Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They want four years in HS, not just four years. I posted above about my daughter (a senior) taking AP French. This is her fifth year of language and she is only taking it because UVA wouldn’t count her first year which was taken in 8th grade.

To the PP who says colleges get to set their criteria, yes, that’s true. But this rigid foreign language criteria for a public flagship versus a private school is frustrating.

But UVA has to set bright lines. It is a state school with a small (compared to privates) admissions office. As explained above, UVA wants to see those kids who can tough it out even in a course they don't like and still get an A because that demonstrates a love of learning or grit. Those are the students who will succeed at UVA. Also UVA sees itself as training citizens of the world (like Jefferson) who will increasingly need to communicate in many languages in order to succeed in a future business and social world dominated less by English (hint!! Take Chinese! now! Get fluent!)

+1. To the point about UVA needing to set firm guidelines because it us a public school with relatively fewer dollars spent on atteacting and selecting students, note that UVA received almost 60,000 applicatioms last year for only 4,400 seats. It takes money to process that many applications so priorities must be set. All of the top flagship publics have rules, guidelines, cut-offs, etc to help them balance out in-state from OOS, URM (yes they are still doing that to get around the scotus decision), full freight vs scholarship, whatever Asian-American goals/limits it wants to reach, and so in, so that the University can arrive at 4,400 students fitting all of its goals. Not an easy task.

But this isn’t a firm line. UVA takes tons of kids OOS and from urban and rural Virginia without four years of language in high school/AP language. It’s only a few high schools in NOVA where kids have to meet this standard.

Are those urban and rural kids in the same majors as the high achievers, or is all this fuss a proxy for elite academic majors vs trade majors?

Anonymous wrote:

Intellectually curious kids chomp at the bit to take the hard courses—they love it. Those are the kids these schools want and those are who they get(for unhooked at least).

The kids who chomp at the bit to take the hardest courses are the boring grinds, and schools use “holistic admissions” exactly in order to limit the number of these kids they accept.

Intellectually curious kids are more often interested in one or two subjects, they don’t want to have to endure “hardest courses in all five” - and many correctly regard FL as a big waste of time and effort.

One mom's boring grid is another mom's intellectual powerhouse Renaissance scholar.

Anonymous wrote:I agree to model is outdated. My son made it to Spanish 4 in 10th grade.


This year he’s taking Physics C, MV Cal, AP Research. He’s only taking Honors English one of the easier AP SS.

If that’s not rigorous enough for some schools oh well. I know he’ll be well prepared for his major in engineering and that’s most important to us.

UVA AO says that you are supposed to diversify and not focus on a major in high school, but also you need to apply to the competitive Eng school if your want to get in. Admissions is a farce. The policies are intentionally contradictory so they can admit based on their whims.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't it be nice if counselors asked your child where they want to go in 9th grade and helped them get there? So frustrating that they get to senior year and they are like oh sorry, you didn't take a foreign language senior year so it's not an option for you.

Many schools tell the students and parents in 9th grade and again in 10th to pay attention to what schools want, and specifically recommend taking all 5 core areas every year especially if they want UVA and better. On top of that they encourage the best students to take the hardest level of each, and encourage students who are bright but not top to “right size” the rigor. We have experience going through a test-in public magnet and a private school. The top kids were steered correctly at both. There were some middle of the pack kids not pushed whose parents were surprised Uva was off the table end of junior year. They were not paying attention to the trajectory their kid was on, and did not understand the level of rigor that was “above average”(5-6 APs with DE too, not maxed in all core subjects) versus top (10-12 no DE other than vector calc). The key is to know the kod you have and understand where they are in the context of the school.

Name two.

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't it be nice if counselors asked your child where they want to go in 9th grade and helped them get there? So frustrating that they get to senior year and they are like oh sorry, you didn't take a foreign language senior year so it's not an option for you.

Many schools tell the students and parents in 9th grade and again in 10th to pay attention to what schools want, and specifically recommend taking all 5 core areas every year especially if they want UVA and better. On top of that they encourage the best students to take the hardest level of each, and encourage students who are bright but not top to “right size” the rigor. We have experience going through a test-in public magnet and a private school. The top kids were steered correctly at both. There were some middle of the pack kids not pushed whose parents were surprised Uva was off the table end of junior year. They were not paying attention to the trajectory their kid was on, and did not understand the level of rigor that was “above average”(5-6 APs with DE too, not maxed in all core subjects) versus top (10-12 no DE other than vector calc). The key is to know the kod you have and understand where they are in the context of the school.

Wouldn't it be nice if counselors asked your child where they want to go in 9th grade and helped them get there? So frustrating that they get to senior year and they are like oh sorry, you didn't take a foreign language senior year so it's not an option for you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They want four years in HS, not just four years. I posted above about my daughter (a senior) taking AP French. This is her fifth year of language and she is only taking it because UVA wouldn’t count her first year which was taken in 8th grade.

