Anonymous wrote:Restore the original name of INS (Immigration and Naturalization Services)--the choice of ICE was deliberate to represent force. The stuff ICE is doing with arresting and deporting people is also just one side of ICE, the other part is immigration SERVICES.

Provide avenues for people to legalize their status. This has never been a walk in the park as people think (guy who led a local training for activists was undocumented for 25 years before he finally obtained legal status). Allow immigration judges to apply the law as they used to instead of firing them just because they aren't deciding what Miller wants them to. Get rid of Miller and Noem. Discipl0ine agents who steal passports (happened yesterday to an Indian-American man in Minnesota, he was going to Walmart, agent stopped him, he showed his passport to provide his lawful presence, agent told him he didn't need it and kept it), threaten people ("if you raise your voice I'm going to erase your voice"), stop mass deployments for purely partisan reasons, assign agents based on population counts instead of who happens to be governor.

Plenty could be done.

The original name of ICE was the Bureau of Immigration and Customs Enforcement (BICE). The FBI objected to another federal law enforcement agency having “Bureau” in its name so they omitted it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How to we remove overstays and undocumented persons without indiscriminately brutalizing entire populations?

I don’t know, OP. You’re always telling us about how other nations enforce their immigration laws, and they manage to do it without laying siege to entire cities, so how about you ask them? Some even manage to do it without any guns at all!

With all the data and surveillance software ICE has, they could do 99% of their jobs right from their desks, using their tools and some basic brain skills. A couple of on the ground eVerify audits would help too. You could enforce deportation orders if you had enough judges on staff to review cases and issue the orders.

The problem is some very small brained right wingers have equated effectiveness with showing force. Trump’s ICE has been a miserable failure at its stated goal of deporting dangerous criminals. They can’t even get a list to hand over to the local jails saying these are the people we want to deport - they want local officials to do their work for them so they can cosplay as war heroes on the rough streets of…check notes…rural Minnesota.

The other countries either let in nearly everyone, or they haven't let them in in the past, so they don't have much of a population to deal with. We are looking at 15-20 million illegal immigrants in the US.

Your numbers are over every reliable estimate of the number of undocumented persons living in the US. Those numbers of people Biden "allowed into the US"? those numbers came from CBP encounters near the border of people who were removed at the time.

I think there are tough but humane ways you can deal with illegal immigration. You have to attack everything that makes illegal immigration appealing in order to stop it. Address the fundamental root of the problems, and no need for all of the billions of dollars down the drain to employ Nazis, build concentration camps, and tear apart the constitution.

You have to make it unbearable or nearly impossible to live in the US illegally. Once you do that, illegal immigration will stop on its own.


1) Require all employers to prove I9 verification and have e-verify, period. If they cannot match revenue streams and income with an amount of labor that makes sense because they’re hiring illegal immigrants under the table, it should be $100,000 fines for every offense, or jail time if they can’t pay. Enough is enough. E-verify, period.

2) Require legal residency to obtain housing. Every single landlord should be required to obtain proof of legal residency before they are allowed to rent a property to an individual. If they violate the law, seize their property or massive fines.

3) Heavily tax overseas remittances after 2 or 3 transactions, unless legitimate purposes can be verified. Many illegal immigrants earn money in the US to send home and then just return home. Impose steep taxes on remittances that make it almost not worthwhile at all.


4) Prohibit all states from allowing licenses and auto insurance to be obtained for anyone that cannot provide proof of legal residency. Make car ownership also impossible without proof of legal residency. If you make it harder to commute to jobs, it will also thwart motivation for coming to the US illegally.

5) Prohibit enrollment in schools. This one is very controversial and would require constitutional amendments, but if you prevent undocumented individuals from enrolling in our schools, you remove huge motivation for people to come to the US illegally.

6) Prevent anyone without legal residency from being able to open up a bank account or payment apps. Proof of legal residency also needs to be required to cash any checks. If you make it impossible to use the banking system and make it very difficult to obtain money, it is almost impossible to live in the US.

