Anonymous
05/20/2021 10:58
Subject: Re:Demi Lovato now they/them
Girls who do this are really making a commentary on female gender stereotypes. Not that much different from bra burning and power suits.
Yeah, but they do so in a way that reinforces and narrows what it means to be "female." It seems to have nothing to do with body dysmorphia or sexual orientation: it is more a way to reject the female stereotype for themselves without doing the hard work of challenging it.*
*Which I get, at 15 yrs old, is not an easy task...
Anonymous
05/20/2021 10:44
Subject: Re:Demi Lovato now they/them
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I’ll admit that I don’t understand being non-binary as a 41 yo cisgender woman. I do understand gender stereotypes and how women have been mistreated for centuries. I was honestly asking DH if I could call myself gender fluid or non-binary because I really like to wear pants or shorts and not tuck in my shirt. I also have several personality traits that are advantageous for men, but not for women. Do I just keep getting labelled aggressive or do I just regender myself?
I have a 10 yo daughter and whenever w ego to Target I remind her that when I was her age we didn’t have “boy” and “girl” Legos. You got one giant bucket of primary colors blocks and used your imagination. We did have some gendered toast like Kid Sister and the equivalent but not at all like it is today.
+1. I’d love to pretend this is all well and good to just let these kids live their lives, but as a “non-typical woman” I see how hurtful and harmful this can be to people like myself. That you have to be NB to be “more” than just a frivolous, dumb, passive, feminine little people pleaser who absolutely hates math and is just gaga over boys that treat her badly. No, kids. Men and women are special in all the forms we come in and should be respected as we are. That is going to lead us to a society free of stereotypes and discrimination, not people claiming carveouts from a place of ignorance.
It does seem like some of this may be stemming from the rigid gender stereotypes out there. Growing up as a girl in late 70s and 80s, I don't remember kids' clothes and toys being as "gendered" as they have been in the past few years. I only wore a dress once a year on easter sunday, but no one ever called me a boy or a tomboy or anything. Could be a reaction to this tiny box of what's considered "boy" and "girl" behavior/clothes/etc. Seems like it would be healthier to destroy that box rather than re-labeling people. Let's hope it's not all of the plastic/chemicals in our food finally catching up with us . . .
Anonymous
05/20/2021 10:35
Subject: Re:Demi Lovato now they/them
She is going to the store.
They is? are? Going to the store?
They is? are? Going to the store?
Anonymous
05/20/2021 10:34
Subject: Demi Lovato now they/them
Anonymous wrote:I’m all for self exploration and expression, but admit I give this recent trend a bit of side eye. I suppose your teens/twenties are all about figuring out you are (or aren’t in this case)....
This certainly seems like a new fad for Demi to cling to as she/they attempt to find meaning outside of addiction. Demi has so much talent and as they approach 30 hopefully this new reinvention helps them.
As for the explosion of middle school kids, specifically the girls I have seen, identifying this way, I bet 90% are back to being called she and her by the time HS ends. Fad taken way far.
My guess is for Demi that this has to do with sexuality not gender. Hopefully she can get comfortable with being a lesbian.
Anonymous
05/20/2021 10:33
Subject: Demi Lovato now they/them
They look like Patti Labelle
Anonymous
05/20/2021 10:31
Subject: Demi Lovato now they/them
Girls who do this are really making a commentary on female gender stereotypes. Not that much different from bra burning and power suits.
Anonymous
05/20/2021 10:20
Subject: Re:Demi Lovato now they/them
Anonymous wrote:I’ll admit that I don’t understand being non-binary as a 41 yo cisgender woman. I do understand gender stereotypes and how women have been mistreated for centuries. I was honestly asking DH if I could call myself gender fluid or non-binary because I really like to wear pants or shorts and not tuck in my shirt. I also have several personality traits that are advantageous for men, but not for women. Do I just keep getting labelled aggressive or do I just regender myself?
I have a 10 yo daughter and whenever w ego to Target I remind her that when I was her age we didn’t have “boy” and “girl” Legos. You got one giant bucket of primary colors blocks and used your imagination. We did have some gendered toast like Kid Sister and the equivalent but not at all like it is today.
I appreciate that you're just trying to be descriptive but please stop using this term. It is a gender epithet. You can call yourself a woman, a biological woman, but please stop using an epithet.
Anonymous
05/20/2021 09:38
Subject: Re:Demi Lovato now they/them
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This pronoun fad is going to deliver the White House to a conservative in a few years and it’s tragic. The wound will be totally self-inflicted. Call it attention-seeking or naval-gazing or what you will, but the trans/non-binary trend is turning a lot of social moderates away. Ask parents of middle schoolers how many girls they know who have become trans/non-binary. This is far from just natural variation in gender expression: it’s the hot new thing to do.
As a parent of a middle school girl I fully agree.
This is me. 100% agree with both PPs.
+1, mom of DS14 with plenty of friends who identify as NB instead of female.
agree
I agree it seems to really be this odd whirlpool of doing it for attention. I have one niece and one goddaughter who are both in middle school and want to use they and them as pronouns. Their parents comply, and are very hopeful it’s a phase. My daughter is three, and I sincerely hope in another 10 years things have changed so I don’t have to deal with this trend. I’d gladly take the goth trend I put my mother through when I was 12 over this ridiculousness any day.
