Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 17:15     Subject: Re:is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
Anonymous wrote:
elementary schools east of the park as parents of homogenously wealthy neighborhoods ....


I'm trying to figure out where this is?

I know there are little -pockets- of Capitol Hill that are factually described as "wealthy." ie, 1 percenters. Not upper middle class-ers, but honest to God rich people. The people owning the SFHs right on Logan Circle are probably "wealthy," as the Census or Brookings describes that term. Maybe the people in the penthouses in Penn Quarter (but not the single newly minted lawyer in the studio 7 floors down).

I can't think of a single neighborhood east of RCP that is monolithically wealthy. There are only a couple west of RCP, fyi.

(the definition of wealth and 1% for our area is between $350 and 500K HHI annually)


"Wealthy" is a subjective term.

In a city where 15% of the population makes under $10k per year, a solid middle- to upper-middle class family making $150-$200k per year is pretty "wealthy". There's a very large swath of Capitol Hill where almost every homeowner fits that description.

Not to be pedantic, but no, the "definition of wealth" is not "between $350 and $500k HHI annually".
Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 17:09     Subject: Re:is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
elementary schools east of the park as parents of homogenously wealthy neighborhoods ....


I'm trying to figure out where this is?

I know there are little -pockets- of Capitol Hill that are factually described as "wealthy." ie, 1 percenters. Not upper middle class-ers, but honest to God rich people. The people owning the SFHs right on Logan Circle are probably "wealthy," as the Census or Brookings describes that term. Maybe the people in the penthouses in Penn Quarter (but not the single newly minted lawyer in the studio 7 floors down).

I can't think of a single neighborhood east of RCP that is monolithically wealthy. There are only a couple west of RCP, fyi.

(the definition of wealth and 1% for our area is between $350 and 500K HHI annually)
Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 15:01     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
What school is this? I know gay parents looking for this type of environment.

http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/212458.page

Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I wouldn't say I am a racist but if I could coin a word I would say I am rarelist. Which my description would be that I am rarely around whites in this city.


White dude here again - I think this goes a long way toward explaining the friction you see across class/cultural/racial lines, because a lot of people coexist without a lot of interaction and not because anybody is hateful.

It's a combination of lack of experience and that "Bowling Alone" thing - basically that we don't have a lot of social clubs or things that bring a lot of people together and people are mostly family first, and then they know their neighbors, and then people have some friends and acquaintances and relatives and that's it.

So, the rare-interaction thing is probably a long-term status quo because of the big picture. But basically, I think everybody should just learn to shrug off the little things that other people do across culture lines (why is he so uptight? why can't she speak correctly? would he say that if he knew where I worked or how much I earned?), knowing that most middle class parents have a lot in common if we just think about it for a second and we're all trying to unlock the code to educating our kids in a system that produces a few successes and a lot of failures, along with a ton of turmoil.


Agree with most of this. And yet, there are some large cultural differences that transcend both class and racial lines. For example, at DD's school, a new principal hired a handful of stellar teachers who happened to be be gay. A block of parents first protested loudly, then withdrew their children from the school. The root of their discontent was that they were culturally conservative Christians. Because we're in DC, and one can count the number of white conservative Christians on one hand--all sending their kids to private school--that meant they were black. There was a lot of friction generated over that incident among others.

So part of the communication breakdown is class anxiety, part racial anxiety, and a healthy dose of cultural anxiety.
Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 13:55     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
Anonymous wrote:I am 100% pro gay teachers, and I especially like it when they are totally out about about being gay.


Not sure if you're AA, but I want to be clear: I'm not at all saying that black people are anti-gay. Just saying that sometimes differences don't break down cleanly across race *or* economic lines.
Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 11:30     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
What school is this? I know gay parents looking for this type of environment.

Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I wouldn't say I am a racist but if I could coin a word I would say I am rarelist. Which my description would be that I am rarely around whites in this city.


White dude here again - I think this goes a long way toward explaining the friction you see across class/cultural/racial lines, because a lot of people coexist without a lot of interaction and not because anybody is hateful.

