Anonymous
05/27/2024 22:48
Subject: Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Black dies after a second generation of mixing (see Archie).
It would not surprise me if there were some black nobility in London that intermixed with white although probably not to the extent referenced on these shows . Moors lived throughout Europe. There’s a rumor Mozart is black or part black.
Lot of black slaveowners too but these things are Hidden history. There was a black colonial army here in the US that helped the Brits in exchange for freedom and travel to London or Canada , and I think that the boxer Will Mondrichs story shortly referenced that during a Bridgerton episode.
It would not surprise me if there were some black nobility in London that intermixed with white although probably not to the extent referenced on these shows . Moors lived throughout Europe. There’s a rumor Mozart is black or part black.
Lot of black slaveowners too but these things are Hidden history. There was a black colonial army here in the US that helped the Brits in exchange for freedom and travel to London or Canada , and I think that the boxer Will Mondrichs story shortly referenced that during a Bridgerton episode.
Anonymous
05/27/2024 18:23
Subject: Re:Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is that where they make up a fake black ancestry for Charlotte to make the woke people happy?
What are you babbling about? It's fiction.
King George III and his wife Queen Charlotte are real people. Charlotte was a German princess with a thoroughly German ancestry. For some reason she is black in Bridgerton.
Just wait until you find out that there wasn’t really a Lady Whistledown.
I know it's fiction but I find the concept weird. Taking real people and changing their racial heritages to portray a world that never existed and, in real life, was highly racist and classist.
It's wish fulfillment. It's like Disney creating an animated feature with Tiana.
Maybe it's a hopeful sign that we are becoming less prejudiced and more multicultural in our entertainments.
From the interviews I've read, the actors and actresses appreciate their Bridgerton parts and enjoy getting the opportunity to be in leading roles.
I also enjoy the Regency-fication of the modern pop songs.
Anonymous
05/27/2024 17:47
Subject: Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Just binged the series today, and I have to say it was a million times better than any of the other Bridgerton series.
Why?
Because the actors are talented and they have a compelling love story that unfolds and grows. The ancillary stories with Lady Danbury and the two butlers are also interesting.
But it’s the talented leads and their beautifully unfolding love story that kept my attention and had me in tears in the closing scene.
Why?
Because the actors are talented and they have a compelling love story that unfolds and grows. The ancillary stories with Lady Danbury and the two butlers are also interesting.
But it’s the talented leads and their beautifully unfolding love story that kept my attention and had me in tears in the closing scene.
Anonymous
09/27/2023 11:39
Subject: Re:Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is that where they make up a fake black ancestry for Charlotte to make the woke people happy?
What are you babbling about? It's fiction.
King George III and his wife Queen Charlotte are real people. Charlotte was a German princess with a thoroughly German ancestry. For some reason she is black in Bridgerton.
You’re so ignorant. For some reason? We aren’t in the 1960s anymore John or Karen. Many folks wouldn’t be watching this if there were only pasty white people playing the parts. It’s far more interesting this way whether you like it or not. The writer is so influential (she makes networks lots of money) that she can write and cast however she wants.
"Pasty white people"????
I agree with the PP... somehow I doubt that you would support a show where white people played the part of African leaders (and please don't bring up Cleopatra; who is widely believed to be Greek Macedonian and the DNA in Egyptian mummies so far has been Semitic, not sub-Saharan.) This new trend only goes one way... POC can play any white character (not only "can," but it is lauded), while movies and shows are cancelled if white people portray any other race. Yes, Europeans and European Americans have cultures and yes, they can be proud of those cultures, and there is nothing boring or "pasty" about that. Although I think acting is called acting and believe that anyone can take on a role, if you won't accept that, then white people should be playing white people.
NP.
The difference is that white people have oppressed and excluded POC (and women) in the performing arts for centuries.
So it’s not equivalent at all.
People who post garbage like the above also complain about why there are Black or Women’s student societies or professional organizations but nothing for White Men. Ummm because whole world belongs to White Men!
I support any initiative that gets more roles for POC actors. Whether that is making high-quality productions about long ago Africa, India, China. Or stories about long-ago Europe but with Hamilton/Bridgerton type of diverse casting. I don’t even need an explanation of why certain people are a certain race. The recent Persuasion movie did diverse casting and didn’t bother to explain. I disliked aspects of that movie but I liked that.
It's called fake history. Yes, it is fake to show a diverse cast for an Austen production.
I'm sure you wouldn't be saying the same thing if we had a diverse cast playing an African village or Zulu warriors, eh? Come on, 'fess up. Not the same thing, right? Eh?
