Anyone with any insight on Maryland Rush Montgomery? How do they stack up in terms of training and cost with BSC and Potomac?

Anonymous wrote:Just to get this topic back on point . . .

http://www.bethesdasoccer.org/Default.aspx?tabid=274486

Did not know they were in Va.

Just to get this topic back on point . . .

http://www.bethesdasoccer.org/Default.aspx?tabid=274486

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

CCL Guy resurfaces. So ez to spot his posts. CCL top teams do not play kickball, but the league sucks ass. Might as well travel to Florida at U11 and say, hey, find a new team, it is your choice! Thank you CCL Guy. Teams should leave this league just like BRYC and Md. U did.

I don't get this comment. Isn't one of the gripes about CCL all the long distance travel? Wouldn't BRYC in the ECNL be even worse??

The CCL gripe is all the long distance travel to play weak teams. ECNL will not be weak teams.

Fair enough

NP here. Also new to all of this. U10 DD is currently doing MSI Classic, but as PPs have stated, the quality varies and unfortunately we're on one of the "you get what you pay for" teams completely lacking in player development. Thinking about trying out for one of the clubs and would love any thoughts comparing Bethesda Soccer, Potomac Soccer, and PPA. Would PPA be convenient for someone living in the North Potomac/Gaithersburg area? One of the things that Classic does have going for it is the chance to really build a relationship with the teammates and coach. I'm a little afraid of what I've read on here about Bethesda and getting lost in the shuffle. Is it similar at Potomac? Any other nearby clubs I should be considering? Would really prefer not to go too far (like over 30 mins) for practices at this age. Thanks!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

CCL Guy resurfaces. So ez to spot his posts. CCL top teams do not play kickball, but the league sucks ass. Might as well travel to Florida at U11 and say, hey, find a new team, it is your choice! Thank you CCL Guy. Teams should leave this league just like BRYC and Md. U did.

I don't get this comment. Isn't one of the gripes about CCL all the long distance travel? Wouldn't BRYC in the ECNL be even worse??

The CCL gripe is all the long distance travel to play weak teams. ECNL will not be weak teams.

Correct.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

CCL Guy resurfaces. So ez to spot his posts. CCL top teams do not play kickball, but the league sucks ass. Might as well travel to Florida at U11 and say, hey, find a new team, it is your choice! Thank you CCL Guy. Teams should leave this league just like BRYC and Md. U did.

I don't get this comment. Isn't one of the gripes about CCL all the long distance travel? Wouldn't BRYC in the ECNL be even worse??

The CCL gripe is all the long distance travel to play weak teams. ECNL will not be weak teams.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, the SYC 2006 top boys team is incredible..beats EDP and CCL teams in tournaments.

Many teams beat CCL and EDP teams in tournaments---especially the MD teams. WTH is in the water in MD?

The CCL teams all stick together and do each others tournaments anyways. They'll often throw each other some of their many teams in an age group to fill out brackets. They generally play the same teams over and over again. Then get shocked when they step outside the CCL bubble.

This is not accurate. Are there teams in ccl that are terrible ? of course there are. But several of the best clubs in ccl dominate state cup. The only teams getting shocked in state cup are NON CCL.

None of this says anything about your child's skill or personal development. The CCL teams play American soccer.

Most knowledgeable soccer parents tend towards a different type of development for their children. Personalized, skill and possession-based. They don't buy into the big club mantra. These kids are light-years beyond 'state cup' play which used to be the goal in the 1980s, 90s. Not anymore.

This is not true for all. My kid played against some of the NOVA CCL teams and they played possession style soccer. There was no kick and chase going on.

Just about every ccl team my kids under U-12 have played just have the goalie do the long punt it out of the back every.single.time. This shouldn't even be allowed in the younger years. It just results in the type of soccer where you send the biggest kid down the middle. They are learning absolutely nothing about the sport or play doing this. It's a detriment to their development--especially as physical attributes even out down the road. Watch champions league and see how often that is done in real play. LMVSC is one of the few that don't do this.

