Anonymous wrote:We heard back from our elementary school. out of 300 students, 70 will return to in person instruction. To me this is confirmation of the fact that we teachers are doing a pretty good job with the distance teaching, and that our mostly minority or immigrant parents aren't comfortable with in person school just yet for their elementary kids.

Oh stop this. I would give my eye teeth for school to return to some semblance of normal.
We’re not going back because hybrid looks awful. In our district, the elementary kids will go in-person 2 days a week for ~2-3 hrs instruction. No recess, and you can leave your desk only for a restroom break. You can stay longer, but it’s essentially study hall. The remote kids get their instruction later in the day. It’s literally the worst possible plan & it will be hell on teachers. So yeah, we’ll stay home for now.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In person is the preferred means of delivering public education. The discussion is can the risk be mitigated sufficiently to allow in person learning to resume as safely as possible.

Absolutely not necessarily. Not for upper grades, for example. It might be that moving forward, students can have a choice of virtual or in person schooling and can change their choices every semester.

In person schooling has actually failed a lot of students, whom the school is unable to keep safe and unable to provide disruption free classes.

No you are wrong. It has been the preferred means for delivering education and lives have been structured around that. If you want to change that, that's fine. But until you do, and people have the ability to restructure their lives around DL, schools need to be open.

No. DL is happening because we are in a pandemic. People assumed that schools were legally required to provide them with childcare. They are not.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree, OP.

I hope schools discontinue remote learning options next year. It is a drain on school resources and limits their ability to serve the well being of everyone else. This semester should be the last of it.

Lucky for us, you are not making the decisions.

+1,000

SHUT UP SHUT UP SHUT UP

No one is saying it's better. No one is saying that because their child is doing okay that EVERY child should stay home. LITERALLY NO ONE IS SAYING THIS. Y'all are just making shit up. Or you're hearing something that nobody is saying.

JUST SHUT UP.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We heard back from our elementary school. out of 300 students, 70 will return to in person instruction. To me this is confirmation of the fact that we teachers are doing a pretty good job with the distance teaching, and that our mostly minority or immigrant parents aren't comfortable with in person school just yet for their elementary kids.

This means nothing for how well you are doing in distance learning. These decisions to stay home are the result of so many other issues aside from the quality of teaching. Frankly, I would not be surprised to find that the majority of these decisions were made completely independently of teacher quality.

We already have the DC data which show that our minority children are doing substantially worse, so don't go patting yourself on the back.

How tone-deaf. "They don't trust us, so we must be doing a great job!"

I’ll pay myself on the back, thank you very much.

Parents of kids in our school have been very supportive of the instruction their kids are getting this year. I have near perfect attendance from my students now ( not true in the fall... we had to work hard to get kids hooked up and into the routine, but we did it! We have amazing parents and teachers in my school, which is almost entirely minority and 80% FARMS.


And if 230 kids were coming back you know you’d interpret it in part as parents thought distance learning was awful and could not wait to get back to n person.

And the test results?

The school has a population where about 80% of the kids are on free/reduced meals. Our kids often score below grade level on standardized tests. They did three years ago, they did two years ago, they did last year and no surprise, with distance learning they also are working below grade level. But at about the same proportion as in past years.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree completely. Also, if your kid is awkward socially, avoiding people forever isn't the solution.

A child does not have to be "awkward socially" to be bullied or have some other reason to prefer not being around classmates. Lots of very normal kids feel unsafe or unwelcome at school.

That doesn't mean school should be closed. I'm fine with in-person being the default and it is certainly better for my child. But being online has solved problems for kids and I hope it continues to be an option.

If this is true, how will they go to college? Work? Have adult relationships (romantic or otherwise)? I think this has been a buffer for parents of 'weird' kids to feel like they get a breather, but it's not helping their kids in the long run.

Your premise seems to be that school helps these kids and that social discomfort is somehow "for their own good" because they'll learn from it. That's not typically true. School is just hell for them until they can get into the wider world (whether that is HS, college, or adulthood) and control who they associate with and under what conditions. Spending more time with bullies does not improve the situation for the bullied, and can cause long-term damage. Kids who have mobility issues that make the classroom environment painful, or who have various food or medication needs, may be more physically comfortable at home where they control the surrounds. Even taking your example of the merely "awkward" kid -- that kid might benefit from a social skills class, but is not going to just magically learn social skills from proximity to other children: that's a television fantasy.

When people talk about liking certain aspects of covid-era workarounds like remote school, they are identifying areas of the world that don't work for them, perhaps have never worked for them. It's reactionary and frankly cruel to demand a return to a "normal" that didn't work for so many people, when we have the tools to allow them to continue to participate comfortably.