It's fiction. Not a documentary. You're gonna be ok, I promise.
And if you don't understand the power imbalance and lack of representation in entertainment and why your example would NOT fly (nor should it) now, then there's not a reasonable conversation to be had. Go back and look at all of the white people who HAVE played non-white characters, and the use of blackface in entertainment. Maybe that will make you a little less ignorant.
Anonymous
09/27/2023 11:09
Subject: Re:Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is that where they make up a fake black ancestry for Charlotte to make the woke people happy?
What are you babbling about? It's fiction.
King George III and his wife Queen Charlotte are real people. Charlotte was a German princess with a thoroughly German ancestry. For some reason she is black in Bridgerton.
You’re so ignorant. For some reason? We aren’t in the 1960s anymore John or Karen. Many folks wouldn’t be watching this if there were only pasty white people playing the parts. It’s far more interesting this way whether you like it or not. The writer is so influential (she makes networks lots of money) that she can write and cast however she wants.
"Pasty white people"????
I agree with the PP... somehow I doubt that you would support a show where white people played the part of African leaders (and please don't bring up Cleopatra; who is widely believed to be Greek Macedonian and the DNA in Egyptian mummies so far has been Semitic, not sub-Saharan.) This new trend only goes one way... POC can play any white character (not only "can," but it is lauded), while movies and shows are cancelled if white people portray any other race. Yes, Europeans and European Americans have cultures and yes, they can be proud of those cultures, and there is nothing boring or "pasty" about that. Although I think acting is called acting and believe that anyone can take on a role, if you won't accept that, then white people should be playing white people.
NP.
The difference is that white people have oppressed and excluded POC (and women) in the performing arts for centuries.
So it’s not equivalent at all.
People who post garbage like the above also complain about why there are Black or Women’s student societies or professional organizations but nothing for White Men. Ummm because whole world belongs to White Men!
I support any initiative that gets more roles for POC actors. Whether that is making high-quality productions about long ago Africa, India, China. Or stories about long-ago Europe but with Hamilton/Bridgerton type of diverse casting. I don’t even need an explanation of why certain people are a certain race. The recent Persuasion movie did diverse casting and didn’t bother to explain. I disliked aspects of that movie but I liked that.
It's called fake history. Yes, it is fake to show a diverse cast for an Austen production.
I'm sure you wouldn't be saying the same thing if we had a diverse cast playing an African village or Zulu warriors, eh? Come on, 'fess up. Not the same thing, right? Eh?
It's actually pretty accurate.
Anonymous
09/26/2023 21:21
Subject: Re:Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is that where they make up a fake black ancestry for Charlotte to make the woke people happy?
What are you babbling about? It's fiction.
King George III and his wife Queen Charlotte are real people. Charlotte was a German princess with a thoroughly German ancestry. For some reason she is black in Bridgerton.
You’re so ignorant. For some reason? We aren’t in the 1960s anymore John or Karen. Many folks wouldn’t be watching this if there were only pasty white people playing the parts. It’s far more interesting this way whether you like it or not. The writer is so influential (she makes networks lots of money) that she can write and cast however she wants.
"Pasty white people"????
I agree with the PP... somehow I doubt that you would support a show where white people played the part of African leaders (and please don't bring up Cleopatra; who is widely believed to be Greek Macedonian and the DNA in Egyptian mummies so far has been Semitic, not sub-Saharan.) This new trend only goes one way... POC can play any white character (not only "can," but it is lauded), while movies and shows are cancelled if white people portray any other race. Yes, Europeans and European Americans have cultures and yes, they can be proud of those cultures, and there is nothing boring or "pasty" about that. Although I think acting is called acting and believe that anyone can take on a role, if you won't accept that, then white people should be playing white people.
NP.
The difference is that white people have oppressed and excluded POC (and women) in the performing arts for centuries.
So it’s not equivalent at all.
People who post garbage like the above also complain about why there are Black or Women’s student societies or professional organizations but nothing for White Men. Ummm because whole world belongs to White Men!
I support any initiative that gets more roles for POC actors. Whether that is making high-quality productions about long ago Africa, India, China. Or stories about long-ago Europe but with Hamilton/Bridgerton type of diverse casting. I don’t even need an explanation of why certain people are a certain race. The recent Persuasion movie did diverse casting and didn’t bother to explain. I disliked aspects of that movie but I liked that.
It's called fake history. Yes, it is fake to show a diverse cast for an Austen production.
