Anonymous
08/02/2018 10:05
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OP, if you are a good man, you will not have a problem finding a mate once divorced.
OP here... I'm not scared of divorce... I just havn't decided I want one. I'm comfortable at home. I like waking up each morning to the kids being there. And we share finances and house chores well... just no intimacy in it, which is something I seem to desire and she does not. The question was (still is)... Does one continue to see a spouse who has given up on intimacy completely as a partner in this field, and should they (I actually) share feelings and information when I know they are not likely to lead to any progress in this area of the relationship?
1) That is the conversation you need to have with your wife. Come clean about your rather insensitive remark in the first bit of the conversation. Showing her your post may help.
2) Only you can decide what you can and cannot live with.
3) How old are your children?
See if she is willing to go to a couples weekend that helps couples re-establish intimacy.
You have to re-establish trust and other qualities. Re-establishing intimacy comes last.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 10:04
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:40+, male, and married for just over 20 years. The last 3-4 of which have been awful. Did couples counseling twice and she ended it both times. Been seeing a shrink myself for various related and non related issues.
I’ve purposely changed my schedule in the past 6 months, aiming to be out of the house more (I work part of the time from a home office), and make more social relations outside the marriage. I’ve also started doing more sports and going to the gym after a couple of years I’ve really neglected myself.
Thing is this… our sex life is dead. We’ve probably had sex 5 times in the past 3 years. Non in a year now. We are basically not intimate with each other and she shows little to no physical affection towards me.
Few days ago the she asked me if I was intimate with another women… and out of instinct I said: “it’s no longer your business”.
I’m not actually intimate with another women, but I’m definitely more open to it as this situation prolongs. We have 2 kids, and I would like to keep living under the same roof as them. Divorce would also be very hard on me financially. And truthfully, I still love my wife in many ways. However, I also think/feel that 43 is way to early to give up on any kind of physical relationship. Was I wrong to tell her it’s no longer her business as she’s made it clear she has no interest, or obligation, in sex with me?
you sound like an @$$.
seeing a shrink for various issues, failed attempts at couples counseling, failed attempts at connecting with your wife, avoiding your family and wife for sports/gym/more office time.
it is not clear to me what you do for the family or household or kids or wife.
If his wife has already checked out of the marriage (or worse, is actually having an affair), then no amount of couples counseling, attempting to connect, or "being around her" will work. You can't blame the man for trying and failing if he's got nothing to work with because she's done. He was never going to succeed no matter what he did. There's no point in telling him to "try harder" when her desire level for him is zero.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 10:03
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:So, OP if you’re home 20 hours a day, what does your wife’s day look like?
OP here... just to be clear... my job requires me to actually be present somewhere else two days a week, for about 4 hours each day. Other than that, I can (and usually have) chose to work from home which is what I've been doing ever since the kids were born. She, on the other hand, is less flexible. She's usually out by 7:30 am and back anytime from 6-9 pm... not that our work/home hours are the heart of the problem. People here just seem to have picked up on this issue... most of them for the wrong reason (thinking I wasn't home enough[i])
OP, being HOME isn’t the issue. Being present is.
What are you contributing to the house during those times? To the children? If you’re out the 4 hours a day when your wife actually needs help with the kids, then your being home 20 hours a day is moot, KWIM?
My DH has recently decided to start coming home during lunch, presumedly to “spend more time at home”. I WAH with a flexible job and watch toddler DD. His coming home just saddles me with making his lunch. I still end up making DDs lunch, my lunch, and cleaning up after everyone, plus his coming home means I don’t get to go to the park at that time, as I think it’s important for DD to see him. TBH, half the time he just surfs the internet. He’s probably patting himself on the back for being home more, but really, it’s a huge PITA. I’d rather he give her a bath or give me a break in the evenings to finish my work or to go spent 1/2 hour myself, but he’s usually too busy mowing or whatever else HE feels is important.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 10:03
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You’re doing everything you can do to work extra and not be home through outside social activities, but wonder why she won’t have sex with you?