It's a combination of lack of experience and that "Bowling Alone" thing - basically that we don't have a lot of social clubs or things that bring a lot of people together and people are mostly family first, and then they know their neighbors, and then people have some friends and acquaintances and relatives and that's it.

So, the rare-interaction thing is probably a long-term status quo because of the big picture. But basically, I think everybody should just learn to shrug off the little things that other people do across culture lines (why is he so uptight? why can't she speak correctly? would he say that if he knew where I worked or how much I earned?), knowing that most middle class parents have a lot in common if we just think about it for a second and we're all trying to unlock the code to educating our kids in a system that produces a few successes and a lot of failures, along with a ton of turmoil.


Agree with most of this. And yet, there are some large cultural differences that transcend both class and racial lines. For example, at DD's school, a new principal hired a handful of stellar teachers who happened to be be gay. A block of parents first protested loudly, then withdrew their children from the school. The root of their discontent was that they were culturally conservative Christians. Because we're in DC, and one can count the number of white conservative Christians on one hand--all sending their kids to private school--that meant they were black. There was a lot of friction generated over that incident among others.

So part of the communication breakdown is class anxiety, part racial anxiety, and a healthy dose of cultural anxiety.
Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 11:21     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
I am 100% pro gay teachers, and I especially like it when they are totally out about about being gay.
Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 11:15     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I wouldn't say I am a racist but if I could coin a word I would say I am rarelist. Which my description would be that I am rarely around whites in this city.


White dude here again - I think this goes a long way toward explaining the friction you see across class/cultural/racial lines, because a lot of people coexist without a lot of interaction and not because anybody is hateful.

It's a combination of lack of experience and that "Bowling Alone" thing - basically that we don't have a lot of social clubs or things that bring a lot of people together and people are mostly family first, and then they know their neighbors, and then people have some friends and acquaintances and relatives and that's it.

So, the rare-interaction thing is probably a long-term status quo because of the big picture. But basically, I think everybody should just learn to shrug off the little things that other people do across culture lines (why is he so uptight? why can't she speak correctly? would he say that if he knew where I worked or how much I earned?), knowing that most middle class parents have a lot in common if we just think about it for a second and we're all trying to unlock the code to educating our kids in a system that produces a few successes and a lot of failures, along with a ton of turmoil.


Agree with most of this. And yet, there are some large cultural differences that transcend both class and racial lines. For example, at DD's school, a new principal hired a handful of stellar teachers who happened to be be gay. A block of parents first protested loudly, then withdrew their children from the school. The root of their discontent was that they were culturally conservative Christians. Because we're in DC, and one can count the number of white conservative Christians on one hand--all sending their kids to private school--that meant they were black. There was a lot of friction generated over that incident among others.

So part of the communication breakdown is class anxiety, part racial anxiety, and a healthy dose of cultural anxiety.
Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 10:41     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I wouldn't say I am a racist but if I could coin a word I would say I am rarelist. Which my description would be that I am rarely around whites in this city.


White dude here again - I think this goes a long way toward explaining the friction you see across class/cultural/racial lines, because a lot of people coexist without a lot of interaction and not because anybody is hateful.

It's a combination of lack of experience and that "Bowling Alone" thing - basically that we don't have a lot of social clubs or things that bring a lot of people together and people are mostly family first, and then they know their neighbors, and then people have some friends and acquaintances and relatives and that's it.

So, the rare-interaction thing is probably a long-term status quo because of the big picture. But basically, I think everybody should just learn to shrug off the little things that other people do across culture lines (why is he so uptight? why can't she speak correctly? would he say that if he knew where I worked or how much I earned?), knowing that most middle class parents have a lot in common if we just think about it for a second and we're all trying to unlock the code to educating our kids in a system that produces a few successes and a lot of failures, along with a ton of turmoil.


Nice post white dude!

Signed...an African American Mom (who doesn't sweat small stuff...or "small" people :wink
Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 10:37     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
Anonymous wrote:
I wouldn't say I am a racist but if I could coin a word I would say I am rarelist. Which my description would be that I am rarely around whites in this city.


