Anonymous
05/24/2023 08:43
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bottom line is McCarthy doesn’t have the votes to broker a deal with Biden and save his Speakership. GOP is going to take the country over the fiscal cliff and blame the White House. And since Biden has long lost his ability to think clearly and speak coherently, the GOP may actually pull it off.
Or, if Biden refuses to negotiate and make meaningful concessions, we will go over the fiscal cliff. That's the way i see it.
What meaningful concessions is McCarthy offering?
He's taken everything except discretionary spending off the table for starters.
How about we go back to the spending budget of 2018? He isn't even pushing that hard.
So he’s offered nothing then?
That is the offer.
There's a 1.5T spending cut bill on the table. If you don't like it, don't agree to it.
Don't care. Let's Thelma and Louise this.
So McCarthy is just threatening to crash the economy and hurt tens of millions of Americans unless he gets what he wants, and he won’t give up a single thing to get it. Got it.
Anonymous
05/24/2023 08:42
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Even with that offer, the hard right said they won't support it, so McCarthy has two options:
1) tank the economy
2) get 10 democrats to side with some moderate offer in exchange for supporting his speakership.
1) tank the economy
2) get 10 democrats to side with some moderate offer in exchange for supporting his speakership.
Anonymous
05/24/2023 08:40
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bottom line is McCarthy doesn’t have the votes to broker a deal with Biden and save his Speakership. GOP is going to take the country over the fiscal cliff and blame the White House. And since Biden has long lost his ability to think clearly and speak coherently, the GOP may actually pull it off.
Or, if Biden refuses to negotiate and make meaningful concessions, we will go over the fiscal cliff. That's the way i see it.
What meaningful concessions is McCarthy offering?
He's taken everything except discretionary spending off the table for starters.
How about we go back to the spending budget of 2018? He isn't even pushing that hard.
So he’s offered nothing then?
That is the offer.
There's a 1.5T spending cut bill on the table. If you don't like it, don't agree to it.
Don't care. Let's Thelma and Louise this.
Anonymous
05/24/2023 08:37
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bottom line is McCarthy doesn’t have the votes to broker a deal with Biden and save his Speakership. GOP is going to take the country over the fiscal cliff and blame the White House. And since Biden has long lost his ability to think clearly and speak coherently, the GOP may actually pull it off.
Or, if Biden refuses to negotiate and make meaningful concessions, we will go over the fiscal cliff. That's the way i see it.
What meaningful concessions is McCarthy offering?
He's taken everything except discretionary spending off the table for starters.
How about we go back to the spending budget of 2018? He isn't even pushing that hard.
So he has taken 90% of spending off the table and is leaving things like funding police and teachers, maintaining roads, food safety inspections and VA hospitals.
Anonymous
Anonymous
05/24/2023 08:35
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bottom line is McCarthy doesn’t have the votes to broker a deal with Biden and save his Speakership. GOP is going to take the country over the fiscal cliff and blame the White House. And since Biden has long lost his ability to think clearly and speak coherently, the GOP may actually pull it off.
Or, if Biden refuses to negotiate and make meaningful concessions, we will go over the fiscal cliff. That's the way i see it.
What meaningful concessions is McCarthy offering?
He's taken everything except discretionary spending off the table for starters.
How about we go back to the spending budget of 2018? He isn't even pushing that hard.
So he’s offered nothing then?
Anonymous
05/24/2023 08:34
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Bottom line is McCarthy doesn’t have the votes to broker a deal with Biden and save his Speakership. GOP is going to take the country over the fiscal cliff and blame the White House. And since Biden has long lost his ability to think clearly and speak coherently, the GOP may actually pull it off.
He certainly managed to own the GOP at the state of the union where soscial security was concerned, and the fact the GOP is breaking that pledge now makes an easy commercial for 2024.
Fact is, most of the US isn't paying any attention to this and will simply blame the president, regardless of party.
Anonymous
05/24/2023 08:30
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bottom line is McCarthy doesn’t have the votes to broker a deal with Biden and save his Speakership. GOP is going to take the country over the fiscal cliff and blame the White House. And since Biden has long lost his ability to think clearly and speak coherently, the GOP may actually pull it off.
Or, if Biden refuses to negotiate and make meaningful concessions, we will go over the fiscal cliff. That's the way i see it.
What meaningful concessions is McCarthy offering?
He's taken everything except discretionary spending off the table for starters.
How about we go back to the spending budget of 2018? He isn't even pushing that hard.
Anonymous
05/24/2023 08:22
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Bottom line is McCarthy doesn’t have the votes to broker a deal with Biden and save his Speakership. GOP is going to take the country over the fiscal cliff and blame the White House. And since Biden has long lost his ability to think clearly and speak coherently, the GOP may actually pull it off.
Or, if Biden refuses to negotiate and make meaningful concessions, we will go over the fiscal cliff. That's the way i see it.
What meaningful concessions is McCarthy offering?
Anonymous
05/24/2023 08:16
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Bottom line is McCarthy doesn’t have the votes to broker a deal with Biden and save his Speakership. GOP is going to take the country over the fiscal cliff and blame the White House. And since Biden has long lost his ability to think clearly and speak coherently, the GOP may actually pull it off.
