Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ Is the transfer really automatically granted? I have heard that there are no longer any guarantees that MV students can be administratively transferred elsewhere. If the dual language program changes back to the old system -- under which one or more of the school's idiosyncracies automatically supported a transfer request -- it sounds like a 'win win.'

The transfer is likely automatic but that doesn't mean that you get the school of your choice.

Yes, I am curious where people in recent years were able to transfer to if they got an admin transfer from MVCS?

Anonymous wrote:^^ Is the transfer really automatically granted? I have heard that there are no longer any guarantees that MV students can be administratively transferred elsewhere. If the dual language program changes back to the old system -- under which one or more of the school's idiosyncracies automatically supported a transfer request -- it sounds like a 'win win.'

The transfer is likely automatic but that doesn't mean that you get the school of your choice.

OP of the Mount Vernon question here.

Thank you for your replies! Hearing from families who both like and dislike the program there is really helpful. I'm interested to see how the school changes and grows over the next few years. Because ideally, I really want to support our public school.

^^ Is the transfer really automatically granted? I have heard that there are no longer any guarantees that MV students can be administratively transferred elsewhere. If the dual language program changes back to the old system -- under which one or more of the school's idiosyncracies automatically supported a transfer request -- it sounds like a 'win win.'

My kids are in ACPS. We aren't zoned for MVCS, but I've followed the developments there, as I try to stay informed on things in the division.

I think some further background might be helpful for newer parents. MVCS for a while had multiple programs: not only Dual Language, but it was also a year round school, and doing Success for All (a literacy program). I think it might even have been trying for Primary Years IB program, but I'm less sure about that one--it was hard to keep up with all of the programs! All of these programs required coordination, and they don't necessarily "play well" with each other, as one staffing decision that might benefit one program could have an unintended negative consequence on another program. It also meant the principal was have to use up a lot of administrative time and resources trying to run all of these programs, and it was also difficult to find a principal who was equally knowledgeable and committed to ALL of these programs.
The result: some of the worst turnover at the principal level, and mediocre results.

I think what is happening now is much more positive. As many PPs have explained, the reality is that the community at large supports Dual-Language, and it is the program they wanted to focus on. The principal is also committed to this approach. National independent studies show that test scores at Dual Language schools are on average higher than those of non-Dual Language schools. This result applies to all kids, both native Spanish and native English speakers, across all subjects. So, the idea to go Dual-Language has some objective data backing it up, not just the whim of the community or ACPS, and not just trying to "fix" the issue of the Spanish-speaking kids' scores, but rather a model that can bring a good school environment for all the kids.

Yes, some people don't like it, but as PPs have pointed out, they will be giving an administrative transfer without any fuss. They will not have any difficulty getting the transfer, nor will they need some kind of special connection or hook to get the transfer. (That's directed at you, crazy PP with paranoid delusions). Any school in ACPS that has a major school-wide program has the opt-out option. The other notable example is Tucker, which has the year-round school. Zero problem getting the transfer if you want it.

So, win-win for all. The community gets what the vast majority of the community want: the Dual Language school. The minority that doesn't can opt out.

My child has not been at MVCS for a couple of years - but from my experience, there were always more English speaking parents wanting spaces for the children in the dual language classrooms than there was space available. So, I doubt the decision to switch to only dual language classrooms is being driven only by the ESL students.

The previous poster doesn't feel that the dual language model works for her family. That's fine, but that doesn't mean that the rest of the English speaking parents feel that same way.

I would imagine many families welcome the change. From my perspective, it should unify the school - you no longer have a "school within a school" set up where some kids are in dual language classrooms and some are in traditional classrooms - which can sometimes be divisive, with each group feeling like the other group is getting special attention or more resources...

It seems what's getting lost in translation here is that MVCS is full immersion due to the fact most community students are ESL and weren't doing well when taught in english. So now everybody in the school community learns in Spanish, which may be difficult for community members who are not ESL. Parents and kids probably wish to go to their community school where they live, and not have to get an administrative transfer out due to the above.

Full Immersion at MVCS was done to bring up the SOL scores partially, or, maybe, primarily, amongst other reasons. I don't see it weird for parents to be talking about these issues anyway. Why not talk about them?

No one is forced to send their kids to a dual language program - you can ALWAYS opt out and transfer to another school.

What is it about this forum - there are all kinds of posts from parents interested in immersion programs and trying to get spots in full programs, identifying immersion programs as something that is sought after - while in another thread it's suddenly some unwanted program, forced on people by evil administrators... Weird.

In the USA, no family should be forced to educate their kids in Spanish. Heck when my grandparents came to the US from overseas, they had to learn English. Dual language programs in public elementary schools should be optional. However, it's my understanding that the ACPS school board, with push from the MVCS principal, has been considering making MVCS mandatory dual language. So the largest (or second largest) elementary in the city would be dual language.