Obviously has not been to any recent CCL matches . . . . totally false.

+100

CCL teams vary greatly depending on gender, age and club, but for the most part, they are quality teams. I've had kids play WAGS, NCSL, ODSL and CCL...the CCL teams were definitely better quality, in terms of both coaching and players. (Of course I'm sure some hyped up ECNL and/or DA person will have a comment here, but not everyone is up for that environment).

If you are looking at teams for U9-U12, then stay close to home if you can...it's not worth a long drive just to play on what someone else perceives to be the "best in the area". The most important thing to look for is a coach who will be able to develop your player - whatever the skill level. Once you know what type of player you have (at U11-13), then you can start deciding if they need to be moved to a different team.

CCL Guy resurfaces. So ez to spot his posts. CCL top teams do not play kickball, but the league sucks ass. Might as well travel to Florida at U11 and say, hey, find a new team, it is your choice! Thank you CCL Guy. Teams should leave this league just like BRYC and Md. U did.

I don't get this comment. Isn't one of the gripes about CCL all the long distance travel? Wouldn't BRYC in the ECNL be even worse??

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, the SYC 2006 top boys team is incredible..beats EDP and CCL teams in tournaments.

Many teams beat CCL and EDP teams in tournaments---especially the MD teams. WTH is in the water in MD?

The CCL teams all stick together and do each others tournaments anyways. They'll often throw each other some of their many teams in an age group to fill out brackets. They generally play the same teams over and over again. Then get shocked when they step outside the CCL bubble.

This is not accurate. Are there teams in ccl that are terrible ? of course there are. But several of the best clubs in ccl dominate state cup. The only teams getting shocked in state cup are NON CCL.

None of this says anything about your child's skill or personal development. The CCL teams play American soccer.

Most knowledgeable soccer parents tend towards a different type of development for their children. Personalized, skill and possession-based. They don't buy into the big club mantra. These kids are light-years beyond 'state cup' play which used to be the goal in the 1980s, 90s. Not anymore.

This is not true for all. My kid played against some of the NOVA CCL teams and they played possession style soccer. There was no kick and chase going on.

Just about every ccl team my kids under U-12 have played just have the goalie do the long punt it out of the back every.single.time. This shouldn't even be allowed in the younger years. It just results in the type of soccer where you send the biggest kid down the middle. They are learning absolutely nothing about the sport or play doing this. It's a detriment to their development--especially as physical attributes even out down the road. Watch champions league and see how often that is done in real play. LMVSC is one of the few that don't do this.

Obviously has not been to any recent CCL matches . . . . totally false.

+100

CCL teams vary greatly depending on gender, age and club, but for the most part, they are quality teams. I've had kids play WAGS, NCSL, ODSL and CCL...the CCL teams were definitely better quality, in terms of both coaching and players. (Of course I'm sure some hyped up ECNL and/or DA person will have a comment here, but not everyone is up for that environment).

If you are looking at teams for U9-U12, then stay close to home if you can...it's not worth a long drive just to play on what someone else perceives to be the "best in the area". The most important thing to look for is a coach who will be able to develop your player - whatever the skill level. Once you know what type of player you have (at U11-13), then you can start deciding if they need to be moved to a different team.

CCL Guy resurfaces. So ez to spot his posts. CCL top teams do not play kickball, but the league sucks ass. Might as well travel to Florida at U11 and say, hey, find a new team, it is your choice! Thank you CCL Guy. Teams should leave this league just like BRYC and Md. U did.

Nope, wrong. That post wasn't mine. The world is full of people with their own opinions.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, the SYC 2006 top boys team is incredible..beats EDP and CCL teams in tournaments.

Many teams beat CCL and EDP teams in tournaments---especially the MD teams. WTH is in the water in MD?

The CCL teams all stick together and do each others tournaments anyways. They'll often throw each other some of their many teams in an age group to fill out brackets. They generally play the same teams over and over again. Then get shocked when they step outside the CCL bubble.

This is not accurate. Are there teams in ccl that are terrible ? of course there are. But several of the best clubs in ccl dominate state cup. The only teams getting shocked in state cup are NON CCL.