Anonymous wrote:
oh, so because they weren't getting the best education, they should be able to accept an even worse one. got it.

Well, since they weren't getting a good education to begin with in school (because they were so disruptive and there weren't good supports for them), then Distance Learning really hasn't changed anything for them. But it did change things for the non-disruptive kids, who now get more of the teacher's time and energy and attention, since she doesn't have to deal with the constant disruption from the one or two kids who cause 95% of the problems.

Based on what our district is planning there won't be any socialization due to distancing guidelines. It will be like sitting on a half empty city bus. No one talking to anyone but the driver.

I don’t get it. Nobody asked me what was better for my child, schools are closed but NOT because it is better for my child.
If there is one thing we should have learned in this epidemic... it’s that nobody cares what’s best for us or our children!
If the in person learning they offer is horrible, I will keep the kid home. And I have no qualms about it, just like they have no qualms about keeping my child home for a year!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who want to keep their kids home aren’t seeing the forest through the trees.

Guess what? Your kid will become socially awkward if he/she continues to stay home. Kids need to learn and socialize. If you’re an ADULT WHO CHOOSES to work from home, that’s fine. But a child (including teens) needs to be around other children to learn not just their abcs and math, but also how to interact and continue to interact with others. Knowing how to interact is a huge part of work success.

Schools have an important social role in mixing children with other children who are not like them. Yes, there are schools where diversity is low along some dimension, but there is always some amount.

Relatedly, close ties with friends (who are often like you) are extremely valuable. But navigating weak ties (who are often different) is a more challenging and useful skill. Children who have been home during the pandemic have mostly only engaged with people with whom they have close ties. This is comfortable and easy for most of us. But it's the weak ties where kids need to work harder, and this is why even kids who are happy to be away from the "distracting kids" need to go back to school.

+1

-100

Social learning does not happen naturally, it needs to be taught and modeled. Just like throwing someone in the water won't teach them to swim, just mixing kids together won’t teach them social skills. Kids who need help with social skills usually are the first to “drown”. They need to be taught “in a shallow area of the pool”, being surrounded by the friendly peers and adults is a huge huge help.

Conflict resolution is skill that is also needs to be taught. Just like with everything else, some people are more talented in social domain than others and need less support.


I like this thread on bullying on Reddit. Read the first comment from the teacher. How many teachers like this do you know?

https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/lnd42g/teens_who_bully_harass_or_victimize_peers_are/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

...looks like that is a thing which can only happen in-person, in schools.

In person, but not necessarily in school. Some of you are unable to grasp that socializing and learning don’t have to happen concurrently.

While many children got traumatized by DL this year, as many if not more get traumatized by in-person school.

Many of the posts in this thread are ableist and ignorant.

I strongly dispute your claim that more children are being harmed by in-person school. And, no one is trying to rip your babies out of your arms. Go, live your socially isolated life. Just don't take public in-person school resources to do it.

Haha, my dispute is stronger than yours!

And why is your baby deserves the funding more than other people’s babies?

I don't have a child.

It shows.

I'm a teacher.

That’s sad.

you think it's sad that a teacher cares about children other than yours. got it. that's actually sad.

I am sad that as a teacher you can’t tell that a large number of kids are better served via DL, you have no idea about educational trauma and prevalence of bullying, and you demand that all public funds go to the in-person schooling. I am sad that you are ableist and ignorant. That’s the opposite of caring in my book.

And I don’t worship anyone, teachers included.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who want to keep their kids home aren’t seeing the forest through the trees.

Guess what? Your kid will become socially awkward if he/she continues to stay home. Kids need to learn and socialize. If you’re an ADULT WHO CHOOSES to work from home, that’s fine. But a child (including teens) needs to be around other children to learn not just their abcs and math, but also how to interact and continue to interact with others. Knowing how to interact is a huge part of work success.

Schools have an important social role in mixing children with other children who are not like them. Yes, there are schools where diversity is low along some dimension, but there is always some amount.

Relatedly, close ties with friends (who are often like you) are extremely valuable. But navigating weak ties (who are often different) is a more challenging and useful skill. Children who have been home during the pandemic have mostly only engaged with people with whom they have close ties. This is comfortable and easy for most of us. But it's the weak ties where kids need to work harder, and this is why even kids who are happy to be away from the "distracting kids" need to go back to school.

+1

-100

Social learning does not happen naturally, it needs to be taught and modeled. Just like throwing someone in the water won't teach them to swim, just mixing kids together won’t teach them social skills. Kids who need help with social skills usually are the first to “drown”. They need to be taught “in a shallow area of the pool”, being surrounded by the friendly peers and adults is a huge huge help.

Conflict resolution is skill that is also needs to be taught. Just like with everything else, some people are more talented in social domain than others and need less support.


