Anonymous
06/23/2015 12:04
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Again, the HHI would give a good idea of whether or not helping them is a reasonable request.
Based on the fact you won't give the HHI, I'm going to assume it is sizable.
If you are making under $100K, no, there's no way you can support them if you living in the DC metro.
If, your household income is over $250K, then yes, you should be able to manage some sort of monthly allowance.
Another suggestion would be for them to sell all of the current property they own and move to a condo where they would not need to do to outside maintenance and, depending on where you buy, it might be better for you and your husband to buy the condo and put it in your name. You could cover the HOA fees and they would essentially not have rent.
Could they live on the social security benefits if they drastically cut their living expenses?
There's too many unknown factors in what you've provided to be able to give any practical advice.
While I get you think you shouldn't have to pay anything, I'm not sure this viewpoint is going to get you far in your relationship with your husband.
OP here - Should I buy them a palace and some butlers too? Maybe I should quit my job to wait on them hand and foot. Thanks for posting, but this is ridiculous.
You can buy an inexpensive condo depending on where it's located. Again, there's not enough info to provide helpful info.
I'm going to have say that the more you respond the more obvious it is you are a bitter person with not much generosity of spirit.
Good luck.
OP here - Ah, another lifelong mooch. The way you expertly allocated my income to all sorts of allowances for my in laws tells me you have practice at earmarking others' funds. No doubt you think the hardworking people of the world are just awful when we don't let your ilk reach into our pocketbooks.
I was much more sympathetic to your position until you started replying. You do sound kinda bitchy over and above your legitimate concerns.
My own situation has some things in common. DH and I are both immigrants and now make decent money. DHs parents have made several disastrous decisions that had a major impact on their ability to provide to themselves. They are used to living above their means (not extravagantly but consistently above what they actually can afford), have long ago squandered everything they have inherited, favor their other son, deny to our faces we gave them money we sent just a few months before, totally ignore our advice and protestations and are unrepentant in respect to their decisions and lifestyle. Yet, they are 65 and 70 and love their grandchildren (my children) to death. I had several screaming fights with my MIL but we made up.
We can afford to give them some money though my husband doesn't want to (he makes about 3 times more than I do). But I feel a bit sorry for them and I don't think it's a good example for my kids that they get various extras while their own grandparents are struggling (for which they are 100% responsible but still...). So I promised to give them money for a new car (which due to aforementioned disastrous decisions is an absolute necessity for them) and, since my husband objects, will likely fund that from my personal account. This is not the first time I give them money... but honestly, it makes me feel better about myself and I think it's good for the kids. The fact that they love my kids so much is the bottom line for me. My older daughter is quite willing to forfeit her own gifts so that we can send money to grandma. I think it's a good lesson in priorities. To be sure we are not sending them large sums - they also live abroad where many things are cheaper. So, no, I wouldn't endanger my own livelihood because of them.
Screaming fights with your MIL (no respect for your elders when you're not in the mood, eh?), taking from your kids, giving money behind DH's back just to make yourself feel good, enabling bad decisions. Oy, you are what we call a real shmendrik. You need to be asking for advice, not giving it.
i am not giving money behind my DH's back. he knows about it.
i don't think i actually gave any advice to OP but my life is pretty good. it's ok to give, really, even to those who haven't earned it by being perfect like you.
Anonymous
06/23/2015 12:01
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Back to the question posted please. OP, I also admire your strength and can understand why you are so upset. You are NOT a bad person for wanting to be very firm with them. I agree with the idea of insisting that they do whatever they can to mitigate some of this before you provide any help. I also think you should gift an amount you will feel ok about and NOT do a monthly thing. I think you know that any monthly amount you agree to know will be in place for as long as they are alive and will only increase over the years. Is your DH open to therapy to help you two negotiate this in such a way that your marriage remains intact? Good luck!!
Anonymous
06/23/2015 12:01
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
OP here - Suuuure, I'm a troll because I gave you a stern rebuke. Bye now.
Shouldn't you be working so you can earn all of your money? Not sure how you can afford to waste time on DCUM. Seems like it would be a huge waste of your time.
Did your children leave you out in the cold? I am not sure what your stake in this thread is now that you have offered your advice and it has clearly been rejected.