Dual language at MVCS is forced on zoned families. We are one such family. We do not want dual language for our children and there is no other option for us except to admin transfer. There may be one or two sections at MVCS that aren't dual language, but those are filled with special needs kids or kids with other learning problems. And my children, who are not special needs, would be tracked with those kids throughout their entire elementary education.... That is forcing families who do not want it into dual language. It should be a charter school, period.

And this is not misinformation. I toured the school. I did my due diligence. And I count my lucky stars that we got an admin transfer away from MVCS!

Anonymous wrote:

Don't kids learn at different paces and in different ways? Isn't socialization and making friends and being creative and inspired to learn important too, especially at the elementary level?

Well, yes, of course, but if your child is advanced or has a much more substantial background in the information being taught than the other students, they are going to be bored and unchallenged. If there is one teacher and 22 students, 18 of whom desperately need help to achieve basic skills, the teacher is not going to be able to focus a lot of energy on the kid who needs more challenging work.

As a parent of such a child, I can tell you they did fine at MVCS and our child was at not "bored and unchallenged."

Anonymous wrote:
Since your kids have attended, would you be willing to share your view on whether it would be a better choice than some of the more highly rated ACPS schools for a child who is already English/Spanish bilingual?

I'm not sure how helpful I can be in saying which would be a better choice for your child. Neither of my kids started kindergarten with much knowledge of Spanish. For one child who was pretty advanced in other areas, that was a draw because Spanish was something new to learn. It was also our neighborhood school which was important to us - it was great to get to know the parents and kids in the community better.

For kids that continue Spanish through middle school, they enter high school having met their foreign language requirement. If they want, they can continue in 9th grade with Spanish 4 - or choose another language.

My middle school kid said he no longer translates the Spanish he hears, he just understands it - which is something I never achieved with 5 years of high school foreign language.

Anonymous wrote:There is so much mis-information that gets passed around on this site - and repeated over and over again. Honestly, there is so much hate on this website for all things related to ACPS that it gets really old.

The Dual Language program at Mt Vernon was not forced on the school. Families welcomed it and chose to enroll their kids in it. For years parents lobbied to expand the program from 2 classes per grade because there was not enough space to meet the demand. About 10 years ago, parents were camping out overnight before kindergarten registration started to make sure their kids got a spot in the program.

Over those past 10 years, a lot of factors have come into play that had a big effect on the school - the number of students has grown considerably (from under 500 to over 800 students); the demographics have shifted some (2006: 54% hispanic, 25% black, 18% white, 3% other; 2014: 56% hispanic; 6% black, 35% white, 3% other); and there have been several principals moving through the school. While there are problems, it's not terrible like the anonymous internet posters and playground rumors would have you believe. My kids attended and have done well.

If you really want to find out about the school - visit it, talk to your neighbors, talk to parents with kids who have attended, are attending, etc.

A thoughtful, balanced response re mt vernon? Surely you do don't expect anyone to value this...

(I say that tongue in cheek. I don't have kids in mvcs, but another acps school, but found your response to be helpful and constructive. The unsubstantiated hate on here is frustrating (note- if someone hated acps/had a bad experience and posted specific information and reasons why, I think that's fine, and adds to the discourse. The random "person says acps is terrible, often with little to no explanation nd/or thinly veiled racism and classism" bit really gets old though.)

While there are problems, it's not terrible like the anonymous internet posters and playground rumors would have you believe. My kids attended and have done well.

Since your kids have attended, would you be willing to share your view on whether it would be a better choice than some of the more highly rated ACPS schools for a child who is already English/Spanish bilingual?

There is so much mis-information that gets passed around on this site - and repeated over and over again. Honestly, there is so much hate on this website for all things related to ACPS that it gets really old.

The Dual Language program at Mt Vernon was not forced on the school. Families welcomed it and chose to enroll their kids in it. For years parents lobbied to expand the program from 2 classes per grade because there was not enough space to meet the demand. About 10 years ago, parents were camping out overnight before kindergarten registration started to make sure their kids got a spot in the program.

Over those past 10 years, a lot of factors have come into play that had a big effect on the school - the number of students has grown considerably (from under 500 to over 800 students); the demographics have shifted some (2006: 54% hispanic, 25% black, 18% white, 3% other; 2014: 56% hispanic; 6% black, 35% white, 3% other); and there have been several principals moving through the school. While there are problems, it's not terrible like the anonymous internet posters and playground rumors would have you believe. My kids attended and have done well.

If you really want to find out about the school - visit it, talk to your neighbors, talk to parents with kids who have attended, are attending, etc.