None of this says anything about your child's skill or personal development. The CCL teams play American soccer.

Most knowledgeable soccer parents tend towards a different type of development for their children. Personalized, skill and possession-based. They don't buy into the big club mantra. These kids are light-years beyond 'state cup' play which used to be the goal in the 1980s, 90s. Not anymore.

This is not true for all. My kid played against some of the NOVA CCL teams and they played possession style soccer. There was no kick and chase going on.

Just about every ccl team my kids under U-12 have played just have the goalie do the long punt it out of the back every.single.time. This shouldn't even be allowed in the younger years. It just results in the type of soccer where you send the biggest kid down the middle. They are learning absolutely nothing about the sport or play doing this. It's a detriment to their development--especially as physical attributes even out down the road. Watch champions league and see how often that is done in real play. LMVSC is one of the few that don't do this.

Obviously has not been to any recent CCL matches . . . . totally false.

+100

CCL teams vary greatly depending on gender, age and club, but for the most part, they are quality teams. I've had kids play WAGS, NCSL, ODSL and CCL...the CCL teams were definitely better quality, in terms of both coaching and players. (Of course I'm sure some hyped up ECNL and/or DA person will have a comment here, but not everyone is up for that environment).

If you are looking at teams for U9-U12, then stay close to home if you can...it's not worth a long drive just to play on what someone else perceives to be the "best in the area". The most important thing to look for is a coach who will be able to develop your player - whatever the skill level. Once you know what type of player you have (at U11-13), then you can start deciding if they need to be moved to a different team.

CCL Guy resurfaces. So ez to spot his posts. CCL top teams do not play kickball, but the league sucks ass. Might as well travel to Florida at U11 and say, hey, find a new team, it is your choice! Thank you CCL Guy. Teams should leave this league just like BRYC and Md. U did.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here - looking for thoughts on Bethesda Soccer vs. PPA vs. MSI Classic for a U9/U10 girl with reasonably good skills and a lot of passion for the game?

Has your DD had any formal coaching?

Bethesda has the best program and training, then PPA. MSI Classic is only loosely organized by MSI - you have to pass a not very hard skills test to be eligible for a Classic team. But then you have to either form your own classic team or try individually for other teams. The process for getting on a classic team is a major PIA because it is not coordinated. Classic teams find their own coach - either a parent or a paid coach that the team hires. So the coaching can be very, very good or not so good. It just depends. Same for cost of classic - if you have a parent volunteer coach, cost will be pretty low (but you often get what you pay for). The level of play on classic teams also varies widely - is it mostly friends or a former rec team that wants to stay together or is it team formed through talent? If you go the classic route, you should interview whoever is running each of the teams you try out for to understand its individual approach.

Agree with all of this. You nailed the description of MSI Classic!

Agree on all of this, too . Bethesda has very good training. Possible "downsides" at young age are 1). the logistics - practice locations can be tough and distance for games are far even for 'home' field in poolesville. I think PPA makes it much easier and classics tend to be more neighborhood basis . 2) The other part in Bethesda is that some parents can get anxious or competitive between on who is on the higher level teams (though far less than VA clubs) Those do not become issues for all parents - but just helpful to know before you commit

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, the SYC 2006 top boys team is incredible..beats EDP and CCL teams in tournaments.

Many teams beat CCL and EDP teams in tournaments---especially the MD teams. WTH is in the water in MD?

The CCL teams all stick together and do each others tournaments anyways. They'll often throw each other some of their many teams in an age group to fill out brackets. They generally play the same teams over and over again. Then get shocked when they step outside the CCL bubble.

This is not accurate. Are there teams in ccl that are terrible ? of course there are. But several of the best clubs in ccl dominate state cup. The only teams getting shocked in state cup are NON CCL.

None of this says anything about your child's skill or personal development. The CCL teams play American soccer.

Most knowledgeable soccer parents tend towards a different type of development for their children. Personalized, skill and possession-based. They don't buy into the big club mantra. These kids are light-years beyond 'state cup' play which used to be the goal in the 1980s, 90s. Not anymore.

