Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:2-8 pm is long enough. THe fact that you often stay until 11 pm or spend the night (?!!) is beyond. He's a grown up.

+1. I dont want to stay up late drinking and crash at someone’s place on a regular basis. This isn’t college. In most families, this is not a normal expectation. Divorce. He’s selfish. You and the family dislike each other. Personally, I’d rather be alone.

First of all do we know it was crashing on the couch? Second, it was not at "someone's place." It was family. And just because your family is not close does not mean what others do is wrong. This had to be going on before they got married. Wasn't there a clue this is how they lived?

Anonymous wrote:Who are all these PPs normalizing threatening divorce? No, it’s not ok and not normal.

I am NOT trying to “normalize” it whatsoever.

What IS normal for most divorces is: they are preceded by yelling.

Also: abuse is an extreme concept which does not include yelling alone.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your husband will try to gaslight you into believing his family is just a normal, close knit family. This is not true. People who love each other care about each other’s needs.

He believes you are selfish and will expect you to apologize but he will carry resentment and, if you are not on perfect behavior around your in laws in the future, he will hold it against you. If you have children, they will also be roped into this dysfunctional situation.

The only way this will end is if he, himself, comes to the realization that he needs to institute some boundaries with his family. This may never happen and as long as you are the only one trying to set reasonable boundaries, you will be viewed as the bad guy.

Yes. So they quietly give up their Sunday so that their spouse can have family time.

A lot of selfish BS on this thread.

Yes, that is what OP did do. Wanting to leave before 8pm on a work night, after dinner and dessert, is not selfish. If you feel this way your views are skewed and you likely don’t realize how selfish you are.

So everyone is calling everyone selfish?

It sounds like you acted pretty selfishly and spoiled on Fathers Day, making it clear to everyone that you were in a rush to leave. Please make sure to drive separately next time, as you clearly ruined everyone's time.

Who are all these PPs normalizing threatening divorce? No, it’s not ok and not normal.

Anonymous wrote:2-8 pm is long enough. THe fact that you often stay until 11 pm or spend the night (?!!) is beyond. He's a grown up.

+1. I dont want to stay up late drinking and crash at someone’s place on a regular basis. This isn’t college. In most families, this is not a normal expectation. Divorce. He’s selfish. You and the family dislike each other. Personally, I’d rather be alone.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Re: hubby’s outburst:

2 possibilities I see here:

1) he didn’t mean any of it and just lashed out / lost control in a moment oF anger, or

2) he has actually been harboring these thoughts for months (or longer) and there is some truth there. He actually feels this way toward you.

If it is number 2, then I believe you have been in denial or “had blinders on” for a while here, OP.

Start being honest and do some serious, difficult, deep self-reflection here OP. Are you the perfect wife OP? Or do you have flaws? What possible flaws could have lead to your husband saying what he said?

Even if you divorce, it will help you in the long run to do some self reflection here, OP (except if you are perfect and he is 100% at fault completely here).

You don't have to be perfect to deserve not being abused like this.

Hmm - spouse A yelled at spouse B, said they are a terrible spouse, and began packing to leave.

- you think that is that out of the ordinary for divorces? (hint: it’s common), and

- you seriously believe that constitutes “abuse?” If so, then you just lowered the bar and diminished the actual abuse suffered by many women out there.

I have been "actually abused" in the way that left a physical mark. You are not standing up for me in any way when you say that emotional abuse doesn't count. It doesn't matter how common something is - I'm sure you can find a context where hitting your wife was common, and it was/is still abuse. When you humiliate, criticize, and threaten your partner like this, when you overreact to small things and make them feel crazy, you are abusing them. And the fact that he has no intention of actually divorcing her for this is part of what makes it abuse. If he actually thinks this is worthy of divorce, that would be crazy, but at least he would be ending it and letting her move on. But he wasn't doing that, he was playing a manipulative game to get her to respond a certain way. People who stick around for abuse are great at rationalizing that abuse. They are great at listing their own faults. They know they are imperfect, and it is much easier for them to believe that their imperfections might justify the behavior, because the alternative - that they love someone who is monstrous to them, and that no amount of behavioral changes on their own part will fix it - is much more difficult.

2-8 pm is long enough. THe fact that you often stay until 11 pm or spend the night (?!!) is beyond. He's a grown up.

Reading between the lines, it sounds like he has an obnoxious family that you don't like, they (and he) have picked up on the fact that you don't like them and don't like spending time there, and your husband is offended by this bc he is close with his family and sees it as you rejecting that and trying to change it.