White dude here again - I think this goes a long way toward explaining the friction you see across class/cultural/racial lines, because a lot of people coexist without a lot of interaction and not because anybody is hateful.

It's a combination of lack of experience and that "Bowling Alone" thing - basically that we don't have a lot of social clubs or things that bring a lot of people together and people are mostly family first, and then they know their neighbors, and then people have some friends and acquaintances and relatives and that's it.

So, the rare-interaction thing is probably a long-term status quo because of the big picture. But basically, I think everybody should just learn to shrug off the little things that other people do across culture lines (why is he so uptight? why can't she speak correctly? would he say that if he knew where I worked or how much I earned?), knowing that most middle class parents have a lot in common if we just think about it for a second and we're all trying to unlock the code to educating our kids in a system that produces a few successes and a lot of failures, along with a ton of turmoil.
Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 10:03     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
No, I think many incidents are first time encounters with each other as a race. I can honestly say that I grew up in DC and did not interact with a white student until I went to college. The kicker for that one is, I went to a HBCU and thought it was mighty strange to see a white person on campus. As cliche' it is but the seen in the Drumline movie, I personally experienced it.

Now I am back in the city and all of sudden I am in a diverse situation. Mostly my everyday environment is exclusively all black except when it comes to DCPS politics. Have a good rapport with black chancellor but have displeasure with the white parenting base. I find my DD black principal an excellent administrator but her white supervisor very gossipy. I have observed the black faculty members very engaging and supportive. But I am very skeptical of the white support groups who come across with the "saviour" complex.


As I stated I had a good rapport with the black chancellor and before that I was on excellent terms with Asian Chancellor. But I despised the former white Parent Engagement Coordinator who I thought was very undermining and I cheered when her resignation was accepted.

I wouldn't say I am a racist but if I could coin a word I would say I am rarelist. Which my description would be that I am rarely around whites in this city.
Anonymous
Post 01/30/2012 09:56     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:10:14, I too appreciate the poster's statement but there are AA parents who have means but makes a choice to stay. Yet, when it is realized that I am not the nanny nor the housekeeper dropping off my DD at school. Then for some apparent reason I get the "pity party" invitation. It goes like this, we've been noticing you and we eonder would you like to join our parent group. We get together and discuss what is wrong with our school and make demands to make it better. Then the kicker last statment is, we might as well do this because we are ALL stuck until the economic times improves.


I forgot the little bragging statement that trickles in, this was a fair school but until we banded together it is now a better school but there's room for improvement.

I have to say this after weeks goes by and I don't reply then the parent group sends in black reinforcement to say their speil. That is a whole another blog.


Seems the white people can't move a muscle without doing something offensive, irritating, arrogant or ouright rascist.


Don't over react. The PP was just expressing her frustration and I am certain that she wasn't referring to every white mom on the playground she encounters (just as I know that when some of my white sisters on DCUM make negative comments about black folk, they have some awareness of the different "shades" of black--and no, I'm not talking light skinned vs. dark skinned).

But as an educated AA woman I do know what the PP is talking about. Some of my white counterparts are really cool. We have great conversations that are real. I should note that they are usually women who are widely exposed to people of many different cultures and they aren't afraid to talk openly about race. But these are rare birds. Most of the moms I come in contact with on the playground don't seem to know what to make of me or other black women like myself who have the same or a higher level of education, and whose children are at the top of the class. Their approach is often awkward and a few suffer from chronic hoof in mouth disease.

I find it comical, but then again, I grew up in NYC and was exposed to people of every color and economic level. I get that most of these women are are really nice people, but because of their lack of exposure, they from time to time cough up, some farily politically incorrect comments. Again, I find it funny and I don't take it personal.

What I know is that these women love their kids--just as I love mine--and are doing their best to improve the school environment for not just their children but all children. Some have a "save the world" mentality which can be annoying if they approach those of us who don't need saving, as though we do. But again, I just laugh it off. No harm, no foul. My kids are benefitting from their committment. Many of these women are SAHMs. Most AA women work full time so we can't invest the same number of hours as they can volunteering. And yet, I know many black women like myself who are doing everything they can (within the constraints of their work schedule) to contribute to the school. Be careful not to dismiss us because you don't see us there at 3:30.