Your response doesn't make any sense.
Why are you still posting just to antagonize? The post asked for advice, you gave advice, it was rejected, and, from what I can see, you have no other value to add here beyond just being a jerk. Unless this thread is triggering something raw and hurt in you, there is no other reason for you to be here. Don't you yourself have a job?
At this point it's become entertaining to watch you be ruder and ruder. How do you know I've offered advice?
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:57
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Again, the HHI would give a good idea of whether or not helping them is a reasonable request.
Based on the fact you won't give the HHI, I'm going to assume it is sizable.
If you are making under $100K, no, there's no way you can support them if you living in the DC metro.
If, your household income is over $250K, then yes, you should be able to manage some sort of monthly allowance.
Another suggestion would be for them to sell all of the current property they own and move to a condo where they would not need to do to outside maintenance and, depending on where you buy, it might be better for you and your husband to buy the condo and put it in your name. You could cover the HOA fees and they would essentially not have rent.
Could they live on the social security benefits if they drastically cut their living expenses?
There's too many unknown factors in what you've provided to be able to give any practical advice.
While I get you think you shouldn't have to pay anything, I'm not sure this viewpoint is going to get you far in your relationship with your husband.
OP here - Should I buy them a palace and some butlers too? Maybe I should quit my job to wait on them hand and foot. Thanks for posting, but this is ridiculous.
You can buy an inexpensive condo depending on where it's located. Again, there's not enough info to provide helpful info.
I'm going to have say that the more you respond the more obvious it is you are a bitter person with not much generosity of spirit.
Good luck.
OP here - Ah, another lifelong mooch. The way you expertly allocated my income to all sorts of allowances for my in laws tells me you have practice at earmarking others' funds. No doubt you think the hardworking people of the world are just awful when we don't let your ilk reach into our pocketbooks.
I was much more sympathetic to your position until you started replying. You do sound kinda bitchy over and above your legitimate concerns.
My own situation has some things in common. DH and I are both immigrants and now make decent money. DHs parents have made several disastrous decisions that had a major impact on their ability to provide to themselves. They are used to living above their means (not extravagantly but consistently above what they actually can afford), have long ago squandered everything they have inherited, favor their other son, deny to our faces we gave them money we sent just a few months before, totally ignore our advice and protestations and are unrepentant in respect to their decisions and lifestyle. Yet, they are 65 and 70 and love their grandchildren (my children) to death. I had several screaming fights with my MIL but we made up.
We can afford to give them some money though my husband doesn't want to (he makes about 3 times more than I do). But I feel a bit sorry for them and I don't think it's a good example for my kids that they get various extras while their own grandparents are struggling (for which they are 100% responsible but still...). So I promised to give them money for a new car (which due to aforementioned disastrous decisions is an absolute necessity for them) and, since my husband objects, will likely fund that from my personal account. This is not the first time I give them money... but honestly, it makes me feel better about myself and I think it's good for the kids. The fact that they love my kids so much is the bottom line for me. My older daughter is quite willing to forfeit her own gifts so that we can send money to grandma. I think it's a good lesson in priorities. To be sure we are not sending them large sums - they also live abroad where many things are cheaper. So, no, I wouldn't endanger my own livelihood because of them.
Screaming fights with your MIL (no respect for your elders when you're not in the mood, eh?), taking from your kids, giving money behind DH's back just to make yourself feel good, enabling bad decisions. Oy, you are what we call a real shmendrik. You need to be asking for advice, not giving it.
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:54
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Again, the HHI would give a good idea of whether or not helping them is a reasonable request.
Based on the fact you won't give the HHI, I'm going to assume it is sizable.
If you are making under $100K, no, there's no way you can support them if you living in the DC metro.
If, your household income is over $250K, then yes, you should be able to manage some sort of monthly allowance.
Another suggestion would be for them to sell all of the current property they own and move to a condo where they would not need to do to outside maintenance and, depending on where you buy, it might be better for you and your husband to buy the condo and put it in your name. You could cover the HOA fees and they would essentially not have rent.
Could they live on the social security benefits if they drastically cut their living expenses?