So the issue about the amount of time spent there is probably just the catalyst for these deeper problems. FWIW, I would also be really annoyed if we spent that much time at my in-laws on a regular basis, especially with the drinking and obnoxious behavior you describe. However, it sounds like you haven't done a good job of hiding your distaste for them.

I'd probably end this relationship bc it sounds miserable and I don't see a path to things getting better, maybe counseling but it doesn't sound like he would be interested in that.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your husband will try to gaslight you into believing his family is just a normal, close knit family. This is not true. People who love each other care about each other’s needs.

He believes you are selfish and will expect you to apologize but he will carry resentment and, if you are not on perfect behavior around your in laws in the future, he will hold it against you. If you have children, they will also be roped into this dysfunctional situation.

The only way this will end is if he, himself, comes to the realization that he needs to institute some boundaries with his family. This may never happen and as long as you are the only one trying to set reasonable boundaries, you will be viewed as the bad guy.

Yes. So they quietly give up their Sunday so that their spouse can have family time.

A lot of selfish BS on this thread.

Yes, that is what OP did do. Wanting to leave before 8pm on a work night, after dinner and dessert, is not selfish. If you feel this way your views are skewed and you likely don’t realize how selfish you are.

Anonymous wrote:Your husband will try to gaslight you into believing his family is just a normal, close knit family. This is not true. People who love each other care about each other’s needs.

He believes you are selfish and will expect you to apologize but he will carry resentment and, if you are not on perfect behavior around your in laws in the future, he will hold it against you. If you have children, they will also be roped into this dysfunctional situation.

The only way this will end is if he, himself, comes to the realization that he needs to institute some boundaries with his family. This may never happen and as long as you are the only one trying to set reasonable boundaries, you will be viewed as the bad guy.

Yes. So they quietly give up their Sunday so that their spouse can have family time.

A lot of selfish BS on this thread.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Re: hubby’s outburst:

2 possibilities I see here:

1) he didn’t mean any of it and just lashed out / lost control in a moment oF anger, or

2) he has actually been harboring these thoughts for months (or longer) and there is some truth there. He actually feels this way toward you.

If it is number 2, then I believe you have been in denial or “had blinders on” for a while here, OP.

Start being honest and do some serious, difficult, deep self-reflection here OP. Are you the perfect wife OP? Or do you have flaws? What possible flaws could have lead to your husband saying what he said?

Even if you divorce, it will help you in the long run to do some self reflection here, OP (except if you are perfect and he is 100% at fault completely here).

You don't have to be perfect to deserve not being abused like this.

Hmm - spouse A yelled at spouse B, said they are a terrible spouse, and began packing to leave.

- you think that is that out of the ordinary for divorces? (hint: it’s common), and

- you seriously believe that constitutes “abuse?” If so, then you just lowered the bar and diminished the actual abuse suffered by many women out there.

OP, a reasonable solution would be to leave separately, you indicate that is not possible with your husband and so I'm guessing he's also not open to counseling to learn how to negotiate better boundaries with his family and stand up for you.


thus: here are your likely choices.

Accept this is going to be the dynamic always, accept DH's trashy family, and accept you will always be second to them, your SIL hates you, and if/when you have kids it will be much worse.

move with DH far far away so you only have to deal with this on visits and on the phone

divorcing

Your husband will try to gaslight you into believing his family is just a normal, close knit family. This is not true. People who love each other care about each other’s needs.

He believes you are selfish and will expect you to apologize but he will carry resentment and, if you are not on perfect behavior around your in laws in the future, he will hold it against you. If you have children, they will also be roped into this dysfunctional situation.

The only way this will end is if he, himself, comes to the realization that he needs to institute some boundaries with his family. This may never happen and as long as you are the only one trying to set reasonable boundaries, you will be viewed as the bad guy.

Assuming you stay with DH and you go to another family event with him this is what I think you have to do: When you are both in good moods tell him you are going to take a separate car. He may be mad for a bit but make sure you do this and don’t back down. Try not to let it become a big fight. When you are with the family, be the model wife and DIL. Try to engage with MIL, she is the one calling the shots so try to get on her good side. Leave when you planned to leave but make a show of thanking everyone and telling them you had a good time. Do this every time and they will get used to it.

This is advice for surviving these family events. In my opinion, you should divorce because things will only get worse but I know you may not be ready for that yet.