I'm sure you wouldn't be saying the same thing if we had a diverse cast playing an African village or Zulu warriors, eh? Come on, 'fess up. Not the same thing, right? Eh?
Anonymous
09/26/2023 21:20
Subject: Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Anonymous wrote:On the whole debate about black people in old English stuff…. I just listened to a totally interesting pod cast talking about how with modern dna and isotope studies they are finding that historic England was much more diverse than they realized. There is a ship they excavated that sank with Henry viii’s most trusted and high ranking military guard, the Merry Rose. Of the 8 people that they’ve analyzed, 2 have African ancestry. One appeared to be a deck boy based on age and where they found him, but the other was a. Archer, which was a high status job—found him with the archers band still on his skeletal arm and his quiver next to him. There was another historian that did extensive work on Tudor baptismal records and found people of African ancestry through Britain. They traced one down the ancestral line and found all his white great great (x whatever) children living in this little British town with no idea that they had African ancestry 4 centuries ago. It was really interesting. They made the point that back then race was not as big a deal — religion was the main demarcater so if you had a North African emigre who converted to Christianity it was NBD for your daughter to marry him.
This is a very political topic and controversial among historians. Some progressive people want to promote a much more "diverse" history for Britain because of today's more diverse population. But frankly, no matter how you spin it, the numbers of non-whites in Britain were always so incredibly small. They did exist in the few instances you referred to, but the entirety of British written legacy makes it extremely clear it was a 99.99% white country outside of a few ex slaves or traders, or in the 19th century, students from the colonies. The 1940 census showed less than 40,000 non whites out of 40 million people, just to give you an idea of how rare non whites were throughout British history till the 1950s immigration from Jamaica. A few traders in Tudor London does not make for a diverse population.
Anonymous
09/26/2023 20:26
Subject: Re:Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is that where they make up a fake black ancestry for Charlotte to make the woke people happy?
What are you babbling about? It's fiction.
King George III and his wife Queen Charlotte are real people. Charlotte was a German princess with a thoroughly German ancestry. For some reason she is black in Bridgerton.
You’re so ignorant. For some reason? We aren’t in the 1960s anymore John or Karen. Many folks wouldn’t be watching this if there were only pasty white people playing the parts. It’s far more interesting this way whether you like it or not. The writer is so influential (she makes networks lots of money) that she can write and cast however she wants.
"Pasty white people"????
I agree with the PP... somehow I doubt that you would support a show where white people played the part of African leaders (and please don't bring up Cleopatra; who is widely believed to be Greek Macedonian and the DNA in Egyptian mummies so far has been Semitic, not sub-Saharan.) This new trend only goes one way... POC can play any white character (not only "can," but it is lauded), while movies and shows are cancelled if white people portray any other race. Yes, Europeans and European Americans have cultures and yes, they can be proud of those cultures, and there is nothing boring or "pasty" about that. Although I think acting is called acting and believe that anyone can take on a role, if you won't accept that, then white people should be playing white people.
NP.
The difference is that white people have oppressed and excluded POC (and women) in the performing arts for centuries.
So it’s not equivalent at all.
People who post garbage like the above also complain about why there are Black or Women’s student societies or professional organizations but nothing for White Men. Ummm because whole world belongs to White Men!
I support any initiative that gets more roles for POC actors. Whether that is making high-quality productions about long ago Africa, India, China. Or stories about long-ago Europe but with Hamilton/Bridgerton type of diverse casting. I don’t even need an explanation of why certain people are a certain race. The recent Persuasion movie did diverse casting and didn’t bother to explain. I disliked aspects of that movie but I liked that.
Anonymous
09/14/2023 22:30
Subject: Re:Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Thanks for this post, OP! I didn't feel like watching it bc Season 2 was so boring I couldn't finish it (after devouring Season 1). Now that so many PPs enjoyed it, I'm going to check it out!
Anonymous
09/14/2023 21:22
Subject: Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Late to the Queen Charlotte party, but just watched. Loved it! I liked it better than the regular Bridgerton's.
Brimsely dancing, sob! I hope there's a sequel to fill in more of the gaps in their timeline. I googled to find out what happened to Reynolds and found this article:
https://www.netflix.com/tudum/articles/queen-charlotte-finale-ending-explained
The king and queen under the bed... More tears.
I do want more explanation about how she got so brusque with her silly children demanding an heir. She was so bothered by just being thought of as a womb, I would have thought she would try to evolve the monarchy beyond that.