Or, if Biden refuses to negotiate and make meaningful concessions, we will go over the fiscal cliff. That's the way i see it.
Anonymous
05/24/2023 07:56
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Bottom line is McCarthy doesn’t have the votes to broker a deal with Biden and save his Speakership. GOP is going to take the country over the fiscal cliff and blame the White House. And since Biden has long lost his ability to think clearly and speak coherently, the GOP may actually pull it off.
With a bunch of brainwashed people like you repeating whatever line they’re fed…
Anonymous
05/24/2023 07:18
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:.Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:The fundamental problem here is that McCarthy does not have the votes for any deal he cuts with Biden, but he does not seem to recognize that fact. 30-50 of his members are extreme wackos who will vote against anything
McCarthy has already gotten the House to pass an increase of the debt limit. How did this happen if 30-50 of his members will vote against anything?
Because what he passed will never pass the Senate. It’s not a serious proposal.
The claim was that his own caucus wouldn't pass anything.
They won’t vote for anything that would pass the Senate and be signed by the President. They only vote for something that they knew it would never be enacted. It had a huge target for spending cuts that would force cancellations of programs and operations but it didn’t detail specific program cuts so they could lie that they weren’t slashing veterans benefits or shutting down hundreds of air traffic control towers or any of the other necessary programs and facilities and operations. It also included the usual stupid shit about repealing regulations of oil and gas, repealing green energy incentives, etc. It’s a bill that essentially declares that House Republicans are a delusional cult detached from reality.
Anonymous
05/24/2023 07:10
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Bottom line is McCarthy doesn’t have the votes to broker a deal with Biden and save his Speakership. GOP is going to take the country over the fiscal cliff and blame the White House. And since Biden has long lost his ability to think clearly and speak coherently, the GOP may actually pull it off.
Anonymous
05/24/2023 06:31
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:The fundamental problem here is that McCarthy does not have the votes for any deal he cuts with Biden, but he does not seem to recognize that fact. 30-50 of his members are extreme wackos who will vote against anything, and the Rs don't control the Senate (and there are probably 10 Rs in the Senate who are extreme wackos who will vote against anything). So he's got to cut a deal that will get 50 plus D votes in the House and 30 plus D votes in the Senate. But he's not offering the Ds anything at all. He won't reform prescription drug pricing, won't close the carried interest loophole, won't increase taxes on wealthy, and won't cut defense spending. Negotiation means both sides get something and give up something. But it's just demands from McCarthy with no give.
It is McCarthy who is giving. With no debt ceiling increase you have to cut trillions in spending. That is the starting position of negotiations.
There is no default that would happen, unless Biden wants it to. Not raising the debt ceiling does not produce default, it produces trillions in spending cuts.
Democrats are giving up so much because they are the party of more government and more spending, though Republicans spend even more when they are in power.
If they want to say OK we will cut trillions, McConnell will freak out and be eager to cut a deal.
I find it very curious that the same people who insist Biden is a dictator advocate for him to pick and choice which congressionally authorized spending he will and won’t do. I guess he can just stop paying ag subsidies and cut off all grants to red states? Maybe get rid of the border patrol and ICE?
If you accept the idea that the president can unilaterally ignore spending laws when the debt ceiling is hit, then you also have to accept the idea that he can ignore tax laws. Why couldn't Biden just unilaterally raise taxes in order to pay for the spending that congress has mandated?
Because taxing power lies with Congress. People would not have to pay taxes he unilaterally decided to raise.
Now if he cut taxes, declaring that he would not enforce the tax law against anyone who paid a lower rate that he deemed appropriate, then that might be acceptable. Certainly this is what Obama did with DACA.
The spending power also lies with congress. But lots of MAGAs on here are saying Biden can just choose to ignore spending laws to comply with the debt limit. So why not tax laws as well?
Anonymous
05/24/2023 06:16
Subject: Republicans and the debt ceiling
From heather Cox Richardson:
the Trump tax cuts and Trump's increased spending even before the pandemic ultimately added $7.8 trillion to the national debt, about $23,500 for every person in the country. The increase in the annual deficit under Trump was the third-biggest increase of any administration, relative to the size of the economy. He was beaten out only by George W. Bush and Abraham Lincoln. Bush, of course, led the U.S. into two foreign conflicts that were financed almost entirely through debt (in the past, the U.S. paid for war through taxes and war bonds), after Congress cut taxes by about 8% for the wealthiest Americans. Lincoln fought the Civil War.
the Trump tax cuts and Trump's increased spending even before the pandemic ultimately added $7.8 trillion to the national debt, about $23,500 for every person in the country. The increase in the annual deficit under Trump was the third-biggest increase of any administration, relative to the size of the economy. He was beaten out only by George W. Bush and Abraham Lincoln. Bush, of course, led the U.S. into two foreign conflicts that were financed almost entirely through debt (in the past, the U.S. paid for war through taxes and war bonds), after Congress cut taxes by about 8% for the wealthiest Americans. Lincoln fought the Civil War.