Concerned about keeping DC's nanny for a second child

[Anonymous]

We have a nanny for our 1.5 year old who is with us about 25-35 hours a week. She started off as a sitter about eight months ago, but her role morphed into that of essentially a nanny. Having said that, she had zero nanny experience when she started with us and has never quite settled into the nanny role vs. just a babysitter. For instance, she has certain duties that we have agreed upon and that I have told her she should do without being told, e.g., putting away baby laundry, changing crib sheet & changing pad weekly, but she will not do them unless I instruct her to do so. And despite being given lots of encouragement, direction and reminders, she would not take DC out to typical toddler activities (library, story time, playground) for months until I dictated to her that she HAD to spend at least three hours with DC outside the home (weather permitting). Essentially, she would spend the whole day with DC at home except for an occasional stroller walk. In a nutshell, she needs to be told what to do and not just in the prior circumstances, but in many, many others.

Despite these issues, we have kept DC's nanny because aside from her loving relationship with DC, she is totally okay with having a flexible schedule. I work freelance and really appreciate that she willingly puts in extra hours when my work picks up instead of the alternative, which would be to hire a nanny for a guaranteed 40 hours/week even though sometimes I need someone for only half that time. The thing is that DH and I have started talking about trying for child #2 and I worry whether DC's nanny is up to the task of taking care of a baby and toddler. We have managed to make things work so far by me essentially treating her like a babysitter and telling her everything she needs to do, but I'm afraid that when baby #2 comes along (knock on wood), I will be so sleep-deprived and mentally so preoccupied that I will need someone I can lean on to be more like a nanny and not just a babysitter.

Thoughts? And FYI this is not a money issue and about us being too cheap or poor to replace DC's nanny with a nanny who we'd have to guarantee FT hours. It's really about our personal space. If we have a FT nanny, then that means that many hours a week (often up to 20), I will be home with the nanny around and lose my privacy and personal space. DH is the same way and while he works FT, he sometimes will work a half day from home and I see how he feels less comfortable when the nanny is here. BTW we live in a metropolitan area not in or around DC and our apartment, while spacious by local standards, at 1700 sf, comes nowhere close to a suburban house, hence the personal space issues...

Also, this is not about me seeking validation to get rid of DC's nanny. She has been with us for the better part of a year and while it's not the ideal working relationship, we are used to it and her. If we end up not having a second child (which is a real possibility), there is no question we would keep her.

[Anonymous]

What is the purpose of your post?

[Anonymous]

I don't understand. You have a nanny, or maybe a babysitter (not sure the distinction in your mind) who loves your child, works the hours you want, is reliable, but does better when you are clear what you want.

You are thinking of firing her and having a nanny with 40 guaranteed hours a week, in order to save you the effort of asking her on Friday mornings "please change the sheets on his crib".

I think you need to do some long hard soul searching and decide which of the following is more annoying.

1) Paying for many hours of care you don't need.

2) Having to say "please change the sheets", or "please take them to the park"

Let the answer guide your decision.

Or consider the possibility that there may be other nannies in this area who are willing to work less than 40 hours a week.

[Anonymous]

If you have household help, you lose some privacy. You'll get used to it. I'm a MB. My two cents is that having a good nanny will make you less uncomfortable anyway, because she won't be there all the time. She will be out doing things a lot.

Also, if you pay for 40 hours a week, you will quickly find that you use all 40 hours. Imagine not only being able to be flexible with work time, but also being able to schedule appointments with the doctor, or the hairdresser, in advance, without having to confirm the nanny is available. Once you're pregnant, you may have days you don't feel well for part of the day, and your nanny is already there.

Finally, if you truly can't get over having someone in your house, let her leave early.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What is the purpose of your post?

OP. My purpose got totally lost while writing my post, sorry! I have no idea what it's like taking care of both a toddler and baby, but I've heard that it can be very hectic, esp. if they have conflicting nap schedules and/or are sharing a room, which eventually, they would. I imagine I will really benefit from the help of someone who will be proactive and take initiative in helping out, i.e., take care of things without asking me every time, which I think an experienced nanny who has been with us eight months would be able to do, but DC's nanny does not. And I also remember a nanny or two saying that there are extra skills involved taking care of a toddler and NB vs. just one child. And DC's nanny does not have this experience.