NP here, and an "elder millennial" that has always felt I straddle the generational divide of Gen Xers (growing up in a pre-internet world) and Millennials.
I vividly remember "trying on identities" when I was a pre-teen/HSer as many people equate the NB movement to (attention seeking, exploratory, hopefully a phase) but why is NB worse than a goth identity? I really clung to the emo culture in HS and depression, self-harm, sadness etc were all glorified. Now as an adult, I see how harmful that identity was to my development and I am working to un-do it. So personally, if my child would rather experiment with more "positive" identity play with NB, body acceptance, radical self love .... that seems better to me than goth/emo.
Anonymous
05/20/2021 06:59
Subject: Demi Lovato now they/them
I’m all for self exploration and expression, but admit I give this recent trend a bit of side eye. I suppose your teens/twenties are all about figuring out you are (or aren’t in this case)....
This certainly seems like a new fad for Demi to cling to as she/they attempt to find meaning outside of addiction. Demi has so much talent and as they approach 30 hopefully this new reinvention helps them.
As for the explosion of middle school kids, specifically the girls I have seen, identifying this way, I bet 90% are back to being called she and her by the time HS ends. Fad taken way far.
This certainly seems like a new fad for Demi to cling to as she/they attempt to find meaning outside of addiction. Demi has so much talent and as they approach 30 hopefully this new reinvention helps them.
As for the explosion of middle school kids, specifically the girls I have seen, identifying this way, I bet 90% are back to being called she and her by the time HS ends. Fad taken way far.
Anonymous
05/20/2021 06:56
Subject: Re:Demi Lovato now they/them
Anonymous wrote:I’ll admit that I don’t understand being non-binary as a 41 yo cisgender woman. I do understand gender stereotypes and how women have been mistreated for centuries. I was honestly asking DH if I could call myself gender fluid or non-binary because I really like to wear pants or shorts and not tuck in my shirt. I also have several personality traits that are advantageous for men, but not for women. Do I just keep getting labelled aggressive or do I just regender myself?
I have a 10 yo daughter and whenever w ego to Target I remind her that when I was her age we didn’t have “boy” and “girl” Legos. You got one giant bucket of primary colors blocks and used your imagination. We did have some gendered toast like Kid Sister and the equivalent but not at all like it is today.
+1. I’d love to pretend this is all well and good to just let these kids live their lives, but as a “non-typical woman” I see how hurtful and harmful this can be to people like myself. That you have to be NB to be “more” than just a frivolous, dumb, passive, feminine little people pleaser who absolutely hates math and is just gaga over boys that treat her badly. No, kids. Men and women are special in all the forms we come in and should be respected as we are. That is going to lead us to a society free of stereotypes and discrimination, not people claiming carveouts from a place of ignorance.
Anonymous
05/20/2021 06:04
Subject: Re:Demi Lovato now they/them
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This pronoun fad is going to deliver the White House to a conservative in a few years and it’s tragic. The wound will be totally self-inflicted. Call it attention-seeking or naval-gazing or what you will, but the trans/non-binary trend is turning a lot of social moderates away. Ask parents of middle schoolers how many girls they know who have become trans/non-binary. This is far from just natural variation in gender expression: it’s the hot new thing to do.
As a parent of a middle school girl I fully agree.
This is me. 100% agree with both PPs.
+1, mom of DS14 with plenty of friends who identify as NB instead of female.
agree
I agree it seems to really be this odd whirlpool of doing it for attention. I have one niece and one goddaughter who are both in middle school and want to use they and them as pronouns. Their parents comply, and are very hopeful it’s a phase. My daughter is three, and I sincerely hope in another 10 years things have changed so I don’t have to deal with this trend. I’d gladly take the goth trend I put my mother through when I was 12 over this ridiculousness any day.
Anonymous
05/20/2021 05:28
Subject: Re:Demi Lovato now they/them
California sober is not sober.
Not even close.
By drinking less yet smoking weed she is not being realistic in bettering herself.
At all.
Not even close.
By drinking less yet smoking weed she is not being realistic in bettering herself.
At all.
Anonymous
05/20/2021 03:34
Subject: Demi Lovato now they/them
Anonymous wrote:I can't with this person. She (they?) is SO mentally unhealthy it's driving ME insane with how much she claims she's fine now.
The super short engagement, the chopping off of the hair, the "California sober" thing, this pronoun thing. Demi is trying to find something and trying all these different things to find it. This ain't it.
+1
Anonymous
05/19/2021 22:39
Subject: Demi Lovato now they/them
Anonymous wrote:Whatever you think, it's quite rude to keep misgendering her.
She misgendered herself.
Anonymous
05/19/2021 21:22
Subject: Re:Demi Lovato now they/them
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:This pronoun fad is going to deliver the White House to a conservative in a few years and it’s tragic. The wound will be totally self-inflicted. Call it attention-seeking or naval-gazing or what you will, but the trans/non-binary trend is turning a lot of social moderates away. Ask parents of middle schoolers how many girls they know who have become trans/non-binary. This is far from just natural variation in gender expression: it’s the hot new thing to do.
As a parent of a middle school girl I fully agree.
This is me. 100% agree with both PPs.
Yes and we are seeing this fad in our middle school too.