There's too many unknown factors in what you've provided to be able to give any practical advice.
While I get you think you shouldn't have to pay anything, I'm not sure this viewpoint is going to get you far in your relationship with your husband.
OP here - Should I buy them a palace and some butlers too? Maybe I should quit my job to wait on them hand and foot. Thanks for posting, but this is ridiculous.
You can buy an inexpensive condo depending on where it's located. Again, there's not enough info to provide helpful info.
I'm going to have say that the more you respond the more obvious it is you are a bitter person with not much generosity of spirit.
Good luck.
OP here - Ah, another lifelong mooch. The way you expertly allocated my income to all sorts of allowances for my in laws tells me you have practice at earmarking others' funds. No doubt you think the hardworking people of the world are just awful when we don't let your ilk reach into our pocketbooks.
And now I think OP is a troll.
OP here - Suuuure, I'm a troll because I gave you a stern rebuke. Bye now.
Different poster. Absolute troll. Can we please stop feeding?
Bullshit. I'm calling sock puppet.
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:50
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Again, the HHI would give a good idea of whether or not helping them is a reasonable request.
Based on the fact you won't give the HHI, I'm going to assume it is sizable.
If you are making under $100K, no, there's no way you can support them if you living in the DC metro.
If, your household income is over $250K, then yes, you should be able to manage some sort of monthly allowance.
Another suggestion would be for them to sell all of the current property they own and move to a condo where they would not need to do to outside maintenance and, depending on where you buy, it might be better for you and your husband to buy the condo and put it in your name. You could cover the HOA fees and they would essentially not have rent.
Could they live on the social security benefits if they drastically cut their living expenses?
There's too many unknown factors in what you've provided to be able to give any practical advice.
While I get you think you shouldn't have to pay anything, I'm not sure this viewpoint is going to get you far in your relationship with your husband.
OP here - Should I buy them a palace and some butlers too? Maybe I should quit my job to wait on them hand and foot. Thanks for posting, but this is ridiculous.
You can buy an inexpensive condo depending on where it's located. Again, there's not enough info to provide helpful info.
I'm going to have say that the more you respond the more obvious it is you are a bitter person with not much generosity of spirit.
Good luck.
OP here - Ah, another lifelong mooch. The way you expertly allocated my income to all sorts of allowances for my in laws tells me you have practice at earmarking others' funds. No doubt you think the hardworking people of the world are just awful when we don't let your ilk reach into our pocketbooks.
And now I think OP is a troll.
OP here - Suuuure, I'm a troll because I gave you a stern rebuke. Bye now.
Different poster. Absolute troll. Can we please stop feeding?
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:48
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Again, the HHI would give a good idea of whether or not helping them is a reasonable request.
Based on the fact you won't give the HHI, I'm going to assume it is sizable.
If you are making under $100K, no, there's no way you can support them if you living in the DC metro.
If, your household income is over $250K, then yes, you should be able to manage some sort of monthly allowance.
Another suggestion would be for them to sell all of the current property they own and move to a condo where they would not need to do to outside maintenance and, depending on where you buy, it might be better for you and your husband to buy the condo and put it in your name. You could cover the HOA fees and they would essentially not have rent.
Could they live on the social security benefits if they drastically cut their living expenses?
There's too many unknown factors in what you've provided to be able to give any practical advice.
While I get you think you shouldn't have to pay anything, I'm not sure this viewpoint is going to get you far in your relationship with your husband.
OP here - Should I buy them a palace and some butlers too? Maybe I should quit my job to wait on them hand and foot. Thanks for posting, but this is ridiculous.
You can buy an inexpensive condo depending on where it's located. Again, there's not enough info to provide helpful info.
I'm going to have say that the more you respond the more obvious it is you are a bitter person with not much generosity of spirit.
Good luck.
OP here - Ah, another lifelong mooch. The way you expertly allocated my income to all sorts of allowances for my in laws tells me you have practice at earmarking others' funds. No doubt you think the hardworking people of the world are just awful when we don't let your ilk reach into our pocketbooks.
I was much more sympathetic to your position until you started replying. You do sound kinda bitchy over and above your legitimate concerns.
