Nanny Sick Days WWYD?

[Anonymous]

Our nanny took a trip back to her home country several months ago. She was gone for about three weeks. Her contract gives her two weeks of vacation - one of her choice and one of ours - and five sick days. She asked if she could use all her time for the trip as she really could not afford to go without being paid. We allowed it and paid her for the whole time - including allowing her to take the second week of vacation that was supposed to be our choice - with the agreement that she would not take additional vacation days in the year and any additional sick or emergency days would be unpaid. We had to pay another babysitter for those three weeks as well which was tough since we had only planned on two weeks of back up care. Her contract year runs June to June so she still has a few months before her days reset.

Today nanny shows up to work VERY sick and unable to work. I took one look at her and sent her home. DC is not sick and she did not catch whatever it was from my DC. I guess I will pay her for today anyway since she clearly showed up because she did not want to take a day unpaid, but WWYD if she is sick for several more days (as I am guessing she will be). I don't want her getting DC sick but any days she takes off, we have to either take off ourselves or pay a back up sitter. We really budget to be able to afford a nanny and pay her well so on the one hand I can't afford to give her a ton of extra days (and I feel a little taken advantage of because I was never thrilled with the situation but we like and care about our nanny and wanted to make it work for her). On the other hand, I get that she needs the money. If it makes a difference, in addition to her trip, she also ended up with several additional weeks of paid vacation this year because we took some time off around the holidays.

[Anonymous]

This puts you in a terrible spot. I think I'd probably do something like you did (send her home but pay her for today) but for additional days I'd simply say I can't pay her.

This is a tough thing but it isn't all that different than nannies asking for loans. In allowing her to use all of her leave you (and she of course) were rolling the dice.

This is why some companies give PTO and some give sick/vacation. I believe in sick leave, but I believe that it should only be used for illness (or care for sick family members, doctor visits, etc...)

It's a painful lesson but I think you're within your rights to not have her jeapordizing your families health, and not paying her.

Really tough spot for you though.

[Anonymous]

I would NOT pay her for today - it just sends the message that as long as she shows up, she'll get paid. So, she'll just keep coming to work whenever she's sick, and risk getting your child sick. I think you're better off sending the message that if she's sick, she might as well stay home from the get-go, because, per your agreement, she's not getting paid.

[Anonymous]

If you want to encourage her to stay home when sick, I think not paying her is not the way to do it. If she showed up to work as sick as you say, she obviously can't afford to go without pay. If you both make her stay home and not pay her, that doesn't really seem fair to me. If you're making the decision to send her home, I see that as being the same as you coming home early and sending her home. I agree with a PP that sick leave should only be used for illnesses or emergencies, to avoid situations like this, but seeing as how you allowed it and she's willing to work but you aren't willing to let her, I think it's on you to either pay her or let her work.

[Anonymous]

Your nanny made an unwise decision to take a long trip she couldn't afford to take unless she was paid throughout it. She knew the risks up front as you made it clear to her that any additional days off would be unpaid.

You've already said you would likely pay her for yesterday, but personally I don't think it's necessary (particularly since she didn't get sick from your child). If she is sick for a few more days I would not pay her. She is an adult who made the decision to use all her paid vacation and sick time to take a trip. She knew that additional days would be unpaid. It sucks if her financial situation is lousy, but that's ultimately not your problem. If I were you I would stick to your original agreement about no pay for any additional days she needs to take off.

I'm a nanny btw, and I would fully expect you to stick to the original agreement if I were in your nanny's shoes.

Good luck, you're both in a tough position.

[Anonymous]

If you want to encourage her to stay home when sick, I think not paying her is not the way to do it. If she showed up to work as sick as you say, she obviously can't afford to go without pay. If you both make her stay home and not pay her, that doesn't really seem fair to me.

No way. The nanny is gaming the situation here. She knows that she is not able to work but wants additional PTO. She comes in expecting her employer to send her home and pay her. Guaranteed hours is not just about paying the nanny if she shows up, its paying a nanny of she is ABLE to work. Significant illness means that she can not perform her job expectations. In addition, when the nanny asked for an extra third week of paid vacation (after already getting several extra weeks through guaranteed hours) she agreed that any sick time would be unpaid.

The employer is completely in the right for sending her home and having this be an unpaid sick day.

[Anonymous]

Yes clearly coming to work was gaming the system...cuz none of us ever do that. OP made the decision to send her home. Some MBs would not have sent her home. Mine for one gives me crap for any sick day and would prefer I came in.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the advice. I knew at the time we shouldn't have let her use up all her leave but she had important family reasons for going and didn't feel like she could otherwise, and at the end of the day we care about her and wanted to try and accommodate her. I think I am additionally frustrated because we were not thrilled about the situation at the time but were trying to do the kind thing and now I feel a little taken advantge of. Ugh this sucks.

And in response to 7:00, I think my point is that she may be willing to work, but I do not think she is "able" to work, given that she is clearly very ill and would be exposing DC to her illness. You are right that we, despite our reservations, ultimately allowed this, but we made clear that we expected any additional time off would be unpaid. By showing up, I feel like she is unfairly doing exactly what you are saying - putting the onus on me to send her home in order to avoid exposing DC, and therefore paying her anyway, instead of staying home herself.

I am sympathetic to the fact that she needs the money but I guess I thought she'd demonstrate better judgment.

[Anonymous]

Let her go.

[Anonymous]

OP, two ideas (neither one ideal)

Would you consider letting her take an advance on her PTO from next year. Out of the nanny's choice vacation. (Not the sick days)

What about making up the time as babysitting?

[Anonymous]

Agree with 9:50!

[Anonymous]

I am the PP who said I agree with 9:50. I am a nanny. She made her choice (I've done something similar actually when I was in a bind, but we both agreed to it and it worked out good), and has now put you in an awkward spot.
It was obvious that she was very sick and showed up anyways. You sent her home, so now you're stuck being the bad guy by not paying her (even though she agreed with this initially).

11:17 suggested making up some babysitting hours - not a bad idea- but I wouldn't phrase it as "making up" (see thread about banking hours). I would stick with the original agreement (unpaid sick leave, therefore not paying her for today and any additional sick days), but, you could ask her if she wants to work a couple nights next week (and this isn't required- just something to say if you're feeling a little bad about it).

Maybe send her an email tonight?
"Hi Nanny, I hope you are resting up. I think it was in both our best interests that you took today off since you were under the weather. I know you don't want to lose income, and I can understand that, but if you're sick and unable to care for ______ , then I have to make a judgement call. We had previously agreed to changes in our work agreement which were that we would pay you for your time away and therefore any additional time off (including sick days) would be unpaid. However, if you would like to work a couple extra nights next week, we could use you Tues and Thurs until around 9pm. Let me know what you think. And please touch base with me later about how you're feeling so I can make appropriate plans for tomorrow. Thank you, ______ "

[Anonymous]

"By showing up, I feel like she is unfairly doing exactly what you are saying - putting the onus on me to send her home in order to avoid exposing DC, and therefore paying her anyway, instead of staying home herself. "

exactly. you should not pay her OP but you need to at the same time remind her that this was what SHE picked - and choosing to use up all her sick days as vacation time does not mean that she gets to just come to work sick. If she is clearly very ill and contagious then she's not able to work so you can't pay her for that.

[Anonymous]

She should be able to hide her illness if she wants to work.

[Anonymous]

She knew she was taking all her sick days. She shouldn't be paid nor should your children be put in a position where they get ill. Tell her NO.