I like this thread on bullying on Reddit. Read the first comment from the teacher. How many teachers like this do you know?

https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/lnd42g/teens_who_bully_harass_or_victimize_peers_are/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

...looks like that is a thing which can only happen in-person, in schools.

In person, but not necessarily in school. Some of you are unable to grasp that socializing and learning don’t have to happen concurrently.

While many children got traumatized by DL this year, as many if not more get traumatized by in-person school.

Many of the posts in this thread are ableist and ignorant.

I strongly dispute your claim that more children are being harmed by in-person school. And, no one is trying to rip your babies out of your arms. Go, live your socially isolated life. Just don't take public in-person school resources to do it.

Haha, my dispute is stronger than yours!

And why is your baby deserves the funding more than other people’s babies?

I don't have a child.

It shows.

I'm a teacher.

That’s sad.

you think it's sad that a teacher cares about children other than yours. got it. that's actually sad.

I'm not surprised. These kinds of people worship teachers until it turns out that sometimes doing it right means not all kids get the exact same treatment.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who want to keep their kids home aren’t seeing the forest through the trees.

Guess what? Your kid will become socially awkward if he/she continues to stay home. Kids need to learn and socialize. If you’re an ADULT WHO CHOOSES to work from home, that’s fine. But a child (including teens) needs to be around other children to learn not just their abcs and math, but also how to interact and continue to interact with others. Knowing how to interact is a huge part of work success.

Schools have an important social role in mixing children with other children who are not like them. Yes, there are schools where diversity is low along some dimension, but there is always some amount.

Relatedly, close ties with friends (who are often like you) are extremely valuable. But navigating weak ties (who are often different) is a more challenging and useful skill. Children who have been home during the pandemic have mostly only engaged with people with whom they have close ties. This is comfortable and easy for most of us. But it's the weak ties where kids need to work harder, and this is why even kids who are happy to be away from the "distracting kids" need to go back to school.

+1

-100

Social learning does not happen naturally, it needs to be taught and modeled. Just like throwing someone in the water won't teach them to swim, just mixing kids together won’t teach them social skills. Kids who need help with social skills usually are the first to “drown”. They need to be taught “in a shallow area of the pool”, being surrounded by the friendly peers and adults is a huge huge help.

Conflict resolution is skill that is also needs to be taught. Just like with everything else, some people are more talented in social domain than others and need less support.


I like this thread on bullying on Reddit. Read the first comment from the teacher. How many teachers like this do you know?

https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/lnd42g/teens_who_bully_harass_or_victimize_peers_are/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

...looks like that is a thing which can only happen in-person, in schools.

In person, but not necessarily in school. Some of you are unable to grasp that socializing and learning don’t have to happen concurrently.

While many children got traumatized by DL this year, as many if not more get traumatized by in-person school.

Many of the posts in this thread are ableist and ignorant.

I strongly dispute your claim that more children are being harmed by in-person school. And, no one is trying to rip your babies out of your arms. Go, live your socially isolated life. Just don't take public in-person school resources to do it.

Haha, my dispute is stronger than yours!

And why is your baby deserves the funding more than other people’s babies?

I don't have a child.

It shows.

I'm a teacher.

That’s sad.

you think it's sad that a teacher cares about children other than yours. got it. that's actually sad.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who want to keep their kids home aren’t seeing the forest through the trees.

Guess what? Your kid will become socially awkward if he/she continues to stay home. Kids need to learn and socialize. If you’re an ADULT WHO CHOOSES to work from home, that’s fine. But a child (including teens) needs to be around other children to learn not just their abcs and math, but also how to interact and continue to interact with others. Knowing how to interact is a huge part of work success.

Schools have an important social role in mixing children with other children who are not like them. Yes, there are schools where diversity is low along some dimension, but there is always some amount.

Relatedly, close ties with friends (who are often like you) are extremely valuable. But navigating weak ties (who are often different) is a more challenging and useful skill. Children who have been home during the pandemic have mostly only engaged with people with whom they have close ties. This is comfortable and easy for most of us. But it's the weak ties where kids need to work harder, and this is why even kids who are happy to be away from the "distracting kids" need to go back to school.

+1

-100

Social learning does not happen naturally, it needs to be taught and modeled. Just like throwing someone in the water won't teach them to swim, just mixing kids together won’t teach them social skills. Kids who need help with social skills usually are the first to “drown”. They need to be taught “in a shallow area of the pool”, being surrounded by the friendly peers and adults is a huge huge help.

Conflict resolution is skill that is also needs to be taught. Just like with everything else, some people are more talented in social domain than others and need less support.