My own situation has some things in common. DH and I are both immigrants and now make decent money. DHs parents have made several disastrous decisions that had a major impact on their ability to provide to themselves. They are used to living above their means (not extravagantly but consistently above what they actually can afford), have long ago squandered everything they have inherited, favor their other son, deny to our faces we gave them money we sent just a few months before, totally ignore our advice and protestations and are unrepentant in respect to their decisions and lifestyle. Yet, they are 65 and 70 and love their grandchildren (my children) to death. I had several screaming fights with my MIL but we made up.
We can afford to give them some money though my husband doesn't want to (he makes about 3 times more than I do). But I feel a bit sorry for them and I don't think it's a good example for my kids that they get various extras while their own grandparents are struggling (for which they are 100% responsible but still...). So I promised to give them money for a new car (which due to aforementioned disastrous decisions is an absolute necessity for them) and, since my husband objects, will likely fund that from my personal account. This is not the first time I give them money... but honestly, it makes me feel better about myself and I think it's good for the kids. The fact that they love my kids so much is the bottom line for me. My older daughter is quite willing to forfeit her own gifts so that we can send money to grandma. I think it's a good lesson in priorities. To be sure we are not sending them large sums - they also live abroad where many things are cheaper. So, no, I wouldn't endanger my own livelihood because of them.
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:45
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
OP here - Suuuure, I'm a troll because I gave you a stern rebuke. Bye now.
Shouldn't you be working so you can earn all of your money? Not sure how you can afford to waste time on DCUM. Seems like it would be a huge waste of your time.
Did your children leave you out in the cold? I am not sure what your stake in this thread is now that you have offered your advice and it has clearly been rejected.
Your response doesn't make any sense.
Why are you still posting just to antagonize? The post asked for advice, you gave advice, it was rejected, and, from what I can see, you have no other value to add here beyond just being a jerk. Unless this thread is triggering something raw and hurt in you, there is no other reason for you to be here. Don't you yourself have a job?
At this point it's become entertaining to watch you be ruder and ruder. How do you know I've offered advice?
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:39
Subject: Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:I agree with PPs who say you are right to set limits. I think your DH will think you are an ogre if you refuse to help his parents when you are able to do so. Just because people make poor decisions doesn't mean that you have a right to leave them lying in the ditch in the midst of their own messes. It is charitable and Christian (I'm a Christian) to offer to help. That does not mean that you have to make sacrifices, though, OP. Fulfill your family financial obligations first, and then offer what you can to help these hapless people.
We don't choose our relatives, OP. Your DH didn't choose his parents, but he loves them, and if you love your DH, you will help them, even if it's just a token amount.
I agree with the PP and want to add:
If you are going to give them money, you should also know exactly what they will do with it. Don't be afraid to say, "If we give you money, we want to look at the last X months/years of your bank/credit card statements." You are going to help them budget, but also you will know exactly how much they need and exactly how much you can give. Don't let DH fall for "we ran out of money, can you give us more?" That just means they aren't budgeting well.
The other thing you can do is ask for a copy of whatever bills they have (electric, medical, etc.) and call the company directly to find out how much has been paid, and contribute a set amount to those bills. That way you know exactly where your money is going.
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:24
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
OP here - Suuuure, I'm a troll because I gave you a stern rebuke. Bye now.
Shouldn't you be working so you can earn all of your money? Not sure how you can afford to waste time on DCUM. Seems like it would be a huge waste of your time.
Did your children leave you out in the cold? I am not sure what your stake in this thread is now that you have offered your advice and it has clearly been rejected.
Your response doesn't make any sense.
Why are you still posting just to antagonize? The post asked for advice, you gave advice, it was rejected, and, from what I can see, you have no other value to add here beyond just being a jerk. Unless this thread is triggering something raw and hurt in you, there is no other reason for you to be here. Don't you yourself have a job?
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:19
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
OP here - Suuuure, I'm a troll because I gave you a stern rebuke. Bye now.
Shouldn't you be working so you can earn all of your money? Not sure how you can afford to waste time on DCUM. Seems like it would be a huge waste of your time.
Did your children leave you out in the cold? I am not sure what your stake in this thread is now that you have offered your advice and it has clearly been rejected.