So.... the point of my post is to ask whether people out there, MBs and nannies, think it makes sense for us to keep DC's nanny if we have a second child, balancing her weaknesses (inexperience, lack of initiative) against her strengths, which I probably did not elaborate on enough - her flexibility in helping out as much or as little (as 20 hours) as we need and her willingness to help out in whatever way she can (she has even cleaned part of the apt for us, even though we never asked her to).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand. You have a nanny, or maybe a babysitter (not sure the distinction in your mind) who loves your child, works the hours you want, is reliable, but does better when you are clear what you want.

You are thinking of firing her and having a nanny with 40 guaranteed hours a week, in order to save you the effort of asking her on Friday mornings "please change the sheets on his crib".

I think you need to do some long hard soul searching and decide which of the following is more annoying.

1) Paying for many hours of care you don't need.

2) Having to say "please change the sheets", or "please take them to the park"

Let the answer guide your decision.

Or consider the possibility that there may be other nannies in this area who are willing to work less than 40 hours a week.

Clearly you are being negative for the sake of. As I said in my original post, DC's nanny does not take on the added responsibilities of a typical nanny (beyond those of a mere babysitter) in many ways. I would revise that to say MOST ways. She is an older lady (mid 50s) who can't seem to get out of the babysitter mindset and needs to be told what to do for almost everything, not just activities and laundry.

Also, I should have been more specific and said that DC's nanny has only ever worked as an ***occasional*** babysitter and that is her mindset. The distinction between a babysitter with regular hours and a nanny can be blurry, but I hope by specifying *occasional*, you can understand what I am getting at.

[Anonymous]

I have a friend who had a "nanny" like you have now. She was a very nice woman, and my friend could never bring herself to fire her. Seven years later, their relationship is finally coming to an end (DS #2 starts full time school). My friend would tell you to make the move now.

Yes, it is much harder to care for a newborn and a toddler, and so much more physically demanding to run after a toddler/preschooler, period. If she can barely get out of the house now, you are going to be really, really disappointed with the level of activity as your child grows. Do you want a nanny who will take your active, curious 3-year-old to the same park every day where she can sit on a bench and talk to her friend, or one who will mix that up with classes, actively playing ball or going to the zoo, come up with art projects or outside exploration, etc., etc., etc.?

It's your money, but she is telling you loud and clear in her actions what kind of nanny she will be for the long term. Would you want exactly this level of activity for your children day-in-day-out?

BTW, my friend? Her nanny pretty much refused to do anything other than sit in the house if she had both kids. They ending up paying for a lot of extra, expensive preschool so that her 2-child time was limited. She cost less than other nannies, but was also less useful.

Hire a cleaning service once a week, and hire a real nanny who can do basic kid laundry and upkeep, and will actively engage with your children.

[Anonymous]

Handling a baby and a toddler is very demanding both logistically and in terms of skills. Also, managing behavior for a 2+yo is very different from a young toddler.

My last job was with a yo and her baby sister. My day looked like this:

Get both kids up, diapered, hair done, teeth brushed, dressed. Put their pajamas in the washer and start it (parents would rotate it before coming downstairs), feed toddler breakfast while baby had her bottle, then put baby in the carrier while I unloaded DW and prepped snack and lunch for toddler.

Take snack and bottle for baby and head out for an activity. Baby napped in the car/stroller or carrier for a shortish AM nap sometime during our am outing. Once a week our outing included a grocery run and twice a month we'd go to babies r us to stock up on diapers, wipes, etc. The other days were free activities I found like library story times/playground/nanny meetups/museums or sometimes classes I researched and asked the parents to sign up for.

Arrive home, change diapers, feed lunch/bottle, and get both settled for nap. During nap I'd prep dinner for the family, prep an activity for the toddler and fold laundry.

When they woke I'd bring laundry up and put kids' stuff away while getting them up, then leave MB/DB's stuff in the basket near their door. Change diapers, do snack/bottle, then do toddler activity/project while doing tummy time with baby.

Get baby settled for a catnap then clean up project with toddler and read stories/watch tv if I needed a few more minutes to prep dinner.

Baby woke from catnap and we'd play in the living room with toys until MB or DB were ready to take over.

If that sounds like what you are looking for (someone who can fully take over and remove the burden from your shoulders), then you may find it worth while to hire someone who has done that job before.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you have household help, you lose some privacy. You'll get used to it. I'm a MB. My two cents is that having a good nanny will make you less uncomfortable anyway, because she won't be there all the time. She will be out doing things a lot.