This is not true for all. My kid played against some of the NOVA CCL teams and they played possession style soccer. There was no kick and chase going on.

Just about every ccl team my kids under U-12 have played just have the goalie do the long punt it out of the back every.single.time. This shouldn't even be allowed in the younger years. It just results in the type of soccer where you send the biggest kid down the middle. They are learning absolutely nothing about the sport or play doing this. It's a detriment to their development--especially as physical attributes even out down the road. Watch champions league and see how often that is done in real play. LMVSC is one of the few that don't do this.

Obviously has not been to any recent CCL matches . . . . totally false.

+100

CCL teams vary greatly depending on gender, age and club, but for the most part, they are quality teams. I've had kids play WAGS, NCSL, ODSL and CCL...the CCL teams were definitely better quality, in terms of both coaching and players. (Of course I'm sure some hyped up ECNL and/or DA person will have a comment here, but not everyone is up for that environment).

If you are looking at teams for U9-U12, then stay close to home if you can...it's not worth a long drive just to play on what someone else perceives to be the "best in the area". The most important thing to look for is a coach who will be able to develop your player - whatever the skill level. Once you know what type of player you have (at U11-13), then you can start deciding if they need to be moved to a different team.

I completely agree with this. You are going to find the training and personal attention and development may be better where you are anyways. Some clubs have a much heavier investment in the U7-u11s to build for the future vs. focusing on the upper teams for tournament and state cup wins to draw players from other teams.

I do disagree with your point about CCL though. I haven't found this to be the case with my kids, re. ccl quality. In fact, my kids team will blow every single team out in regular season CCL and that get crushed in tournaments (not sponsored by CCL) by teams in other leagues. Parents have been asking the coaches for more challenge during the regular season. Since there is no relegation you have teams at very different levels. From what I understand, you can't play a team in an upper age group like some of the other leagues allow as well. We counted on only 1 or 2 competitive games only per regular season and then getting our ass handed to us when we went to the MD or other away tournaments.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, the SYC 2006 top boys team is incredible..beats EDP and CCL teams in tournaments.

Many teams beat CCL and EDP teams in tournaments---especially the MD teams. WTH is in the water in MD?

The CCL teams all stick together and do each others tournaments anyways. They'll often throw each other some of their many teams in an age group to fill out brackets. They generally play the same teams over and over again. Then get shocked when they step outside the CCL bubble.

This is not accurate. Are there teams in ccl that are terrible ? of course there are. But several of the best clubs in ccl dominate state cup. The only teams getting shocked in state cup are NON CCL.

None of this says anything about your child's skill or personal development. The CCL teams play American soccer.

Most knowledgeable soccer parents tend towards a different type of development for their children. Personalized, skill and possession-based. They don't buy into the big club mantra. These kids are light-years beyond 'state cup' play which used to be the goal in the 1980s, 90s. Not anymore.

This is not true for all. My kid played against some of the NOVA CCL teams and they played possession style soccer. There was no kick and chase going on.

Just about every ccl team my kids under U-12 have played just have the goalie do the long punt it out of the back every.single.time. This shouldn't even be allowed in the younger years. It just results in the type of soccer where you send the biggest kid down the middle. They are learning absolutely nothing about the sport or play doing this. It's a detriment to their development--especially as physical attributes even out down the road. Watch champions league and see how often that is done in real play. LMVSC is one of the few that don't do this.

Obviously has not been to any recent CCL matches . . . . totally false.

+100

CCL teams vary greatly depending on gender, age and club, but for the most part, they are quality teams. I've had kids play WAGS, NCSL, ODSL and CCL...the CCL teams were definitely better quality, in terms of both coaching and players. (Of course I'm sure some hyped up ECNL and/or DA person will have a comment here, but not everyone is up for that environment).

If you are looking at teams for U9-U12, then stay close to home if you can...it's not worth a long drive just to play on what someone else perceives to be the "best in the area". The most important thing to look for is a coach who will be able to develop your player - whatever the skill level. Once you know what type of player you have (at U11-13), then you can start deciding if they need to be moved to a different team.