THIS is actually classic DCUM. you’ve basically exited your marriage emotially, and it sounds physically, but you resent her for exiting it sexually.
This. While there is likely fault on both sides, it's straight-up hypocrisy to complain that your wife won't sleep with you, when you have made it clear that you don't like her, don't like spending time with her, and don't really want to be with her.
Him not liking her, don't like spending time with her, and not wanting to be with her is the symptom of her not sleeping with him, not the cause of it.
If she denies him sex, then naturally and inevitably his desire to give her his time and attention will diminish - eventually to nothing.
Well, I guess we don't know this, but OP can settle it for us pretty easily. OP - which happened first? Did your wife stop wanting to have sex with you first or did you start making yourself absent from the house more often first?
OP here. Not that it really matters who's to blame (and blame is usually the reason couples don't/can't solve problems...)... but to answer your question... the later came first. In fact, I still spend many more hours in the home and with family as compared with most people I know...
OP, you need to grow up. Marriage is not a contractual obligation for sex 3-5x a week. It's a commitment to form a family, to love, honor, and cherish in sickness and in health. You have young kids, it's pretty normal for a marital sex life to wane during those years due to stress, exhaustion, hormone changes. How a couple reacts to those stressors on a relationship are the indicator of long term success. If you became angry and resentful and distant from your wife, like she was trying to punish you by withholding sex, rather than trying to regain non-sexual intimacy and hope that the physical intimacy would return, then you have made your own bed. For women, sex is often more about the emotional than the physical. If you don't have an emotional connection you won't have a physical connection. If you're not interested in reconnecting on any level, then be a man and tell her. If you're done, you're done, and you owe it to both of you to admit that rather than live in some limbo because it's more convenient. If you're not done, then you need to make some serious changes in order to turn it around. But after what you said, it's entirely possible that it's too late.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 10:03
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
I would cease counseling with a partner who was just an empty suit there as well.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 10:02
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You’re doing everything you can do to work extra and not be home through outside social activities, but wonder why she won’t have sex with you?
THIS is actually classic DCUM. you’ve basically exited your marriage emotially, and it sounds physically, but you resent her for exiting it sexually.
This. While there is likely fault on both sides, it's straight-up hypocrisy to complain that your wife won't sleep with you, when you have made it clear that you don't like her, don't like spending time with her, and don't really want to be with her.
Him not liking her, don't like spending time with her, and not wanting to be with her is the symptom of her not sleeping with him, not the cause of it.
If she denies him sex, then naturally and inevitably his desire to give her his time and attention will diminish - eventually to nothing.
Well, I guess we don't know this, but OP can settle it for us pretty easily. OP - which happened first? Did your wife stop wanting to have sex with you first or did you start making yourself absent from the house more often first?
OP here. Not that it really matters who's to blame (and blame is usually the reason couples don't/can't solve problems...)... but to answer your question... the later came first. In fact, I still spend many more hours in the home and with family as compared with most people I know...
Who cares about "versus everyone else you happen to know".
There are shitty role models everywhere and very good husband and father and Man of the House role models out there. Make sure you know the difference. And no, more hours home watching TV on the couch while your wife sorts out the house, bills, kids homework, school stuff, vacation plans is not fooling anyone.
You've obviously reached your opinion without reading anything he wrote...
Anonymous
08/02/2018 10:02
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:40+, male, and married for just over 20 years. The last 3-4 of which have been awful. Did couples counseling twice and she ended it both times. Been seeing a shrink myself for various related and non related issues.
I’ve purposely changed my schedule in the past 6 months, aiming to be out of the house more (I work part of the time from a home office), and make more social relations outside the marriage. I’ve also started doing more sports and going to the gym after a couple of years I’ve really neglected myself.
Thing is this… our sex life is dead. We’ve probably had sex 5 times in the past 3 years. Non in a year now. We are basically not intimate with each other and she shows little to no physical affection towards me.
Few days ago the she asked me if I was intimate with another women… and out of instinct I said: “it’s no longer your business”.