Also, if you pay for 40 hours a week, you will quickly find that you use all 40 hours. Imagine not only being able to be flexible with work time, but also being able to schedule appointments with the doctor, or the hairdresser, in advance, without having to confirm the nanny is available. Once you're pregnant, you may have days you don't feel well for part of the day, and your nanny is already there.

Finally, if you truly can't get over having someone in your house, let her leave early.

You make a valid point that a good nanny will be out with the child/ren a lot of the time. I think a good nanny would also be more mindful of our personal space. Our apartment is not big so it's a given we are in each other's space, but DC's nanny can be a little oblivious. We truly don't need the full 40 hours a week, I get all my errands done in the time DC's nanny is with us. But I think you might be right that when I'm pregnant and when there are two kids to care for, we might want the 40 hours then. You are definitely giving me second thoughts about hiring a real nanny full-time...

[Anonymous]

It is really hard to find a good nanny. A good infant/toddler nanny usually isn't great for older kids. A fun active nanny probably won't want to do much housework. I personally prefer daycare to a nanny once child is 2 years old and get a housekeeper/cook. Our daycare had an excellent preschool curriculum, amazing play areas, tons of enrichment and my child was well socialized.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a friend who had a "nanny" like you have now. She was a very nice woman, and my friend could never bring herself to fire her. Seven years later, their relationship is finally coming to an end (DS #2 starts full time school). My friend would tell you to make the move now.

Yes, it is much harder to care for a newborn and a toddler, and so much more physically demanding to run after a toddler/preschooler, period. If she can barely get out of the house now, you are going to be really, really disappointed with the level of activity as your child grows. Do you want a nanny who will take your active, curious 3-year-old to the same park every day where she can sit on a bench and talk to her friend, or one who will mix that up with classes, actively playing ball or going to the zoo, come up with art projects or outside exploration, etc., etc., etc.?

It's your money, but she is telling you loud and clear in her actions what kind of nanny she will be for the long term. Would you want exactly this level of activity for your children day-in-day-out?

BTW, my friend? Her nanny pretty much refused to do anything other than sit in the house if she had both kids. They ending up paying for a lot of extra, expensive preschool so that her 2-child time was limited. She cost less than other nannies, but was also less useful.

Hire a cleaning service once a week, and hire a real nanny who can do basic kid laundry and upkeep, and will actively engage with your children.

Thank you for this post. I can totally see myself being like your friend. I have thought on and off about letting DC's nanny go and just could not get myself to. She, like your friend's nanny, is a lovely person and I really enjoy seeing the affection between her and DC. After we were away one week for vacation, DC at 12 months of age gave the nanny the biggest hug like saying "I really missed you." The bond they have has been a huge barrier to letting her go, but I think in my heart of hearts, I know it is the right thing to do. As DC gets older and bigger, I've noticed that the nanny is physically more tired. She doesn't say anything, but I can see it in her body language. I just don't know how she will handle a full day of activities, which she hasn't really had yet. She not only is on the older side, but overweight and not in good physical shape. Thanks for the wake-up call.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Handling a baby and a toddler is very demanding both logistically and in terms of skills. Also, managing behavior for a 2+yo is very different from a young toddler.

My last job was with a yo and her baby sister. My day looked like this:

Get both kids up, diapered, hair done, teeth brushed, dressed. Put their pajamas in the washer and start it (parents would rotate it before coming downstairs), feed toddler breakfast while baby had her bottle, then put baby in the carrier while I unloaded DW and prepped snack and lunch for toddler.

Take snack and bottle for baby and head out for an activity. Baby napped in the car/stroller or carrier for a shortish AM nap sometime during our am outing. Once a week our outing included a grocery run and twice a month we'd go to babies r us to stock up on diapers, wipes, etc. The other days were free activities I found like library story times/playground/nanny meetups/museums or sometimes classes I researched and asked the parents to sign up for.

Arrive home, change diapers, feed lunch/bottle, and get both settled for nap. During nap I'd prep dinner for the family, prep an activity for the toddler and fold laundry.

When they woke I'd bring laundry up and put kids' stuff away while getting them up, then leave MB/DB's stuff in the basket near their door. Change diapers, do snack/bottle, then do toddler activity/project while doing tummy time with baby.

Get baby settled for a catnap then clean up project with toddler and read stories/watch tv if I needed a few more minutes to prep dinner.

Baby woke from catnap and we'd play in the living room with toys until MB or DB were ready to take over.