For the younger years what makes the CCL teams better? Anyone player can join these clubs and the costs are roughly the same for travel. ..right?

Oh, here we go again.

It isnt the league, its the quality of a few teams in the league. To make a A team in Loudoun or Arlington with their player pools puts your kid on a team with good players and some proven coaches. That is all. The league isn't magic. But the league has some quality clubs that have some quality teams. But at U9 and U10 you are dealing with little kids and scores get pretty crazy and that is true for any league.

With a very American-style of play. The problem with these two clubs in they use that player pool to seed the field with large kids. I've seen kids have a huge growth spurt---and now all the sudden player is very attractive to the upper team coach when they couldn't give a crap before and their skill level of play is exactly the same level as before--just now with size. It is not unheard of for players to turn down top spots at these clubs to go develop elsewhere. Not everyone thinks it is the holy grail to play for these Clubs. But--they do have huge player pools that most clubs do not have. I'll give you that.

With respect to the long ball crap that pp mentioned---I've seen the same style of play even in Futsal where it is the last place you should be launching balls in the air. It was cringe-worthy.

I asked the CCL question above. Noob soccer parent therefore just trying to distinguish the differences. Great feedback from everyone

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, the SYC 2006 top boys team is incredible..beats EDP and CCL teams in tournaments.

Many teams beat CCL and EDP teams in tournaments---especially the MD teams. WTH is in the water in MD?

The CCL teams all stick together and do each others tournaments anyways. They'll often throw each other some of their many teams in an age group to fill out brackets. They generally play the same teams over and over again. Then get shocked when they step outside the CCL bubble.

This is not accurate. Are there teams in ccl that are terrible ? of course there are. But several of the best clubs in ccl dominate state cup. The only teams getting shocked in state cup are NON CCL.

None of this says anything about your child's skill or personal development. The CCL teams play American soccer.

Most knowledgeable soccer parents tend towards a different type of development for their children. Personalized, skill and possession-based. They don't buy into the big club mantra. These kids are light-years beyond 'state cup' play which used to be the goal in the 1980s, 90s. Not anymore.

This is not true for all. My kid played against some of the NOVA CCL teams and they played possession style soccer. There was no kick and chase going on.

Just about every ccl team my kids under U-12 have played just have the goalie do the long punt it out of the back every.single.time. This shouldn't even be allowed in the younger years. It just results in the type of soccer where you send the biggest kid down the middle. They are learning absolutely nothing about the sport or play doing this. It's a detriment to their development--especially as physical attributes even out down the road. Watch champions league and see how often that is done in real play. LMVSC is one of the few that don't do this.

Obviously has not been to any recent CCL matches . . . . totally false.

+100

CCL teams vary greatly depending on gender, age and club, but for the most part, they are quality teams. I've had kids play WAGS, NCSL, ODSL and CCL...the CCL teams were definitely better quality, in terms of both coaching and players. (Of course I'm sure some hyped up ECNL and/or DA person will have a comment here, but not everyone is up for that environment).

If you are looking at teams for U9-U12, then stay close to home if you can...it's not worth a long drive just to play on what someone else perceives to be the "best in the area". The most important thing to look for is a coach who will be able to develop your player - whatever the skill level. Once you know what type of player you have (at U11-13), then you can start deciding if they need to be moved to a different team.

For the younger years what makes the CCL teams better? Anyone player can join these clubs and the costs are roughly the same for travel. ..right?

Oh, here we go again.

It isnt the league, its the quality of a few teams in the league. To make a A team in Loudoun or Arlington with their player pools puts your kid on a team with good players and some proven coaches. That is all. The league isn't magic. But the league has some quality clubs that have some quality teams. But at U9 and U10 you are dealing with little kids and scores get pretty crazy and that is true for any league.