Of course these are rough ideas that need refinement. The point is that you have to make life, very difficult to nearly impossible for anyone who arrives here illegally. Even if they slip through, their life is going to be difficult because the country has built in mechanisms to make life in the US untenable.

Remove all the incentives to come to the US illegally and people stop coming. None of the cruelty is required.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How to we remove overstays and undocumented persons without indiscriminately brutalizing entire populations?

I don’t know, OP. You’re always telling us about how other nations enforce their immigration laws, and they manage to do it without laying siege to entire cities, so how about you ask them? Some even manage to do it without any guns at all!

With all the data and surveillance software ICE has, they could do 99% of their jobs right from their desks, using their tools and some basic brain skills. A couple of on the ground eVerify audits would help too. You could enforce deportation orders if you had enough judges on staff to review cases and issue the orders.

The problem is some very small brained right wingers have equated effectiveness with showing force. Trump’s ICE has been a miserable failure at its stated goal of deporting dangerous criminals. They can’t even get a list to hand over to the local jails saying these are the people we want to deport - they want local officials to do their work for them so they can cosplay as war heroes on the rough streets of…check notes…rural Minnesota.

People have deportation orders and dont leave. the big argument against changing asylum laws is that most dont qualify and are ordered to leave. However, they dont leave, start lives, have kids and your argument to not remove them is that they are "americans".

you HAVE to physically remove people and that will never change.

Also there is only ONE city under "siege". ICE is everywhere but only one state has this going on. thats a symptom of Minnesota's leadership.

not to mention almost all Blue cities/states have decided to not work with ICE at all. so yeah, you have to have a organization that finds and removes people from the country.

The blue states are refusing to do ICE’s job for them, such as holding people longer than the law permits (at local taxpayer expense) so ICE can sit on their butts instead of putting in the work and getting the proper warrants. Local authorities are also refusing to play detective, such as by figuring out the legal status of every soul passed out in the drunk tank.

No blue state will refuse to comply with legal papers. Since having the correct paperwork is so important to ICE, isn’t it reasonable to expect they get their own paperwork right and in their own dime?

this isnt true. blue states refuse to even let ICE know they have someone who has an ICE detainer and let them go free in the streets. its deliberate to never have to expel an illegal out of the country.

This is the weirdest part. If they let ICE get the criminals, then ICE could make their quotas without having to get the regular illegals. Its essentially protecting the criminal element with human shields.

Minnesota already hands over undocumented immigrants to ICE who have committed crimes; they honor ICE detainers. That didn't stop the current Administration from all the wild tactics and the insane rhetoric.

Maybe they did for the most violent convicted offenders. There used to be cooperation for criminals who are already convicted AND for a violent offense but not for suspects, and not for felonies, misdemeanors, and other offenses that are not murder or similar. This gets a ton of offenders back on the streets; embezzlement, harassment, domestic abuse, theft, DUIs, destruction of property, … All not covered. The bar was always high for involving border patrol in many states/counties. Others may have had a lower bar. Some were somewhere in between. Inconsistent procedures throughout the U.S., basically left up to localities.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Didn’t read the whole thread but I have been wondering how prior administrations removed deportees. It seems it was humane?

Lack of media driving outrage cycles. Republican, especially Trump, means maximum outrage over everything. Then it becomes a self-defeating cycle of escalation.

Bingo. And DUH Democrats. There werent cellphone cameras recording everything and organized dark money including Democrat officials (see: Signal Chat) creating chaos via stalking, doxxing, physical attacks and interference. This is all done due to TDS with the goal of attempting to destroy Trump, with the complicity of the legacy media. Anyone with a brain sees this, only DCUM TDS is so drunk on their hatred of Trump they'll disregard law & order, as we saw in 2020.

Just imagine if these same people did the same thing after Obama's Kids in Cages procedure. Surely there were people removed from 2020-2024, and it wasnt done in the dark. You're telling me all of those deportees didnt try to flee or go crying and screaming, and no one saw it? That's because no one was interested in filming, because it didnt fit the narrative.

Bottom line is illegals, particularly the convicted criminal ones will say anything to remain in and get a sob story started, and the media is happy to oblige.