If that sounds like what you are looking for (someone who can fully take over and remove the burden from your shoulders), then you may find it worth while to hire someone who has done that job before.

You sound amazing! I am pretty sure DC's nanny could not handle your typical day. Question for you: how would you feel about a MB or DB who worked PT/not regular hours and on a regular basis, would say to you, hey I'll take the kids out this afternoon, and "mess" with your routine? Would this annoy you? One thing I like about DC's nanny is she is totally easy-going about that sort of thing and I've wondered how other, more professional nannies would feel about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a friend who had a "nanny" like you have now. She was a very nice woman, and my friend could never bring herself to fire her. Seven years later, their relationship is finally coming to an end (DS #2 starts full time school). My friend would tell you to make the move now.

Yes, it is much harder to care for a newborn and a toddler, and so much more physically demanding to run after a toddler/preschooler, period. If she can barely get out of the house now, you are going to be really, really disappointed with the level of activity as your child grows. Do you want a nanny who will take your active, curious 3-year-old to the same park every day where she can sit on a bench and talk to her friend, or one who will mix that up with classes, actively playing ball or going to the zoo, come up with art projects or outside exploration, etc., etc., etc.?

It's your money, but she is telling you loud and clear in her actions what kind of nanny she will be for the long term. Would you want exactly this level of activity for your children day-in-day-out?

BTW, my friend? Her nanny pretty much refused to do anything other than sit in the house if she had both kids. They ending up paying for a lot of extra, expensive preschool so that her 2-child time was limited. She cost less than other nannies, but was also less useful.

Hire a cleaning service once a week, and hire a real nanny who can do basic kid laundry and upkeep, and will actively engage with your children.

Thank you for this post. I can totally see myself being like your friend. I have thought on and off about letting DC's nanny go and just could not get myself to. She, like your friend's nanny, is a lovely person and I really enjoy seeing the affection between her and DC. After we were away one week for vacation, DC at 12 months of age gave the nanny the biggest hug like saying "I really missed you." The bond they have has been a huge barrier to letting her go, but I think in my heart of hearts, I know it is the right thing to do. As DC gets older and bigger, I've noticed that the nanny is physically more tired. She doesn't say anything, but I can see it in her body language. I just don't know how she will handle a full day of activities, which she hasn't really had yet. She not only is on the older side, but overweight and not in good physical shape. Thanks for the wake-up call.

Letting someone go is difficult. Honestly, doing the "personnel management" part has been the hardest part of having a nanny, and would be the only reason I would prefer a daycare sometimes. However, eventually, your relationship will end because your children will age out of nanny care. If you wait, she will be older, and you will feel even worse about it, even with years of resentment. Give her lots of notice, promise to give her a great reference for another infant gig, and move on. You can use the language, "our needs have changed, and we are so sorry, but we are going to have to find someone else. We had hoped this would work out when we decided to make it a more formal nanny position, but it really hasn't gone as well as we'd hoped." Ask her if she'd be willing to do date nights, or fill in if she's available. Since she's part time, you could even overlap with the new person.

I cried when our first nanny quit when DC1 was about 18 months old (DC2 had just been born, we had decided we needed someone full time, and she decided she ultimately didn't want the full time job). The transition was SO MUCH easier than I expected, because our new nanny was awesome, and his family (DH and I) didn't go anywhere. He does love her, in his baby way, but you and DH are with him so many more hours in the day. He isn't losing his primary caregiver.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Handling a baby and a toddler is very demanding both logistically and in terms of skills. Also, managing behavior for a 2+yo is very different from a young toddler.

My last job was with a yo and her baby sister. My day looked like this:

Get both kids up, diapered, hair done, teeth brushed, dressed. Put their pajamas in the washer and start it (parents would rotate it before coming downstairs), feed toddler breakfast while baby had her bottle, then put baby in the carrier while I unloaded DW and prepped snack and lunch for toddler.

Take snack and bottle for baby and head out for an activity. Baby napped in the car/stroller or carrier for a shortish AM nap sometime during our am outing. Once a week our outing included a grocery run and twice a month we'd go to babies r us to stock up on diapers, wipes, etc. The other days were free activities I found like library story times/playground/nanny meetups/museums or sometimes classes I researched and asked the parents to sign up for.

Arrive home, change diapers, feed lunch/bottle, and get both settled for nap. During nap I'd prep dinner for the family, prep an activity for the toddler and fold laundry.