I’m not actually intimate with another women, but I’m definitely more open to it as this situation prolongs. We have 2 kids, and I would like to keep living under the same roof as them. Divorce would also be very hard on me financially. And truthfully, I still love my wife in many ways. However, I also think/feel that 43 is way to early to give up on any kind of physical relationship. Was I wrong to tell her it’s no longer her business as she’s made it clear she has no interest, or obligation, in sex with me?
you sound like an @$$.
seeing a shrink for various issues, failed attempts at couples counseling, failed attempts at connecting with your wife, avoiding your family and wife for sports/gym/more office time.
OP here... I've actually "answered" all your claims in previous comments... and most your claims must be coming from your life experience (not my life)... so I'll just mention (again) that there's nothing wrong and no shame to going to therapy (a shrink). You have to be pretty primitive (in 2018) to think otherwise...
it is not clear to me what you do for the family or household or kids or wife.
Counseling is not a check-the-box thing.
You go the shrink to get an action plan to improve your relationship, THEN YOU ENACT THE PLAN EACH AND EVERY MOMENT.
Just showing up won't get you anything except $200 poorer. No pat on the back for simply showing up, you need to put the effort in to the improvement plan.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 10:00
Subject: Re:Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Nah, you don't get it. You are reacting to her cutting off of sex. You have no agency in this deal. She gets everything she wants. Even having to secure a married AP will be work for you. If it were even, make her find you a substitute for her wifely duties.
Nope. If he sits there and takes it, he has no agency. If he cheats or files for divorce, he has agency.
If he does nothing, she gets everything she wants. She is obviously very comfortable in the sexless marriage, as so many women are.
who wants to have sex with a slob? i cannot tell you how unattractive unorganized, messy, ignorant, drop-the-ball spouses are to get in the mood for!
Anonymous
08/02/2018 09:59
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:40+, male, and married for just over 20 years. The last 3-4 of which have been awful. Did couples counseling twice and she ended it both times. Been seeing a shrink myself for various related and non related issues.
I’ve purposely changed my schedule in the past 6 months, aiming to be out of the house more (I work part of the time from a home office), and make more social relations outside the marriage. I’ve also started doing more sports and going to the gym after a couple of years I’ve really neglected myself.
Thing is this… our sex life is dead. We’ve probably had sex 5 times in the past 3 years. Non in a year now. We are basically not intimate with each other and she shows little to no physical affection towards me.
Few days ago the she asked me if I was intimate with another women… and out of instinct I said: “it’s no longer your business”.
I’m not actually intimate with another women, but I’m definitely more open to it as this situation prolongs. We have 2 kids, and I would like to keep living under the same roof as them. Divorce would also be very hard on me financially. And truthfully, I still love my wife in many ways. However, I also think/feel that 43 is way to early to give up on any kind of physical relationship. Was I wrong to tell her it’s no longer her business as she’s made it clear she has no interest, or obligation, in sex with me?
you sound like an @$$.
seeing a shrink for various issues, failed attempts at couples counseling, failed attempts at connecting with your wife, avoiding your family and wife for sports/gym/more office time.
OP here... I've actually "answered" all your claims in previous comments... and most your claims must be coming from your life experience (not my life)... so I'll just mention (again) that there's nothing wrong and no shame to going to therapy (a shrink). You have to be pretty primitive (in 2018) to think otherwise...
it is not clear to me what you do for the family or household or kids or wife.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 09:58
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You’re doing everything you can do to work extra and not be home through outside social activities, but wonder why she won’t have sex with you?
THIS is actually classic DCUM. you’ve basically exited your marriage emotially, and it sounds physically, but you resent her for exiting it sexually.
This. While there is likely fault on both sides, it's straight-up hypocrisy to complain that your wife won't sleep with you, when you have made it clear that you don't like her, don't like spending time with her, and don't really want to be with her.
Him not liking her, don't like spending time with her, and not wanting to be with her is the symptom of her not sleeping with him, not the cause of it.
If she denies him sex, then naturally and inevitably his desire to give her his time and attention will diminish - eventually to nothing.
Well, I guess we don't know this, but OP can settle it for us pretty easily. OP - which happened first? Did your wife stop wanting to have sex with you first or did you start making yourself absent from the house more often first?