IF Democrats are so OK with the "we agree this should be just the bad one's".....then why are all these Democrat cities refusing to hand over those caught, or those in jail? We're talking really scum of the earthers who are in jail on our dime. NYC has 10-15 thousand of these in jails, that they refuse to allow access to. This is what Democrats defend.

+1

I'll add why is Keith Ellison, the MN AG in that chat list as well as the Lt. Governor of MN being an admin for that Signal chat?

OOPS.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Didn’t read the whole thread but I have been wondering how prior administrations removed deportees. It seems it was humane?

Lack of media driving outrage cycles. Republican, especially Trump, means maximum outrage over everything. Then it becomes a self-defeating cycle of escalation.

Bingo. And DUH Democrats. There werent cellphone cameras recording everything and organized dark money including Democrat officials (see: Signal Chat) creating chaos via stalking, doxxing, physical attacks and interference. This is all done due to TDS with the goal of attempting to destroy Trump, with the complicity of the legacy media. Anyone with a brain sees this, only DCUM TDS is so drunk on their hatred of Trump they'll disregard law & order, as we saw in 2020.

Just imagine if these same people did the same thing after Obama's Kids in Cages procedure. Surely there were people removed from 2020-2024, and it wasnt done in the dark. You're telling me all of those deportees didnt try to flee or go crying and screaming, and no one saw it? That's because no one was interested in filming, because it didnt fit the narrative.

Bottom line is illegals, particularly the convicted criminal ones will say anything to remain in and get a sob story started, and the media is happy to oblige.

IF Democrats are so OK with the "we agree this should be just the bad one's".....then why are all these Democrat cities refusing to hand over those caught, or those in jail? We're talking really scum of the earthers who are in jail on our dime. NYC has 10-15 thousand of these in jails, that they refuse to allow access to. This is what Democrats defend.

Yes. All this.

Anonymous wrote:if ICE cant remove criminals, visa overstays, denied asylum, and court ordered removals, how do you get illegals out of the country.

otherwise its basically open borders.

you are saying once you get here, you dont have to leave

The problem is that “once you get here, you don’t have to leave” has been an accepted mindset throughout our society, immigrants, and both aisles of politics for many, many decades. It is in part due to the legal immigration system already moving at glacial pace, never having been prioritized by any administration, and even if some are turned down years later, they can appeal. There goes another several years. Who will tell families to move after 10 or more years? By that time most families are ‘mixed status’, and have told all their friends, so it continues. Not to mention it has been completely acceptable that the government never actually goes after the big (nor small) employers - nobody has been following our existing rules - because nobody is ever held accountable.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Didn’t read the whole thread but I have been wondering how prior administrations removed deportees. It seems it was humane?

Lack of media driving outrage cycles. Republican, especially Trump, means maximum outrage over everything. Then it becomes a self-defeating cycle of escalation.

Bingo. And DUH Democrats. There werent cellphone cameras recording everything and organized dark money including Democrat officials (see: Signal Chat) creating chaos via stalking, doxxing, physical attacks and interference. This is all done due to TDS with the goal of attempting to destroy Trump, with the complicity of the legacy media. Anyone with a brain sees this, only DCUM TDS is so drunk on their hatred of Trump they'll disregard law & order, as we saw in 2020.

Just imagine if these same people did the same thing after Obama's Kids in Cages procedure. Surely there were people removed from 2020-2024, and it wasnt done in the dark. You're telling me all of those deportees didnt try to flee or go crying and screaming, and no one saw it? That's because no one was interested in filming, because it didnt fit the narrative.

Bottom line is illegals, particularly the convicted criminal ones will say anything to remain in and get a sob story started, and the media is happy to oblige.

IF Democrats are so OK with the "we agree this should be just the bad one's".....then why are all these Democrat cities refusing to hand over those caught, or those in jail? We're talking really scum of the earthers who are in jail on our dime. NYC has 10-15 thousand of these in jails, that they refuse to allow access to. This is what Democrats defend.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Abolish DHS and increase paths to citizenship including amnesty. We need these workers, they are part of our economy, and aren't working under the table. It's these raids and threats of removal that create an underground economy. May have been lip service but we *were* built on the concept of accepting immigrants. Pulling the later up behind you and creating caste system is an old world concept. We need the influx of people.

