Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:why is it my job to pay the waitor

Because that is the default for how our wage laws are crafted. If it were not for gratuity, wait staff would be covered under the Dept of Labor's Fair Labor Standards Act (TLSA) and would be required to be paid minimum wage. Minimum wage is $7.25. Wait staff are often paid as little as $5/hr and expected to make up the difference for their labor in gratuities. If this didn't happen, then minimum wage would be enforced and the prices for restaurants would rise 150+% higher than they currently are to appropriately compensate the wait staff.

Whether you agree with it or not, when you tip low or fail to tip at all, what you are in fact doing is assisting the food industry in underpaying wait staff below what our country has deemed to be a fair minimum wage. If you really want to object, you should object by lobbying your duly elected representatives to change the laws. Instead, what you are doing is punishing the sub-minimum wage earners, the wait staff who have no control over the industry and how they get paid. That's petty, cheap and obnoxious.

You are wrong about the "as little as $5/hour." Try $2.75.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How many people here demand bonuses or expect them every year.

False equivalency. Look it up.

How so? The debate is whether tipping 20% is part of normal service. Here is the guide, Notice that 10% is the minimum


Waiter/waitress: 15% of bill (excl. tax) for adequate service; 20% for very good service; no less than 10% for poor service
http://money.cnn.com/pf/features/lists/tipping/

Hey genius - fine. Be cheap. But as previous posters said the paltry $2 and some change that servers are paid in "salary" usually amounts in a paycheck of $0 after taxes. So by not tipping - or by being a cheap tightass - you are essentially cheating a person who provided a service from you out of a wage. Don't like it? Stay the fuck home!

Anonymous wrote:why is it my job to pay the waitor

You are the reason so many restaurants automatically include this in the bill. If you are that cheap stay at home and make your own damn dinner. Or have Muffy or your cook do it for you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How many people here demand bonuses or expect them every year.

False equivalency. Look it up.

How so? The debate is whether tipping 20% is part of normal service. Here is the guide, Notice that 10% is the minimum


Waiter/waitress: 15% of bill (excl. tax) for adequate service; 20% for very good service; no less than 10% for poor service
http://money.cnn.com/pf/features/lists/tipping/

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:a tip is like a bonus, it shouldn't be expected or else you lose the entire purpose of it.

Former server again...I think it's part of the price of a sit-down dinner, where someone is serving you. Similarly, part of the price of food delivered to your home. I don't understand all the tip jars that have appeared at fast food or cafeteria style restaurants, even gas stations. Since when is a tip expected for running my lotto picks through the computer?

WTF that's bullshit. A tip is a bonus not an expected. If this is the attitude of our youth today we are screwed no wonder they are all whiny and expect everything handed to them including free services.

This is not the attitude of our "youth today." What a gasbag you must be. I'm pretty sure that tipping has been good etiquette in this country since like, oh - FOREVER.

Anonymous wrote:How many people here demand bonuses or expect them every year.

False equivalency. Look it up.

Anonymous wrote:For "normal" middle class Americans going out to eat is a treat. It's not as though a middle class family is making gobs more than the waiter. Money matters to everyone, not just restaurant staff. If that one family can only afford one or two restaurant meals because they are expected to subsidize low wages then they won't go out as frequently or order the food to go which ultimately hurts the business and staff.

Oh, boo hoo. If a middle class family is going out for the occasional cheap meal at the Ground Round, then they can rustle up the extra $10 for a tip. I was raised by a single mom who made peanuts, and somehow she didn't use this crass excuse to screw someone even worse off than her a tip. I'm just gonna go ahead and assume that you are not now nor have you ever been a "normal" middle class American. So get off it already.

How many people here demand bonuses or expect them every year.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another former server here....for those of you who don't tip on alcohol, you need to consider that in most restaurants, servers need to share their tips with the bartenders and bussers. In some restaurants, the tips shared with bartenders are based on percentage of alcohol sales. So, if you stiff the server on the alcohol portion of your bill, they are paying the bartender out of their own pocket.

So, let's say I grossed $180 in tips on $1,000 of food/drink sales (assuming average 18% tips, let's set aside the pre/post tax discussion for the moment).
Assume roughly 30% of that $1,000 if alcohol, or $300. My tips would have been distributed as follows:

$30 to bartenders (10% of alchohol sales)
$27 to bussers (15% of gross tips though I would often give extra on a busy night)
$21 to food runners (3% of food sales to the servers who help plate and tray the food and bring it from kitchen to table ASAP)

Leaving me with $102 to take home. Consider that every dollar counts when you are nickle and diming your bill.