With a very American-style of play. The problem with these two clubs in they use that player pool to seed the field with large kids. I've seen kids have a huge growth spurt---and now all the sudden player is very attractive to the upper team coach when they couldn't give a crap before and their skill level of play is exactly the same level as before--just now with size. It is not unheard of for players to turn down top spots at these clubs to go develop elsewhere. Not everyone thinks it is the holy grail to play for these Clubs. But--they do have huge player pools that most clubs do not have. I'll give you that.

With respect to the long ball crap that pp mentioned---I've seen the same style of play even in Futsal where it is the last place you should be launching balls in the air. It was cringe-worthy.

I didn't intend endorse those clubs just more stating numerical facts and outcome based facts. Smart parents know to look for development over "results". Sometimes they do occur together though.

In regards to "long ball futsal" I'll disagree though. High level futsal is played more in the air than you realize. Scooping the ball for passing is common because of the low bounce nature of the ball allows easier trapping of the ball out of the air. passing through the air therefor becomes a commonly used tactic. It adds another dimension to the game.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, the SYC 2006 top boys team is incredible..beats EDP and CCL teams in tournaments.

Many teams beat CCL and EDP teams in tournaments---especially the MD teams. WTH is in the water in MD?

The CCL teams all stick together and do each others tournaments anyways. They'll often throw each other some of their many teams in an age group to fill out brackets. They generally play the same teams over and over again. Then get shocked when they step outside the CCL bubble.

This is not accurate. Are there teams in ccl that are terrible ? of course there are. But several of the best clubs in ccl dominate state cup. The only teams getting shocked in state cup are NON CCL.

None of this says anything about your child's skill or personal development. The CCL teams play American soccer.

Most knowledgeable soccer parents tend towards a different type of development for their children. Personalized, skill and possession-based. They don't buy into the big club mantra. These kids are light-years beyond 'state cup' play which used to be the goal in the 1980s, 90s. Not anymore.

This is not true for all. My kid played against some of the NOVA CCL teams and they played possession style soccer. There was no kick and chase going on.

Just about every ccl team my kids under U-12 have played just have the goalie do the long punt it out of the back every.single.time. This shouldn't even be allowed in the younger years. It just results in the type of soccer where you send the biggest kid down the middle. They are learning absolutely nothing about the sport or play doing this. It's a detriment to their development--especially as physical attributes even out down the road. Watch champions league and see how often that is done in real play. LMVSC is one of the few that don't do this.

Obviously has not been to any recent CCL matches . . . . totally false.

+100

CCL teams vary greatly depending on gender, age and club, but for the most part, they are quality teams. I've had kids play WAGS, NCSL, ODSL and CCL...the CCL teams were definitely better quality, in terms of both coaching and players. (Of course I'm sure some hyped up ECNL and/or DA person will have a comment here, but not everyone is up for that environment).

If you are looking at teams for U9-U12, then stay close to home if you can...it's not worth a long drive just to play on what someone else perceives to be the "best in the area". The most important thing to look for is a coach who will be able to develop your player - whatever the skill level. Once you know what type of player you have (at U11-13), then you can start deciding if they need to be moved to a different team.

For the younger years what makes the CCL teams better? Anyone player can join these clubs and the costs are roughly the same for travel. ..right?

Oh, here we go again.

It isnt the league, its the quality of a few teams in the league. To make a A team in Loudoun or Arlington with their player pools puts your kid on a team with good players and some proven coaches. That is all. The league isn't magic. But the league has some quality clubs that have some quality teams. But at U9 and U10 you are dealing with little kids and scores get pretty crazy and that is true for any league.

With a very American-style of play. The problem with these two clubs in they use that player pool to seed the field with large kids. I've seen kids have a huge growth spurt---and now all the sudden player is very attractive to the upper team coach when they couldn't give a crap before and their skill level of play is exactly the same level as before--just now with size. It is not unheard of for players to turn down top spots at these clubs to go develop elsewhere. Not everyone thinks it is the holy grail to play for these Clubs. But--they do have huge player pools that most clubs do not have. I'll give you that.

With respect to the long ball crap that pp mentioned---I've seen the same style of play even in Futsal where it is the last place you should be launching balls in the air. It was cringe-worthy.