No too many jobs are being given to immigrants willing to take less money and being paid under the table

BS, they aren't displacing anyone.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if ICE cant remove criminals, visa overstays, denied asylum, and court ordered removals, how do you get illegals out of the country.

otherwise its basically open borders.

you are saying once you get here, you dont have to leave

With proper training and leadership, ICE served a valuable and effective purpose for over 20 years. Add in thousands of poorly trained idiots under terrible leadership and here we are today. New leadership and thinning out the poorly trained idiots is all that is necessary to make a functional entity once again.

Stop with this narrative. They are doing what they were hired for - terrorism. They are the Republicans’ hired thugs- murdering, kidnapping(a five year) and running concentration camps.

It must be horrific in these concentration camps.

Stop with these antics.

The PP is correct, that the biggest issue is many of the new recruits, lacking proper background checks and bad training and done in such an amount of time that the ranks are swelling with these toxic recruits.

Let me point out that two of the shooters recently had 8-10 years experience.

How many years experience did the agent who mooned everyone is Minnesota have....asking for a friend. That was KKKlassy.

Hey- it worked for Melania! She showed everyone her an$$ and now she’s First Lady!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Millions were deported under Obama. If you approach the process with decency then the people won't protest.

Yes and Obama sequestered and deported millions before they were freed by CBP.

Did Mayorkas and Biden do that?

Again, stop with any comparisons of Obama and Biden or Trump. Obama was a good leader and he is still the face of the Dem Party. Biden was a joke and Trump is a disgraceful joke. You all know this is true. The sooner you admit it, the sooner we can unite as a country and move forward together with peace and love. If you're still in denial, find a brain.

Biden is a joke, but he's left us where we are. That's a fact.

Biden wasn't a good leader and shouldn't have been POTUS at his advanced age but at least he had some integrity where as Trump has zero.

this. Biden was a decent human....

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if ICE cant remove criminals, visa overstays, denied asylum, and court ordered removals, how do you get illegals out of the country.

otherwise its basically open borders.

you are saying once you get here, you dont have to leave

With proper training and leadership, ICE served a valuable and effective purpose for over 20 years. Add in thousands of poorly trained idiots under terrible leadership and here we are today. New leadership and thinning out the poorly trained idiots is all that is necessary to make a functional entity once again.

Stop with this narrative. They are doing what they were hired for - terrorism. They are the Republicans’ hired thugs- murdering, kidnapping(a five year) and running concentration camps.

It must be horrific in these concentration camps.

Stop with these antics.

The PP is correct, that the biggest issue is many of the new recruits, lacking proper background checks and bad training and done in such an amount of time that the ranks are swelling with these toxic recruits.

Let me point out that two of the shooters recently had 8-10 years experience.

How many years experience did the agent who mooned everyone is Minnesota have....asking for a friend. That was KKKlassy.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They need to overhaul the legal process. They need to structure it so it is open to all and not just people of higher means. The government needs to stop going after undocumented immigrants and start going after businesses. If you make it impossible to get work here, people will not come. They are coming to improve their lives and the lives of their children. Break the ability to earn money and they won’t come.

i do agree with the businesses, and they never seem to go after them

Start with Mar-a- largo hiring undocumented employees as well as other trump properties m

Anonymous wrote:Abolish DHS and increase paths to citizenship including amnesty. We need these workers, they are part of our economy, and aren't working under the table. It's these raids and threats of removal that create an underground economy. May have been lip service but we *were* built on the concept of accepting immigrants. Pulling the later up behind you and creating caste system is an old world concept. We need the influx of people.

No too many jobs are being given to immigrants willing to take less money and being paid under the table

Abolish DHS and increase paths to citizenship including amnesty. We need these workers, they are part of our economy, and aren't working under the table. It's these raids and threats of removal that create an underground economy. May have been lip service but we *were* built on the concept of accepting immigrants. Pulling the later up behind you and creating caste system is an old world concept. We need the influx of people.