OP here. Not that it really matters who's to blame (and blame is usually the reason couples don't/can't solve problems...)... but to answer your question... the later came first. In fact, I still spend many more hours in the home and with family as compared with most people I know...
Who cares about "versus everyone else you happen to know".
There are shitty role models everywhere and very good husband and father and Man of the House role models out there. Make sure you know the difference. And no, more hours home watching TV on the couch while your wife sorts out the house, bills, kids homework, school stuff, vacation plans is not fooling anyone.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 09:56
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Have you discussed the possibility of an open marriage?
They already *have* an open marriage, he just has not yet acted on it.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 09:54
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:So, OP if you’re home 20 hours a day, what does your wife’s day look like?
OP here... just to be clear... my job requires me to actually be present somewhere else two days a week, for about 4 hours each day. Other than that, I can (and usually have) chose to work from home which is what I've been doing ever since the kids were born. She, on the other hand, is less flexible. She's usually out by 7:30 am and back anytime from 6-9 pm... not that our work/home hours are the heart of the problem. People here just seem to have picked up on this issue... most of them for the wrong reason (thinking I wasn't home enough)
Anonymous
08/02/2018 09:54
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:40+, male, and married for just over 20 years. The last 3-4 of which have been awful. Did couples counseling twice and she ended it both times. Been seeing a shrink myself for various related and non related issues.
I’ve purposely changed my schedule in the past 6 months, aiming to be out of the house more (I work part of the time from a home office), and make more social relations outside the marriage. I’ve also started doing more sports and going to the gym after a couple of years I’ve really neglected myself.
Thing is this… our sex life is dead. We’ve probably had sex 5 times in the past 3 years. Non in a year now. We are basically not intimate with each other and she shows little to no physical affection towards me.
Few days ago the she asked me if I was intimate with another women… and out of instinct I said: “it’s no longer your business”.
I’m not actually intimate with another women, but I’m definitely more open to it as this situation prolongs. We have 2 kids, and I would like to keep living under the same roof as them. Divorce would also be very hard on me financially. And truthfully, I still love my wife in many ways. However, I also think/feel that 43 is way to early to give up on any kind of physical relationship. Was I wrong to tell her it’s no longer her business as she’s made it clear she has no interest, or obligation, in sex with me?
you sound like an @$$.
seeing a shrink for various issues, failed attempts at couples counseling, failed attempts at connecting with your wife, avoiding your family and wife for sports/gym/more office time.
it is not clear to me what you do for the family or household or kids or wife.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 09:54
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:I was in the same situation. With some time and a lot of effort, things have improved. Marriages often go through phases. I guess the key question is what she really feels for you. If there is a bedrock of love under it all you can still make it work. If there is not, then you have a choice between a sexless marriage where you tolerate each other, or a divorce.
That's not actually a valid option for a man. The choice is divorce or open marriage.
Anonymous
08/02/2018 09:44
Subject: Told the wife she has no right to demand an answer...
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You’re doing everything you can do to work extra and not be home through outside social activities, but wonder why she won’t have sex with you?
THIS is actually classic DCUM. you’ve basically exited your marriage emotially, and it sounds physically, but you resent her for exiting it sexually.
This. While there is likely fault on both sides, it's straight-up hypocrisy to complain that your wife won't sleep with you, when you have made it clear that you don't like her, don't like spending time with her, and don't really want to be with her.
Him not liking her, don't like spending time with her, and not wanting to be with her is the symptom of her not sleeping with him, not the cause of it.
If she denies him sex, then naturally and inevitably his desire to give her his time and attention will diminish - eventually to nothing.
Well, I guess we don't know this, but OP can settle it for us pretty easily. OP - which happened first? Did your wife stop wanting to have sex with you first or did you start making yourself absent from the house more often first?
OP here. Not that it really matters who's to blame (and blame is usually the reason couples don't/can't solve problems...)... but to answer your question... the later came first. In fact, I still spend many more hours in the home and with family as compared with most people I know...