If you're sending your child to a DCPS or a Charter school, then--if you aren't already aware-- the AA moms at your DCs school are in this WITH you. Although I can't speak for everyone, but I don't know any black women who resent your presence (a charge that I've heard on DCUM time and time again). As a matter of fact, I have yet to talk to a black woman who isn't appreciative of all the moms of every color who volunteer their time to make the schools better for all of the children. Just be aware that some of us are just most sensitive than others.
Anonymous
Post 01/29/2012 12:18     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
Anonymous wrote:10:14, I too appreciate the poster's statement but there are AA parents who have means but makes a choice to stay. Yet, when it is realized that I am not the nanny nor the housekeeper dropping off my DD at school. Then for some apparent reason I get the "pity party" invitation. It goes like this, we've been noticing you and we eonder would you like to join our parent group. We get together and discuss what is wrong with our school and make demands to make it better. Then the kicker last statment is, we might as well do this because we are ALL stuck until the economic times improves.


I forgot the little bragging statement that trickles in, this was a fair school but until we banded together it is now a better school but there's room for improvement.

I have to say this after weeks goes by and I don't reply then the parent group sends in black reinforcement to say their speil. That is a whole another blog.


Seems the white people can't move a muscle without doing something offensive, irritating, arrogant or ouright rascist.
Anonymous
Post 01/29/2012 12:09     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
Anonymous wrote:No, higher class people can move or pay for private. Education is too important to be left to chance or in the hands of those without a good track record. Otherwise, you see the results years later and they aren't pretty.

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Sounds like conclusions are that charter schools take the pressure off of higher economic status families to put their kids in DCPS, so there probably won't be yuppie/buppie/etc. Kids in bad DCPS schools unless somehow we run out of decent charters. Which seems unlikely given their rapid growth. So it looks like we might actually end up with two tiers of schools east of Rock Creek Park, or maybe even 3 or 4: bad DCPS, good charters, middling charters and middling DCPS. But demographic pressure to move into the truly failing DCPS as higher class people move in just doesn't seem very common or likely.


Two points: First, more and more of the middle-class folks who are moving into DC are not "higher class" and can't necessarily pay for private without bankrupting themselves, so they have a much greater incentive to make public school work than before. Secondly, the result of sending your middle-class kid to a school with a mixed socioeconomic profile are much like sending to private for middle-class kids whose mother's have a high level of educational attainment. In fact, when compared with mom's education, school quality is largely irrelevant.
Anonymous
Post 01/29/2012 10:34     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
10:14, I too appreciate the poster's statement but there are AA parents who have means but makes a choice to stay. Yet, when it is realized that I am not the nanny nor the housekeeper dropping off my DD at school. Then for some apparent reason I get the "pity party" invitation. It goes like this, we've been noticing you and we eonder would you like to join our parent group. We get together and discuss what is wrong with our school and make demands to make it better. Then the kicker last statment is, we might as well do this because we are ALL stuck until the economic times improves.


I forgot the little bragging statement that trickles in, this was a fair school but until we banded together it is now a better school but there's room for improvement.

I have to say this after weeks goes by and I don't reply then the parent group sends in black reinforcement to say their speil. That is a whole another blog.
Anonymous
Post 01/29/2012 10:30     Subject: is "forcing" middle class families into DCPS basically the recovery strategy?
Anonymous wrote:No, higher class people can move or pay for private. Education is too important to be left to chance or in the hands of those without a good track record. Otherwise, you see the results years later and they aren't pretty.


That may be true for a good chunk of middle-class parents, but I personally know many middle-class parents who've chosen to send their kids to their neighborhood DCPS school with the hope that an influx of middle-class students and the time/dedication/resources of their parents will improve the schools' academic performance. Regardless of what you think about this approach, it is happening all over the city. So, no--not everyone is moving or paying for private. (That said, we're personally going the charter route, because I happen to agree with you about putting my kids in a school with crappy academic performance.)