I have always been told by servers that you do not tip on wine unless it is chosen for you by a sommelier. Obviously mixed drinks and such and very different.

Calling bullshit on that one. I waited tables for 6 years and I would have NEVER told someone that. But nice try.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

You know that restaurants already gouge the shit out of you on alcohol? Why should I pay 30 dollars for a 12 dollar bottle of wine and then have tip 20% on top of that.

Because the cost you are paying for the wine goes to the establishment. The tip goes to the poor schmoe who had the bad luck to be assigned to serve you. You think that because the restaurant has a big markup on the wine that the bar and wait staff who pop an serve you the wine deserve nothing for their time and work. Considering that they are paid below minimum wage because they supposedly make up the difference with tips, but you don't give them one, you are voicing your disapproval by punishing the wrong people. If you really disagree with the pricing, don't buy the wine in the first place. But once you decide to pay the exorbitant markup, then tip the staff who had nothing to do with setting the price on the wine.

Honestly, some of you are so chintzy.

A-fricking-men. If you can't tip a person who is serving you a meal that you didn't have to cook and don't have to clean up after, you are a stingy ass. And you should just stay home and drink your own $12 bottle of wine.

Anonymous wrote:tipping is not mandatory and should only be given if service and food was exceptional.

Yeah, let them eat cake, right? What a pompous statement.

Anonymous wrote:OP here. It's proper etiquette to tip pre-tax, which is why I asked. I generally tip on post-tax, because I'm lazy and it's easier.

Okay, Emily Post. Thanks for the PSA.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish tipping were illegal. It is a pain. I'd vote for any candidate who said they would make tipping illegal.

Fine - then you should be ok with a huge increase in your food prices when eating out, because restaurant owners will have to actually pay their servers a wage. Right now, servers basically make $0 per hour after taxes and every dollar they make is from tips. So, are you ok with a 20% increase in the amount you pay at a restaurant. You are cheap and should just eat at home.

I definitely do not have a problem with this and neither do the customers. It would make much easier. And menus would have honest prices. Some actually do need to know how much something costs before buying.
I suspect the wait staff are the ones who oppose this the most. Currently the tax you pay on your earnings do not really reflect your actual income

Do you really think the waitstaff opposes this most? Seriously? Because at some restaurants, you have to tip out to the other people (bussers, food runners, host, bar) based on an assumed tip percentage. There could be times that you end up walking with almost nothing after tipping out (especially if a server has several tables of people like you in their section during their shift). And about the tax, you almost never will have a situation when you make significantly more (or more at all) than the government assumes you are making. At the end of each shift, you tell your manager how much you made in tips when you cash out (that was the experience I had in several different restaurants in which I waited tables).

As for the people saying - "they just bring me my food, that's their job, why should they get an extra reward for doing their job?". Well, bringing you your food and taking your order is not all they do. There is sidework, which can often be tedious and gross (patron in pub restaurants love to clog toilets and barf everywhere), their is dealing with people all day that can sometimes treat you like garbage, it is physically demanding being on your feet for hours on end, etc. it's a very tough job and people sometimes treat you horribly. Seriously, just tip your servers!

Anonymous wrote:How much are you spending on dinner for it to make a difference??

Sheesh, post tax, of course.

If we spend $150 on dinner and tip 20%, what is that going to be? an extra $3 if I tip on tax. If can can spend that on dinner, then I can affort $3 extra.

+1 And your server won't think you're a cheap ass who doesn't value good service.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man orders a $20 bottle of house red. Waiter brings bottle over, shows man the bottle, opens the cork, pours a taste, man approves, waiter pours the glass, makes a comment to enjoy the wine, walks off. Tip: 20% of $20 = $4.

Man orders a $800 bottle of Lafitte. Waiter brings bottle over, shows man the bottle, opens the cork, pours a taste, man approves, waiter pours the glass, makes a comment to enjoy the wine, walks off. Tip: 20% of $800 = $160.


See how moronic post booze is?

No, but I see how moronic your analogy is. Food at Applebee's (where you no doubt should be dining given your cheapness) is much cheaper than that at Obelisk. Still, I tip 20% on that.

Exactly