When they woke I'd bring laundry up and put kids' stuff away while getting them up, then leave MB/DB's stuff in the basket near their door. Change diapers, do snack/bottle, then do toddler activity/project while doing tummy time with baby.

Get baby settled for a catnap then clean up project with toddler and read stories/watch tv if I needed a few more minutes to prep dinner.

Baby woke from catnap and we'd play in the living room with toys until MB or DB were ready to take over.

If that sounds like what you are looking for (someone who can fully take over and remove the burden from your shoulders), then you may find it worth while to hire someone who has done that job before.

You sound amazing! I am pretty sure DC's nanny could not handle your typical day. Question for you: how would you feel about a MB or DB who worked PT/not regular hours and on a regular basis, would say to you, hey I'll take the kids out this afternoon, and "mess" with your routine? Would this annoy you? One thing I like about DC's nanny is she is totally easy-going about that sort of thing and I've wondered how other, more professional nannies would feel about it.

I'm a WAHM, and I work full time in 10-week "bursts," 3 times a year. The rest of the time, I'm very part time. When I'm "off," I try to do more with the kids. We have four, so I might make a one-on-one date with one, or go to a school event. I let my nanny know in advance, but she is very flexible, too. You need to look for a nanny who doesn't mind working for WAH parents, anyway. There are plenty on this site who say they hate it and will never do it, but I've always had good relationships with our nannies over the years. I ask if she's got something special planned, which is rare, and if she does, maybe I tag along or reschedule.

This Thursday, for example, there will be no nanny car for her because it has to go to the shop. I made that appointment without consulting her, but I let her know on Monday, and offered to put the carseats in her car if she really wanted to get out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Handling a baby and a toddler is very demanding both logistically and in terms of skills. Also, managing behavior for a 2+yo is very different from a young toddler.

My last job was with a yo and her baby sister. My day looked like this:

Get both kids up, diapered, hair done, teeth brushed, dressed. Put their pajamas in the washer and start it (parents would rotate it before coming downstairs), feed toddler breakfast while baby had her bottle, then put baby in the carrier while I unloaded DW and prepped snack and lunch for toddler.

Take snack and bottle for baby and head out for an activity. Baby napped in the car/stroller or carrier for a shortish AM nap sometime during our am outing. Once a week our outing included a grocery run and twice a month we'd go to babies r us to stock up on diapers, wipes, etc. The other days were free activities I found like library story times/playground/nanny meetups/museums or sometimes classes I researched and asked the parents to sign up for.

Arrive home, change diapers, feed lunch/bottle, and get both settled for nap. During nap I'd prep dinner for the family, prep an activity for the toddler and fold laundry.

When they woke I'd bring laundry up and put kids' stuff away while getting them up, then leave MB/DB's stuff in the basket near their door. Change diapers, do snack/bottle, then do toddler activity/project while doing tummy time with baby.

Get baby settled for a catnap then clean up project with toddler and read stories/watch tv if I needed a few more minutes to prep dinner.

Baby woke from catnap and we'd play in the living room with toys until MB or DB were ready to take over.

If that sounds like what you are looking for (someone who can fully take over and remove the burden from your shoulders), then you may find it worth while to hire someone who has done that job before.

You sound amazing! I am pretty sure DC's nanny could not handle your typical day. Question for you: how would you feel about a MB or DB who worked PT/not regular hours and on a regular basis, would say to you, hey I'll take the kids out this afternoon, and "mess" with your routine? Would this annoy you? One thing I like about DC's nanny is she is totally easy-going about that sort of thing and I've wondered how other, more professional nannies would feel about it.

I have actually worked with several WAHPs and it was never a problem for them to want to pick up more hours with their kid, provided they communicated clearly. In a good nanny-employer relationship, we would be working together to keep the kids on a similar routine 7 days a week, so you would know when activities, meals, naps, etc. happen. The way it has worked for me is that NP will ask what we have planned and we'll take it from there--e.g., I promised toddler I'd take her to X park, so parent says, "I'll take the kids, have them ready to go at X time and we'll be back around Y." Or they'll volunteer to keep the baby so toddler can explore the park more, or volunteer to take toddler so that I can stay home with the baby, etc. I could see it being an issue if you walked in right as we were starting a project and demanded to take DC for ice cream right then, but if you walked in and said, "whoa! This project looks fun! Can I join in?" And added, "I'm done for the day and can take over whenever you're ready to leave." That would be totally fine.