To the PP who says colleges get to set their criteria, yes, that’s true. But this rigid foreign language criteria for a public flagship versus a private school is frustrating.

My daughter took four years, starting in 8th grade. Finished after junior year. And somehow UVA still accepted her.

Interesting. When was she accepted? UVA has been very clear recently that they want four years of language in HS.

I do not think it's true as I know someone admitted recently with only 3 years.

Anonymous wrote:Bright line rules are welcome in an admissions world of great uncertainty.

In addition, as a public flagship, accessibility is important. As demonstrated by numerous posts, I think the statement by the AO that the OP heard was a stretch of the truth, so much so that to say one must have AP foreign lang for admission to UVA - as a brightline rule - is an outright lie.

It is likely a recommendation rather than a requirement, as is the case with most top schools.

Holistic means they can accept whoever they want for whatever reason they want.

UVA isn’t a flagship, there is no UVA system like UNC. There are many other public colleges and universities in VA that focus on accessibility. Accessibility isn’t UVA’s mission or mandate.

The CAS at UVA requires 2 years of a foreign language to graduate (can test out). So be aware of that for kids who don’t like languages. They don’t offer introductory spanish, so cant pick that up to start. Italian is another language kids like to take if want to switch in college, but those classes are very hard to get into.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, duh. How is this surprising?

+2 This is their mantra. How are you surprised, OP? Reach the AP level in all 5 core subjects. The real question is whether they care if you take AB Calc vs. BC Calc or APES vs. AP Biology. Do they “rank” the APs by rigor?

Not OP, but I wouldn’t consider Foreign Language to be a core subject. I should mention that my daughter is currently at UVA after taking four years of a FL and my nephew who only took three years of Spanish was accepted to UVA (10 years ago)

It doesn’t matter what you consider a core subject, it matters what UVA a core subject. Also, UVA is one of many top schools that expects 4 years of world language. It is the norm.

+1. This doesn’t seem like the hill to die on.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They want four years in HS, not just four years. I posted above about my daughter (a senior) taking AP French. This is her fifth year of language and she is only taking it because UVA wouldn’t count her first year which was taken in 8th grade.

To the PP who says colleges get to set their criteria, yes, that’s true. But this rigid foreign language criteria for a public flagship versus a private school is frustrating.

My daughter took four years, starting in 8th grade. Finished after junior year. And somehow UVA still accepted her.

Interesting. When was she accepted? UVA has been very clear recently that they want four years of language in HS.

The details of the transcript are reviewed for rigor, but the designation for a given applicant seems to be a big-picture one.

My kid is at a T10 with only 3 years of foreign language - thru Spanish 3 - and no DE/AP English. He did have multiple social studies APs with 5s (he can write), had multivariable calc and is a STEM major. I doubt his counselor checked the most rigorous box, though I never asked.

If UVA wanted, they could indicate on their admissions site that APs in all five core subject areas are required. That would also cut in half their application numbers overnight. The website does not state this.

The website states:

1. Take the best program available to you in your core subjects.
Make sure that your class schedule demonstrates that you are taking advantage of all that your school offers. Talk to your counselor and parents to help determine the right program for you. Colleges will want to see that you are pursuing a strong schedule, but they will also want to see good grades.

What do we mean by the core subjects? Those are English, math, foreign language, social studies, and science.

https://admission.virginia.edu/i-am/high-school-student

From DeanJ's instagram, albeit a few years ago, 10th slide in the post https://www.instagram.com/s/aGlnaGxpZ2h0OjE3ODU3MjE4NzgyMjA1ODE3?igshid=krlux6ebg4wg&story_media_id=2410571039632223712

"To summarize:

1. There is no foreign language requirement for admission to UVA"

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:UVA is not the be all, end all. Hell my kid had the stats two years ago but was waitlisted. Loving his OOS flagship. Couldn't imagine attending anywhere else. Plus they whopped the Cavs butt in football on national TV this year.

I'm sure the dopamine hit you recieved from this post was fun. Completely off-topic and gratuitous. Look at the rest of your schedule... enjoy your 3 wins turtle.

Cute dopamine comment. Not off topic. Posters concerned about acceptance to UVA based on HS course selection. Take what you want. Plenty of options.

Bright line rules are welcome in an admissions world of great uncertainty.

In addition, as a public flagship, accessibility is important. As demonstrated by numerous posts, I think the statement by the AO that the OP heard was a stretch of the truth, so much so that to say one must have AP foreign lang for admission to UVA - as a brightline rule - is an outright lie.

It is likely a recommendation rather than a requirement, as is the case with most top schools.

Holistic means they can accept whoever they want for whatever reason they want.

Anonymous wrote:"Our admissions process at UVa is a holistic one."

Translation: we'll do whatever the heck we want and change the rules whenever we see fit to do so."

There is good reason it is so vague.

In the wake of the recent Supreme Court decision striking down race-based college admissions, how else is UVA supposed to preserve racial diversity and equity?