do anything wrong but I could see her saying things like I'm too demanding or, if I end up quitting, she may complain I didnt give enough notice, etc). So part of me just wants to talk to two day per week MB first so she has a chance to hear my side of things. Thoughts on that one?

So, I mean, a couple things...
1) If she has consistently been INCREASING my time with her family, how can it be that this MB is so unhappy with my services?

2) On the two days per week that I'm with the other family, this MB takes her son to her work (45 minutes away) where she has hired a woman to care for him on those days. This has been the arrangement for about two years, and she has gone through three different sitters there in that time [note: it's my understanding that they all left for planned and "legitimate" reasons like having a baby, or going back to college, not necessarily because the were driven away by the family]; the current work-site nanny has been working with them just a couple months. On the days I work with her, the mom mostly works from home (she sometimes goes to coffee shops to work on her laptop or goes downtown for meetings, but spends a lot of time in her home office, too).

I think that part of the reason she might feel like her childcare situation needs to be reassessed is because of the two days per week she takes her son to work. I don't think she wants to have a two year old AND a young infant in the car for 45+ minutes each way to work and back. I am also not sure if the work-site nanny has experience with newborns or is comfortable caring for a toddler and baby herself (in, what I understand, is a small office that's been converted into a playspace).

And, just given the involvement of the other family (who, between the two families, as I said, they have always been mindful of giving me a total of at least 32 hours per week), I find it hard to believe that this MB would break her commitment not only to me but also to her friend who also employs me.

Anyway, I plan to press on with my original plan, and ask her in the next couple weeks about her intentions with my employment, and from there, I plan to make it very clear to her what my requirements and expectations are (and if she won't agree to my needs then I will move on, whether that means finding another 2-3 day family to work with so I can keep working with the family I'm very happy with, or having to quit with them and find a new fully time family).

Gah, so much tying...

OP - I would get ready for her to decide she is not going back to work and I would start looking for another family NOW. She wants you there during the early newborn period but when it's time to call heads or tails - it's tails, and you are not it. For your own well being, start looking NOW.

OP The more you clarify the less things look good for you.

In my experience when a family wants to keep you they have no problem telling you their plans.


While $16 is more than fair for two kids I don't think they will be willing to add 3 dollars to your rate and all the other standard benefits after 2 years.

Normally I would say ask and negotiate but mom' s vagueness is a huge red flag for me.

Start looking for a new job , now is a good time with the new year coming. When you apply for jobs go for what you need up front . It is OK to negotiate but don't sell yourself short.

Maybe the older child is waiting to be admitted to a preschool? Maybe they are moving? maybe she is going to quit her job and stay home?

Regardless she should provide you some guidance.

And if the market rate where you live is $14-16 for one child and $17-19 for two, she (and you) likely know that. Don't base it on your opinion that "they are well off."

I don't understand what your MB means by "wait and see." And I think it is completely unfair for her to give you such an answer when you asked such a specific question to her regarding the job.

I have a hard time wrapping my head around the idea that she had no idea what she is going to do in the next 8 weeks regarding childcare. I am pretty sure she either has a plan already in place or is leaning toward something already + for some reason she is not disclosing this to you which sorry OP, means that it probably is not something in your favor.

I think she may be considering staying on maternity leave longer than 8 weeks, becoming a SAHM or perhaps she has found another childcare option such as a daycare or a SAHM for cheaper. Since you did state that she is stingy, she most likely knew that you would ask for more pay once the new baby arrived (and rightfully so!), so she looked into cheaper forms of childcare.

It is your right to know if your job is in jeopardy, but since it is only part-time, she probably isn't taking it too seriously at the moment.

If I were you, I would definitely get a written letter of reference from her in case things go sour and I would also start looking for another position ASAP.

Good luck.

Anonymous wrote:I keep typing up a response and then encountering difficulties submitting (possible website server issue??).

Anyway, I kept wanting to discuss the pay issue with her, but it felt odd: " congratulations! Now pay me more!" ??? She definitely knows I charge more for caring for more children; she had a neighbor that was having nanny issues back in late winter early spring and I watched her neighbors toddler along with her own, for $3 extra per hour (it was just for a few hours per week, over the course of a couple months).

When it became pretty clear that she wasn't going to offer me a raise herself before baby's arrival, I approached her a few weeks ago (because I obviously wanted to make certain she knew I was expecting more to care for them both). I brought up the subject of how care for the baby would be handled, and asked if I would be caring for both (figuring she would say not at first, but down the line, and figuring that it would be a good opening into asking for a higher rate). That was when she hit me with the "see how things go, figuring it out later..." bit. That did not seem like a good point for me to start demanding a raise.

I've thought a lot about this. I do want to work for them in the future, but only if they can compensate me fairly. I plan to ask her in two weeks, point blank, in person, if she is considering letting me go. I think her expression will tell me what she's really feeling (and of course I'll be listening closely to what she has to say).

If she answers with an enthusiastic "we love you, of course we won't let you go!" (Which I think there is a decent chance of happening) then I will wait another week or two and send her an email saying something to the effect of "i really enjoy working with your family, but I need to make sure that this is financially possible for me given my changing role with your family (and outline specific things I do for them, above and beyond, etc)..." And I will include wage requirements (I'm thinking $16/hr), and paid time off (including 40 hours/5 days of personal sick days, and being paid for days when I am regularly scheduled but they end up not using me because they are out of town, etc). If she cannot agree to those terms then I will find a new family.

If, on the other hand, her answer is a shifty-eyed "my husband and I are still figuring things out..." Then I will continue my job search in greater earnest and not think twice about giving only two weeks notice.

I'm open to hearing additional suggestions, etc about my new plan of action. Thank you.

I'm interested to see how this turns out. They are basically offering you very little and you are asking for basic market expectations, I don't see a family that was ok paying so far below market for 2 years suddenly jumping up to normal. I don't know the market in your area but you said COL was high, just like DC, so I will compare them. But I'm making $25 an hour here and have all the paid days off and this and that. And I've worked for $20 an hour for a long time too, and the one thing I have really noticed is the more people pay the more likely they are to act like normal employers. I always felt bad expecting to be paid my normal paycheck even when I didn't work because the family left on vacation but now I've gotten used to it. The family that pay a lot seem to expect it too and it just comes naturally, the families paying $15 an hour and under are the ones that seem to only want to pay you for the exact amount of time you work.... even if their kid is sick and they call you when your already halfway to their house to tell you not to come in, they won't pay you for that day.