I like this thread on bullying on Reddit. Read the first comment from the teacher. How many teachers like this do you know?

https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/lnd42g/teens_who_bully_harass_or_victimize_peers_are/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

...looks like that is a thing which can only happen in-person, in schools.

In person, but not necessarily in school. Some of you are unable to grasp that socializing and learning don’t have to happen concurrently.

While many children got traumatized by DL this year, as many if not more get traumatized by in-person school.

Many of the posts in this thread are ableist and ignorant.

I strongly dispute your claim that more children are being harmed by in-person school. And, no one is trying to rip your babies out of your arms. Go, live your socially isolated life. Just don't take public in-person school resources to do it.

Haha, my dispute is stronger than yours!

And why is your baby deserves the funding more than other people’s babies?

I don't have a child.

It shows.

I'm a teacher.

That’s sad.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who want to keep their kids home aren’t seeing the forest through the trees.

Guess what? Your kid will become socially awkward if he/she continues to stay home. Kids need to learn and socialize. If you’re an ADULT WHO CHOOSES to work from home, that’s fine. But a child (including teens) needs to be around other children to learn not just their abcs and math, but also how to interact and continue to interact with others. Knowing how to interact is a huge part of work success.

Schools have an important social role in mixing children with other children who are not like them. Yes, there are schools where diversity is low along some dimension, but there is always some amount.

Relatedly, close ties with friends (who are often like you) are extremely valuable. But navigating weak ties (who are often different) is a more challenging and useful skill. Children who have been home during the pandemic have mostly only engaged with people with whom they have close ties. This is comfortable and easy for most of us. But it's the weak ties where kids need to work harder, and this is why even kids who are happy to be away from the "distracting kids" need to go back to school.

+1

-100

Social learning does not happen naturally, it needs to be taught and modeled. Just like throwing someone in the water won't teach them to swim, just mixing kids together won’t teach them social skills. Kids who need help with social skills usually are the first to “drown”. They need to be taught “in a shallow area of the pool”, being surrounded by the friendly peers and adults is a huge huge help.

Conflict resolution is skill that is also needs to be taught. Just like with everything else, some people are more talented in social domain than others and need less support.


I like this thread on bullying on Reddit. Read the first comment from the teacher. How many teachers like this do you know?

https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/lnd42g/teens_who_bully_harass_or_victimize_peers_are/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

...looks like that is a thing which can only happen in-person, in schools.

In person, but not necessarily in school. Some of you are unable to grasp that socializing and learning don’t have to happen concurrently.

While many children got traumatized by DL this year, as many if not more get traumatized by in-person school.

Many of the posts in this thread are ableist and ignorant.

I strongly dispute your claim that more children are being harmed by in-person school. And, no one is trying to rip your babies out of your arms. Go, live your socially isolated life. Just don't take public in-person school resources to do it.

Haha, my dispute is stronger than yours!

And why is your baby deserves the funding more than other people’s babies?

I don't have a child.

It shows.

I'm a teacher.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's this undercurrent through a lot of threads here that the distracting kids don't truly belong, that they're a hassle for teachers, that they are a problem.

Their presence at school is just as legitimate as the presence of your quiet, obedient, academic child. I would argue that they need it even more.

I feel bad for those kids who are getting lost right now.

This. So many of these "disruptive" kids are acting out because they need more, whether that's attention, challenge, specialized instruction, in some cases even things as simple as safety and food. And DL allows schools to wash their hands of them. It is tragic.

This whole thing might just finally spur me to get my masters in social work so I can become a school counselor. I just feel like we need to be doing something for this generation of kids who will get lost in all this. I'm so worried for the kids at our school and in our neighborhood. And I'm most worried for the ones I never see any more.

I see teachers who cheerfully talk about how they no longer have to deal with the behavioral issues of the bad kids. Those kids are still having behavioral issues, but I guess you can just tune them out now. Those issues are still getting in the way of effective learning, and that's concerning.

I'm sure that someone will come along to argue that it's the parents' responsibility first. I won't dispute this. But some kids have crappy parents or parents who don't know how to deal with certain types of behavioral issues. And those kids deserve an effective education too.

Yeah but they didn’t not get an effective education when school is fully in person either. They just suck up a teachers time and energy. At least with different stance learning they don’t disrupt the education of the other students nearly as much.

If we had enough school counselors to deal with the very disruptive kids, that’s be so awesome. But it’s a pipe dream. School districts aren’t going to pay for that kind of support. Private schools don’t let most disruptive kids in or counsel them out quickly. Public schools have to take everyone. But they don’t have to have adequate staff to handle them

oh, so because they weren't getting the best education, they should be able to accept an even worse one. got it.

Yeah, it's been a whole thing through the pandemic. "Schools aren't perfect, therefore they shouldn't open!"