Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nope. WOHM loves her job. She just can't understand WHY SAHMs seem to be incapable of accepting the fact that (gasp!) they have a sweet gig being able to focus exclusively on their one job (caring for kids and running the house) when their WOH counterparts have to juggle those same responsibilities on top of another job. It's easy to understand, so I'm not sure why folks are so confused that we need a new thread every week.

You must have had a very short maternity leave if this is what you think the life of any average SAHM is. I've done both since having two kids and being a SAH is much harder.

Ok, tell us how having 2 kids and staying at home is harder than having two kids and working full time.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wanda doesn't want a pity party. She merely wants SAHMs to stop forcing working moms to use terms like WOHM. It's silly and unnecessary. And she's not being condescending. Rather, she's trying to make clear for folks how working moms have two jobs...whereas SAHMs have one job. See how I just said that SAHMs have a job? I did. I get it. Working moms get it. Society gets that SAHMs have the job of caring for kids and their home.

The thing is that SAHMs also do two jobs - they are full time daycare workers / homeschool teachers / nannies - basically they spend the time while you are at work on raising their child(ren). Then in the evenings and weekends - they do the same job as working moms - taking care of kids and home. SAHMs just mix it up a bit more - they do some housework during the day while the kids nap etc..

This right here is why people started using terms like WOHM. Because of people like this, who insist that being a mother is equal to holding down a for-pay job. It's so unbelievably stupid to me that we have to explain things like pay structures and bosses and work deadlines and commutes and obligations outside of your control to people like this. So I won't even try.

I have a PhD and had a 12 year career. You don't need to explain anything to me. What you need to explain to yourself is why you are such an asshole.

Then you should have enough sense to know the difference between a stay a home parent and a working out of the home parent. Your ignorance was showing loud and clear, and you're contributing to an idiotic trend acting like it's the same thing to stay and home and work out of the house, so much so that we have these acronyms. And yet people like you still want to argue about it.

I've done both. Being a WOHM is MUCH more demanding and stressful. Why? Because as a SAHM, you only have one job. All of your focus and energy can go into that one job. Plus you get HELP on that one job from your spouse at the end of the day (or should be). That doesn't mean everyone is GOOD at that one job, but your attention can be directed in that one space.

I'm a much better parent because I have my very intellectually stimulating and satisfying job that I love. But, for the folks such as myself right now with two part-time jobs, you are always split. I work 60+ hours a week for an extremely stressful (yet satisfying) paying job, then have to cram as much time in with my kid in about 2 hours each day during the week as the second job. When LO goes to bed, rather than my one job being done, I work again for another few hours for my paying job. I don't get to take mental breaks during the day, run errands on my own schedule, take the time to grocery shop and make healthy meals, and the list goes on. I absolutely agree with PP that on weekends, supposed "down time," DH and I are running around doing all the errands, laundry, cleaning, visiting family, ect that we can't do during the week that a SAHM would ordinarily do. There is no comparison.

Anonymous wrote:Nope. WOHM loves her job. She just can't understand WHY SAHMs seem to be incapable of accepting the fact that (gasp!) they have a sweet gig being able to focus exclusively on their one job (caring for kids and running the house) when their WOH counterparts have to juggle those same responsibilities on top of another job. It's easy to understand, so I'm not sure why folks are so confused that we need a new thread every week.

You must have had a very short maternity leave if this is what you think the life of any average SAHM is. I've done both since having two kids and being a SAH is much harder.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wanda doesn't want a pity party. She merely wants SAHMs to stop forcing working moms to use terms like WOHM. It's silly and unnecessary. And she's not being condescending. Rather, she's trying to make clear for folks how working moms have two jobs...whereas SAHMs have one job. See how I just said that SAHMs have a job? I did. I get it. Working moms get it. Society gets that SAHMs have the job of caring for kids and their home.

The thing is that SAHMs also do two jobs - they are full time daycare workers / homeschool teachers / nannies - basically they spend the time while you are at work on raising their child(ren). Then in the evenings and weekends - they do the same job as working moms - taking care of kids and home. SAHMs just mix it up a bit more - they do some housework during the day while the kids nap etc..

This right here is why people started using terms like WOHM. Because of people like this, who insist that being a mother is equal to holding down a for-pay job. It's so unbelievably stupid to me that we have to explain things like pay structures and bosses and work deadlines and commutes and obligations outside of your control to people like this. So I won't even try.

I have a PhD and had a 12 year career. You don't need to explain anything to me. What you need to explain to yourself is why you are such an asshole.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Um, nice try PP.

Let me dumb this down for you:

SAHM Sally has two precious snowflakes in elementary school. They get on the bus at 8:30, and they get home at 3:30...except on the days they have after school activities.

