Anonymous wrote:Celeste Ng seems to be straight up lying.

What??! This can't be right. According to her Twitter bio, she is "embarrassingly sincere." Struggling to reconcile.

Sadly I think the BYT achieved exactly what they wanted a media storm without caring who got hurt.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And despite Ng commercial success I take issue with here writing her themes her characters and her poor me attitude. Now the real person is revealed.

Is Ng's book like the Reese Witherspoon show? That show was so ham handed and stupid. Every single person was an over the top caricature, obvious, one dimensional and so dumb. Couldn't stand it. It watched like a cheesy soap opera.

I read LFE before it got a TV deal and felt like her prose was a cut above "grabbed it at the airport kiosk" but the plotting was very heavy-handed and predictable. I'm not surprised it got a TV deal because of the themes and soapiness, but I am surprised to learn this week that she's considered Literary Fiction and not just . . . fiction.

Anonymous wrote:Here's my question of the day. If you're one of the Chunky Monkeys, how are you feeling about Sonya Larson right about now?

If I was a member I would feel betrayed. For most of these members they were relying on Sonya being truthful, and she was not. Now they're "being dragged" and will have to answer questions about this debacle at every cocktail party they go to for the rest of their lives.

Yeah, I think they are thinking, WTF Sonya, we treated DD like this because we took your word for it that she's a creepy stalker who's obsessed with destroying your career. I mean, if a creepy, obsessed stalker really was trying to ruin my friend's life, I would say F*ck her! too.

At first I was somewhat underwhelmed by Becky Tuch's apology, but with her clarifications today, and the fact that she's STILL the only person to apologize publicly, I am changing my mind. Because while she doesn't outright say it, the implication is that Sonya lied to everyone and that's why they acted the way they did.

Anonymous wrote:And despite Ng commercial success I take issue with here writing her themes her characters and her poor me attitude. Now the real person is revealed.

Is Ng's book like the Reese Witherspoon show? That show was so ham handed and stupid. Every single person was an over the top caricature, obvious, one dimensional and so dumb. Couldn't stand it. It watched like a cheesy soap opera.

I don't understand why Larsen didn't just talk to Dorland and tell her she was writing a story about a flawed character who donates a kidney who is totally different from Dorland's experience, while ensuring Dorland it wasn't about her. I mean, she shouldn't have a problem lying about that. That's a better lie than stealing and lying about it.

She could make up all kinds of things and excuses to ensure Dorland it wasn't a caricature of her even though it was.

I truly had no idea that people treated each other the way Larsen, Ng, and others do in those text threads. What god awful "adult" women. I hope they all have some serious introspection after this.

Anonymous wrote:I personally think Dorland has a good case but not a good lawyer. Who asks for $5K for this kind of mess? Larson deserves the smacking she would get if Dorland had a better lawyer.

I don't think this is about money for Dorland and even if it was perhaps Larson doesn't have any significant funds or assets to go after. Many a lawyer would advise when it comes to lawsuits not to beat a dead horse.

And despite Ng commercial success I take issue with here writing her themes her characters and her poor me attitude. Now the real person is revealed.

Here's my question of the day. If you're one of the Chunky Monkeys, how are you feeling about Sonya Larson right about now?

If I was a member I would feel betrayed. For most of these members they were relying on Sonya being truthful, and she was not. Now they're "being dragged" and will have to answer questions about this debacle at every cocktail party they go to for the rest of their lives.

I personally think Dorland has a good case but not a good lawyer. Who asks for $5K for this kind of mess? Larson deserves the smacking she would get if Dorland had a better lawyer.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From Data Lounge:

Check out Celeste Ng’s Wikipedia page. Someone has added this:

"In October 2021, she was involved in an online controversy wherein she stated a kidney donor should “go f*ck herself and her one kidney.”

I mean, it's actually relevant info. This is career-defining stuff. Bullying, plagiarism, the crucifixion of a kidney donor, classism, all rolled up into one? These people are so shortsighted, I almost feel bad for them.

Omg, the line is still there on her wikipedia page, unedited, whole and perfect omg, this is killing me

Because I can’t overthink this enough – some more thoughts on possible motivation.

