Anonymous
06/20/2019 23:28
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
For the rational poster who wants to move forward, rather than in circles...let me say that my child has done well at Juniata. She was tired of the mindset in this area. She is a strong, hard working student--who got into many other more highly ranked schools--but chose Juniata because of its sense of community. She has blossomed there, in terms of confidence and involvement. She is getting a great science education. The town is VERY small/limited. Kids should only go there if they are content with a campus-based social life. The surrounding area is woodsy and rural. They have a field station at a nearby lake, where students can spend a semester studying environmental science or wildlife biology. Merit offers are generous and tend to be honored for all four years.
Anonymous
06/20/2019 22:03
Subject: Re:“Colleges That Change Lives”
Anonymous
06/20/2019 21:59
Subject: Re:“Colleges That Change Lives”
I think we are all understand their are many LAC colleges to choose from, due to the "great" marketing of CTCL ( as many people have pointed out) people really would like to know if there Worth looking into.
It would be great if everyone could leave the bad attitude behind to give an opinion about the specific schools in the book. Not where they rank, not whether they're considered second-tier, or any other nasty thing you might feel compelled to say--none of it!
First-hand experiences would be tremendously appreciated
It would be great if everyone could leave the bad attitude behind to give an opinion about the specific schools in the book. Not where they rank, not whether they're considered second-tier, or any other nasty thing you might feel compelled to say--none of it!
First-hand experiences would be tremendously appreciated
Anonymous
06/20/2019 21:36
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:The only thing wrong with that theory is that he resisted sharing his list for years, until parents hounded him to make it public. So he hardly “packaged them to sell his book.” Sorry if the facts don’t match your assumption.
Most people who praise the CTCLs are basing their views on actual first hand experiences. The critics are working from biases and assumptions. That makes the former much more credible.
That's just sample bias. The folks that have bought into the CTCL gimmick hear what they want to hear. But it doesn't change the fact that there are hundreds of equally good LACs that could be a good fit for your child. But you do you......I really couldn't care less.
Hmmm, for some reason, perhaps that you’re commenting here, I kind of doubt this.
Anonymous
06/20/2019 21:08
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
Anonymous wrote:The only thing wrong with that theory is that he resisted sharing his list for years, until parents hounded him to make it public. So he hardly “packaged them to sell his book.” Sorry if the facts don’t match your assumption.
Most people who praise the CTCLs are basing their views on actual first hand experiences. The critics are working from biases and assumptions. That makes the former much more credible.
That's just sample bias. The folks that have bought into the CTCL gimmick hear what they want to hear. But it doesn't change the fact that there are hundreds of equally good LACs that could be a good fit for your child. But you do you......I really couldn't care less.
Anonymous
06/20/2019 20:12
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
The only thing wrong with that theory is that he resisted sharing his list for years, until parents hounded him to make it public. So he hardly “packaged them to sell his book.” Sorry if the facts don’t match your assumption.
Most people who praise the CTCLs are basing their views on actual first hand experiences. The critics are working from biases and assumptions. That makes the former much more credible.
Most people who praise the CTCLs are basing their views on actual first hand experiences. The critics are working from biases and assumptions. That makes the former much more credible.
Anonymous
06/20/2019 18:57
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Here is my issue with the CTCL organization: Its board is made up of mostly of reps from the schools it promotes. Its income consists of membership (marketing) fees from the schools it promotes. As a non-profit organization, its “services” consist of paying one person to go around the country and promote these schools. There is nothing amazingly different about most of these schools from the hundreds of other schools out there. Some are quite good but many are struggling financially and there are many with horrible graduation rates. Schools should be considered on an individual basis, not because they are part of an irrelevant list.
+1. CTCL feeds into the insecurity of parents whose kids can't get into Tier 1.
Another way to look at this: it lets people know there are more than 20 good colleges on the planet.
It's just a marketing gimmick now
All schools market themselves. Why hate on this small group? Their message is: We are great colleges that are easier to get into and possibly far less money, and we will still position your kid for success.
Because they're NOT a small group at all. They're separate institutions with nothing in common other than that they're all small schools and in the same book. That doesn't make them special.
I think the criticism of CTCL can be broken down into
1) those who criticize any school that is not in the top 20 (or probably any school other than the one they chose). I think the most vocal critic(s) in this thread falls into this category and are being really jerks about it.
2) those who don’t necessarily give a crap about a whether a school is in the top “tier” (or whatever people have been arguing about here) but are still annoyed at how much CTCL schools are mentioned on DCUM as a cure-all for any problem and how the CTCL organization constantly markets its member schools as so fabulous (when many of them are struggling with recruitment, finances, retention, and graduation rates) and so special (when there are so many other similar schools to choose from).