WOHM Wanda also has two kids in elementary school. Same bus schedule. Wanda gets home from her FT lawyer gig in DC by 5pm (she heads in super early while DH gets the kids on the bus in the morning, so she avoids rush hour and can get home at a reasonable time).

Wanda spends 40 hours a week kicking ass at her day job.

Sally spends her day at the gym, running errands and cleaning (actually, scratch that...Sally has a cleaning service).

If you fail to recognize that one lady is working two jobs while the other lady has a cakewalk, then we are done here...obviously you are delusional.

Careful, your jealously is showing.

Not when she receives a paycheck it's not.

Look at the venom she's spewing about a *fictitious* person going to the gym every day and having a cleaning lady come by. The only reason to take it that personally is because you're bitter that someone has it better/easier than you do. If you really didn't care, you'd shrug your shoulders. Not your life, not your problem.

Anonymous wrote:Yay! A logical poster! Thank you, PP.

I was thinking about this over a lunch meeting with a female colleague who doesn't have kids. She's a working woman or a woman with a job (no kids, so not a WOHM). I also know a childless woman who doesn't work, so she's not a SAHM (just a lucky duck IMHO). Fwiw, she tells people she doesn't work when asked (I've heard her say this in public when she's introduced). But, she cooks, cleans, gardens, etc. She does everything a homemaker would do, but when asked "what she does" (ie: what's your job) she realizes that what they mean is "what's your career/do you work."

Now I'm sure someone is going to jump in with, "But caring for little ones is work!" Of course it is. But what about when all the kids are in school for six hours a day (plus bus time...tack on another 15-30 mins or so)? Compare Sally and Wanda again.

Eh. I work outside of the home because I have to. I need the money. But if you don't need the money, why should you work at some crappy job if you don't want to? Even jobs that are generally pleasant have pitfalls. There was a thread I was reading last night from a SAHM with help. Her husband makes 650k a year. That's a fuck load of money. I'm not surprised that she doesn't work and never intends to again.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Um, nice try PP.

Let me dumb this down for you:

SAHM Sally has two precious snowflakes in elementary school. They get on the bus at 8:30, and they get home at 3:30...except on the days they have after school activities.

WOHM Wanda also has two kids in elementary school. Same bus schedule. Wanda gets home from her FT lawyer gig in DC by 5pm (she heads in super early while DH gets the kids on the bus in the morning, so she avoids rush hour and can get home at a reasonable time).

Wanda spends 40 hours a week kicking ass at her day job.

Sally spends her day at the gym, running errands and cleaning (actually, scratch that...Sally has a cleaning service).

If you fail to recognize that one lady is working two jobs while the other lady has a cakewalk, then we are done here...obviously you are delusional.

Careful, your jealously is showing.

Not when she receives a paycheck it's not.

Anonymous wrote:Um, nice try PP.

Let me dumb this down for you:

SAHM Sally has two precious snowflakes in elementary school. They get on the bus at 8:30, and they get home at 3:30...except on the days they have after school activities.

WOHM Wanda also has two kids in elementary school. Same bus schedule. Wanda gets home from her FT lawyer gig in DC by 5pm (she heads in super early while DH gets the kids on the bus in the morning, so she avoids rush hour and can get home at a reasonable time).

Wanda spends 40 hours a week kicking ass at her day job.

Sally spends her day at the gym, running errands and cleaning (actually, scratch that...Sally has a cleaning service).

If you fail to recognize that one lady is working two jobs while the other lady has a cakewalk, then we are done here...obviously you are delusional.

Careful, your jealously is showing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I always thought WOHM and WAHM were the same thing!

Thanks for clarifying. And I too prefer "working mom." I don't think it's a slap in the fact to moms who work from home or stay at home and don't work (for money--we all know that SAHMs do a lot of work!). It's just a more familiar term to people who don't camp out on message boards all day.

That's the thing, all moms are working moms. The distinction lies in where the work occurs.

Sorry, a working mom has to deal with customer's and adhere to someone else's demands and schedule (whether a boss or their clients).

A SAHM has no constraints on her schedule AT ALL until her kids are in elementary school (and then it's only the bus schedule which then leaves here childfree for hours to do whatever she feels like). And if the schedule of the bus urks her, she can always home school. The only person she might report to is her husband bankrolling her kick-back lifestyle.

The WOHM and WAHM distinction reflects the inflexibility and stress that commuting brings; if you are WAHM and your elementary school age kid gets sick, you can probably continue to work and just set them up with an ipad and some books for the day. Likewise with arranging work on the house, house keepers, etc. They can zip over to DC school for those middle of the day activities just to a do a pop-in, unlike a WOHM who has to budget time for commuting and likely cannot easily return to work after the event.