Brimsely dancing, sob! I hope there's a sequel to fill in more of the gaps in their timeline. I googled to find out what happened to Reynolds and found this article:
https://www.netflix.com/tudum/articles/queen-charlotte-finale-ending-explained
The king and queen under the bed... More tears.
I do want more explanation about how she got so brusque with her silly children demanding an heir. She was so bothered by just being thought of as a womb, I would have thought she would try to evolve the monarchy beyond that.
Anonymous
06/01/2023 14:47
Subject: Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Anonymous wrote:On the whole debate about black people in old English stuff…. I just listened to a totally interesting pod cast talking about how with modern dna and isotope studies they are finding that historic England was much more diverse than they realized. There is a ship they excavated that sank with Henry viii’s most trusted and high ranking military guard, the Merry Rose. Of the 8 people that they’ve analyzed, 2 have African ancestry. One appeared to be a deck boy based on age and where they found him, but the other was a. Archer, which was a high status job—found him with the archers band still on his skeletal arm and his quiver next to him. There was another historian that did extensive work on Tudor baptismal records and found people of African ancestry through Britain. They traced one down the ancestral line and found all his white great great (x whatever) children living in this little British town with no idea that they had African ancestry 4 centuries ago. It was really interesting. They made the point that back then race was not as big a deal — religion was the main demarcater so if you had a North African emigre who converted to Christianity it was NBD for your daughter to marry him.
Everything you described sounds very plausible, except for the eliding of North Africans and sub-Saharan Africans. North Africa is itself a diverse place, but its people are part of the Mediterranean world in every sense. They are generally not "Black." Not that there's anything wrong with that, and it is in fact documented that there were Black people in Early Modern England (though the argument that Queen Charlotte is one of them rests on a single Medieval North African ancestor that I think might even be more mythical than documented).
Anonymous
06/01/2023 13:46
Subject: Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
The saddest part was the last scene with Charlotte and her son Edward. Charlotte died in November 1818 and the heir, Victoria, was born in May 1819. Did she die not knowing there would be an heir? Would she have speculated that Edwards wife Victoria could die in childbirth, such as her granddaughter Charlotte did?
Anonymous
05/27/2023 18:58
Subject: Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
On the whole debate about black people in old English stuff…. I just listened to a totally interesting pod cast talking about how with modern dna and isotope studies they are finding that historic England was much more diverse than they realized. There is a ship they excavated that sank with Henry viii’s most trusted and high ranking military guard, the Merry Rose. Of the 8 people that they’ve analyzed, 2 have African ancestry. One appeared to be a deck boy based on age and where they found him, but the other was a. Archer, which was a high status job—found him with the archers band still on his skeletal arm and his quiver next to him. There was another historian that did extensive work on Tudor baptismal records and found people of African ancestry through Britain. They traced one down the ancestral line and found all his white great great (x whatever) children living in this little British town with no idea that they had African ancestry 4 centuries ago. It was really interesting. They made the point that back then race was not as big a deal — religion was the main demarcater so if you had a North African emigre who converted to Christianity it was NBD for your daughter to marry him.
Anonymous
05/27/2023 18:25
Subject: Re:Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is that where they make up a fake black ancestry for Charlotte to make the woke people happy?
What are you babbling about? It's fiction.
King George III and his wife Queen Charlotte are real people. Charlotte was a German princess with a thoroughly German ancestry. For some reason she is black in Bridgerton.
You’re so ignorant. For some reason? We aren’t in the 1960s anymore John or Karen. Many folks wouldn’t be watching this if there were only pasty white people playing the parts. It’s far more interesting this way whether you like it or not. The writer is so influential (she makes networks lots of money) that she can write and cast however she wants.
"Pasty white people"????
I agree with the PP... somehow I doubt that you would support a show where white people played the part of African leaders (and please don't bring up Cleopatra; who is widely believed to be Greek Macedonian and the DNA in Egyptian mummies so far has been Semitic, not sub-Saharan.) This new trend only goes one way... POC can play any white character (not only "can," but it is lauded), while movies and shows are cancelled if white people portray any other race. Yes, Europeans and European Americans have cultures and yes, they can be proud of those cultures, and there is nothing boring or "pasty" about that. Although I think acting is called acting and believe that anyone can take on a role, if you won't accept that, then white people should be playing white people.
Stop whining. It’s annoying.
Anonymous
05/27/2023 03:17
Subject: Re:Queen Charlotte: A Bridgerton Story
Random trivia: the bust statue that Charlotte knocks over in the first scene. Would such a statue be hollow in real life?