I think the bolded is the main complaint. The author some thirty years ago plucked these schools out of a field of hundreds that arguably had the same characteristics and packaged them to sell his book. They may be fine schools, but they are no better or worse than many others yet the uneducated suckers buy into the marketing and elevate these schools as somehow special or different. No horse in this race but that's my observation.
Anonymous
06/20/2019 18:04
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Here is my issue with the CTCL organization: Its board is made up of mostly of reps from the schools it promotes. Its income consists of membership (marketing) fees from the schools it promotes. As a non-profit organization, its “services” consist of paying one person to go around the country and promote these schools. There is nothing amazingly different about most of these schools from the hundreds of other schools out there. Some are quite good but many are struggling financially and there are many with horrible graduation rates. Schools should be considered on an individual basis, not because they are part of an irrelevant list.
+1. CTCL feeds into the insecurity of parents whose kids can't get into Tier 1.
Another way to look at this: it lets people know there are more than 20 good colleges on the planet.
It's just a marketing gimmick now
All schools market themselves. Why hate on this small group? Their message is: We are great colleges that are easier to get into and possibly far less money, and we will still position your kid for success.
Because they're NOT a small group at all. They're separate institutions with nothing in common other than that they're all small schools and in the same book. That doesn't make them special.
I think the criticism of CTCL can be broken down into
1) those who criticize any school that is not in the top 20 (or probably any school other than the one they chose). I think the most vocal critic(s) in this thread falls into this category and are being really jerks about it.
2) those who don’t necessarily give a crap about a whether a school is in the top “tier” (or whatever people have been arguing about here) but are still annoyed at how much CTCL schools are mentioned on DCUM as a cure-all for any problem and how the CTCL organization constantly markets its member schools as so fabulous (when many of them are struggling with recruitment, finances, retention, and graduation rates) and so special (when there are so many other similar schools to choose from).
Anonymous
06/20/2019 17:03
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
Lol
Anonymous
06/20/2019 16:45
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
Anonymous wrote:If UVA ever gets added to this list it will break DCUM.
It would actually have to change lives.
Anonymous
06/20/2019 15:36
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
Anonymous wrote:If UVA ever gets added to this list it will break DCUM.
Haha.
Anonymous
06/20/2019 14:52
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
UVA is far too good and selective to ever be added to the list.
Anonymous
06/20/2019 14:44
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
If UVA ever gets added to this list it will break DCUM.
Anonymous
06/20/2019 14:40
Subject: “Colleges That Change Lives”
Anonymous wrote:It’s interesting that you consider that article you just posted a link to to be positive. If Beloit is so great, why do so many kids not return for sophomore year?
Average retention rate for students at colleges in the US is 61%. Beloit's rate is just under 80%.
https://nces.ed.gov/programs/coe/indicator_ctr.asp
And, that's a good point for exploring all of the schools on the CTCL list. Some are definitely in financial trouble (Hampshire College is on the list and is in major trouble), some aren't. But, generally, the pool of students at these schools isn't the same as schools that perform the best on the metrics above PP references -- graduation and retention rates are higher at highly selective schools for many reasons besides just the fickleness of the student body.
It's weird how much the above poster is set on tearing down the CTCL concept. Although I wouldn't claim that the CTCL schools have a monopoly on being "good schools," or that they're right for everyone, I don't know why the concept is so triggering to people here!
Anonymous
06/20/2019 13:49
Subject: Re:“Colleges That Change Lives”
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote: Please stop. There are dozens of threads on this. The label is basically a well-thought-out marketing slogan for smaller schools.
if a school receives positive reviews of course they are going to use it for marketing. when did marketing become a pejorative ?
all school market themselves H/P,Y,, first-tier, second etc. who cares.
the OP want to know personal experiences with the listed school, not biased nasty retorts from people with no engagement with said institutions.
For the people or parents of children who went to "first-tier" schools that didn't need a broader view on available options, Great for you. And I mean that.
But for the others, who want viewpoints from people that actually attended those schools and genuinely wanting to know what their experience was like during and post, save sh*tty responses.
Clearly those responses are designed to make the poster feel better about themselves and to make the person asking the question feel bad. Why troll? Don't you have anything better to do?
if a school receives positive reviews of course they are going to use it for marketing. when did marketing become a pejorative ?
all school market themselves H/P,Y,, first-tier, second etc. who cares.
the OP want to know personal experiences with the listed school, not biased nasty retorts from people with no engagement with said institutions.
For the people or parents of children who went to "first-tier" schools that didn't need a broader view on available options, Great for you. And I mean that.
But for the others, who want viewpoints from people that actually attended those schools and genuinely wanting to know what their experience was like during and post, save sh*tty responses.
Clearly those responses are designed to make the poster feel better about themselves and to make the person asking the question feel bad. Why troll? Don't you have anything better to do?