And need to reiterate the morass and toll that commuting takes in this area, WOHM and WAHM is a very different experience.

+1, I switched to WAHM a year ago and my quality of life has gone up. Having experienced this, I really think that as a SAHM even though you might do more physical labor, there must be very very less stress than any working mom. Packing lunches, taking care of sick children, commute, dinner time stress, appointments, drop off, pick up, everything is highly stressful for both the mom and children when you are working, IMHO

PP here again, I have to add that weekends would pass so quickly as DH & I would be running around doing shopping, errands and laundry, dragging the children along and it would be Sunday evening in no time. Now as WAHM I can do most of stuff on weekdays with the time saved on getting dressed up/hair/packing my lunches/commute/lunch hour break, and now our weekends are very relaxing. It is surprising how 5-10 minutes of time here and there can make such a big difference in life. So yes being a SAHM with full control of your schedule is totally a different gig. It is great that women are putting their career on hold to take care of children, but please it is no way as hard as working and being a mom.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I always thought WOHM and WAHM were the same thing!

Thanks for clarifying. And I too prefer "working mom." I don't think it's a slap in the fact to moms who work from home or stay at home and don't work (for money--we all know that SAHMs do a lot of work!). It's just a more familiar term to people who don't camp out on message boards all day.

That's the thing, all moms are working moms. The distinction lies in where the work occurs.

Sorry, a working mom has to deal with customer's and adhere to someone else's demands and schedule (whether a boss or their clients).

A SAHM has no constraints on her schedule AT ALL until her kids are in elementary school (and then it's only the bus schedule which then leaves here childfree for hours to do whatever she feels like). And if the schedule of the bus urks her, she can always home school. The only person she might report to is her husband bankrolling her kick-back lifestyle.

The WOHM and WAHM distinction reflects the inflexibility and stress that commuting brings; if you are WAHM and your elementary school age kid gets sick, you can probably continue to work and just set them up with an ipad and some books for the day. Likewise with arranging work on the house, house keepers, etc. They can zip over to DC school for those middle of the day activities just to a do a pop-in, unlike a WOHM who has to budget time for commuting and likely cannot easily return to work after the event.

And need to reiterate the morass and toll that commuting takes in this area, WOHM and WAHM is a very different experience.

+1, I switched to WAHM a year ago and my quality of life has gone up. Having experienced this, I really think that as a SAHM even though you might do more physical labor, there must be very very less stress than any working mom. Packing lunches, taking care of sick children, commute, dinner time stress, appointments, drop off, pick up, everything is highly stressful for both the mom and children when you are working, IMHO

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wanda doesn't want a pity party. She merely wants SAHMs to stop forcing working moms to use terms like WOHM. It's silly and unnecessary. And she's not being condescending. Rather, she's trying to make clear for folks how working moms have two jobs...whereas SAHMs have one job. See how I just said that SAHMs have a job? I did. I get it. Working moms get it. Society gets that SAHMs have the job of caring for kids and their home.

The thing is that SAHMs also do two jobs - they are full time daycare workers / homeschool teachers / nannies - basically they spend the time while you are at work on raising their child(ren). Then in the evenings and weekends - they do the same job as working moms - taking care of kids and home. SAHMs just mix it up a bit more - they do some housework during the day while the kids nap etc..

This right here is why people started using terms like WOHM. Because of people like this, who insist that being a mother is equal to holding down a for-pay job. It's so unbelievably stupid to me that we have to explain things like pay structures and bosses and work deadlines and commutes and obligations outside of your control to people like this. So I won't even try.

Anonymous wrote:Building on 20:36's comment:

We can't use the term FT Mom for a SAHM since that would be ridiculous...akin to labeling someone a FT woman or FT Caucasian.

You realize FT = First Time, right?

Anonymous wrote:Building on 20:36's comment:

We can't use the term FT Mom for a SAHM since that would be ridiculous...akin to labeling someone a FT woman or FT Caucasian.

Or too restricting, since (to some) they are more than "just a mom." Daycare worker, cook, personal shopper, chauffeur, etc.

I am mostly a SAHM and I can happily say that. Because I don't have the demands outside of the house I have the time to do things others can't. I can volunteer at the school or on field trips, I can help organize the fundraisers, I can help out with my kids' sports teams or whatever. I can be there to do those things while other mom's are taking care of what they need to.

There shouldn't be such an issue.

Building on 20:36's comment:

We can't use the term FT Mom for a SAHM since that would be ridiculous...akin to labeling someone a FT woman or FT Caucasian.