Your response doesn't make any sense.
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:11
Subject: Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OP, I am in kind of a similar situation right now... only it is my DH who is a self-made immigrant pulling in most of the HHI, and my parents who have gotten themselves in trouble.
My parents are divorced, and my mom messed up and lost her job a few months ago (and lied about it) and asked to move in with us because she "misses us so much." BS. She has made bad decision after bad decision. I don't judge people for making mistakes - everyone does, but some people are hell-bent on NOT learning from those mistakes, and will never change. I told mom no. We are genuinely not in a position to help - I am still looking for a job, DH is in the early years of a new career, and we are trying to save a down payment - not interested in renting a bigger/more expensive place so that my freeloading mom can move in. Easy to justify for us, since I'm not working and DH's parents are much poorer due to life-altering illness (he sends them money every now and then)
You do what's best for you and your children, OP. Let your DH get a second job if he wants so much to support his parents. If they have to live in a studio apt and apply for welfare, let them. And there is NO WAY you or DH should be on the hook for his siblings, assuming they are able bodied adults.
OP here. I admire your fortitude. How has your refusal to give her money and let her live with you affected your relationship with your mother?
Since I don't have money (beyond what's in retirement accounts) and we are living in a 2 br apartment with 2 kids already, it wasn't that hard to show her that we really aren't in a place to help much. We weren't close to begin with - she just started "missing us" when she found out she was losing her job. She knows her lack of honesty played a part in my decision. We might have been able to move into a 3 br, but I'm afraid that she'll move in, not get a job, and never leave. She's 59. Way too young for this. If she's 85 and can't work, then it would be different.
It's been a few weeks since I said no. She's made other arrangements, still texts me inane things like always. Not the end of the world. She'll figure things out.
OP here - It sounds as if she had a rather mature response. I am happy for you.
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:11
Subject: Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:
Would I be an ogre to take a hard line stance that I will only give what little is left over after we have maxed our retirement savings, funded our children's college savings, and continued our current allocation toward our downpayment?
absolutely not, your family first. I'm with you. Good luck.
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:09
Subject: Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OP, I am in kind of a similar situation right now... only it is my DH who is a self-made immigrant pulling in most of the HHI, and my parents who have gotten themselves in trouble.
My parents are divorced, and my mom messed up and lost her job a few months ago (and lied about it) and asked to move in with us because she "misses us so much." BS. She has made bad decision after bad decision. I don't judge people for making mistakes - everyone does, but some people are hell-bent on NOT learning from those mistakes, and will never change. I told mom no. We are genuinely not in a position to help - I am still looking for a job, DH is in the early years of a new career, and we are trying to save a down payment - not interested in renting a bigger/more expensive place so that my freeloading mom can move in. Easy to justify for us, since I'm not working and DH's parents are much poorer due to life-altering illness (he sends them money every now and then)
You do what's best for you and your children, OP. Let your DH get a second job if he wants so much to support his parents. If they have to live in a studio apt and apply for welfare, let them. And there is NO WAY you or DH should be on the hook for his siblings, assuming they are able bodied adults.
OP here. I admire your fortitude. How has your refusal to give her money and let her live with you affected your relationship with your mother?
Since I don't have money (beyond what's in retirement accounts) and we are living in a 2 br apartment with 2 kids already, it wasn't that hard to show her that we really aren't in a place to help much. We weren't close to begin with - she just started "missing us" when she found out she was losing her job. She knows her lack of honesty played a part in my decision. We might have been able to move into a 3 br, but I'm afraid that she'll move in, not get a job, and never leave. She's 59. Way too young for this. If she's 85 and can't work, then it would be different.
It's been a few weeks since I said no. She's made other arrangements, still texts me inane things like always. Not the end of the world. She'll figure things out.
Anonymous
06/23/2015 11:08
Subject: Re:Am I wrong?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
OP here - Suuuure, I'm a troll because I gave you a stern rebuke. Bye now.
Shouldn't you be working so you can earn all of your money? Not sure how you can afford to waste time on DCUM. Seems like it would be a huge waste of your time.
Did your children leave you out in the cold? I am not sure what your stake in this thread is now that you have offered your advice and it has clearly been rejected.