This case reminded me that on a larger scale Amanda Knox wrote a long thread on Twitter about Matt Damon and Stillwater stealing her life for gain earlier this year. There’s a lot written in true crime about how to tell a story in a morally responsible way. Knox talked about missed profits, but also how they skewered her life, got the facts all wrong, which made it more difficult to engage with society. One beef is that nobody from the movie reached out to her to find out what it was like to actually have been in that situation. If I recall, she said she didn’t have a leg to stand on because people have a right to use life situations, but was there any responsibility to her. It hurt her deeply that she only found out about the movie through a trailer.

Some of this echoes what Dawn was feeling: cut out from the story and misrepresented. If you were writing a story about a kidney donation and a friend had just participated in one, wouldn’t you at the very least ask about their experience? I took a look at Sonya’s website, and was surprised to see that The Kindest is prominently featured on her homepage. It says in large font, “Hi. I wrote The Kindest.” There’s a video and links to info about Asian-American racism, and alcoholism (but not about kidney donation). She clearly published other works after The Kindest, so is this story the one that has most-defined or -propelled her career? If that’s the case, that might explain exactly why both Sonya AND Dawn are not giving this up.

That would mean Sonya’s most-important feat in her career was a (poorly written IMO) story that was based on a petty rant, so she’s clinging on so tightly to the cognitive dissonance. But, if Dawn sees what she feels is her story, drawn wrongly, as being the apex of Sonya’s career, that may also explain why she’s digging in. It strikes me that she believes in fairness and truth, especially in telling stories. And, we all know she has a valid claim because unlike Stillwater, Sonya lifted a letter from Dawn, giving Dawn a leg to stand on in the courts. In fact, as many, many people have said she could have disguised it enough so that Dawn might guess it was about her, but couldn’t really tell. But, Sonya made a very poor choice.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honest to God, I'd like to pursue writing, but I just CANNOT STAND writer Twitter. And it seems like you have to have a Twitter following to get published. Have some other folks decided not to take certain career paths because of social media nonsense?

Agreed. This has been a barrier to my development and confidence as a writer, tbh. I've mostly kept away from social media for my mental health. Privacy is incredibly important to me as a survivor of violence. But my lack of social capital via a notable twitter/ig presence, or the desire to achieve one, has discouraged me from submitting my work and connecting with other writers out of fear of rejection. I'm still trying to forge my own little path but I do worry that there is no space left in this field for people who aren't Extremely Online.

This is how i feel too -- that success would require embracing Extremely Online stuff, which i just can't ever do.

I’m very sorry for this, PPs. As a visual artist I feel similarly. The cream is not rising to the top, just the IG detritus.

This is so, so true

Unfortunately this is how it is for anyone in any creative field now. If you want to be a model, writer, singer, actor, artist etc. nobody will look at your or your work without already having a social media following. If you go to audition for something or submit work you are expected to put you social media handles and number of followers on the resume you submit. There is no room for discovery or introductions anymore because there is too much media and everyone is trying to grab your attention plus the fact that at least in the entertainment world profits have plummeted and there is only room for safe guaranteed hits.

Anonymous wrote:

God, is this saga going to be never-ending?

But this entire thread is excellent.

I would love to know who this is — definitely a writer.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honest to God, I'd like to pursue writing, but I just CANNOT STAND writer Twitter. And it seems like you have to have a Twitter following to get published. Have some other folks decided not to take certain career paths because of social media nonsense?

Agreed. This has been a barrier to my development and confidence as a writer, tbh. I've mostly kept away from social media for my mental health. Privacy is incredibly important to me as a survivor of violence. But my lack of social capital via a notable twitter/ig presence, or the desire to achieve one, has discouraged me from submitting my work and connecting with other writers out of fear of rejection. I'm still trying to forge my own little path but I do worry that there is no space left in this field for people who aren't Extremely Online.

This is how i feel too -- that success would require embracing Extremely Online stuff, which i just can't ever do.

I’m very sorry for this, PPs. As a visual artist I feel similarly. The cream is not rising to the top, just the IG detritus.

This is so, so true