Anonymous
Post 01/01/2023 23:29     Subject: Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
Anonymous wrote:Growing up my family was poor. When I was in college I began to notice certain behavior that could fall into the "not our kind dear".
At a social gathering where we met a director of a medical school, my younger siblings began pointing at various athletic sprains they'd experienced in their legs and seeking free medical advice.
My boyfriend's mother sent us a big box of Godiva chocolates. It was consumed by two of my sisters in one afternoon. It was as if they were afraid anyone else in the family would eat the pieces before they got to it. It was a big box. In my office this box would last a full day amongst 30 employees.
My husband, children and I showed up at my parents one holiday. It was a long drive, my siblings were already there to meet us. All the seats in the living room were filled, there was no place for us to sit. That wasn't so much the issue as the fact that no one stood up to say hello. Everyone stayed parked in their seat and stared at us. As if they were afraud to lose their place. Only my mother got up to give one of the 4 of my family a place to sit. I was very embarassed for my husband - he never said anything but I know he found it ungracious.

I don't really know what this sort of behavior is called but I've thought about it. There's another thread on here about subtle signs of class and I think these are the opposite but I don't know how to sum it with a phrase like that.


You're not your family's kind dear. Really is this about a box of Godiva?
Anonymous
Post 01/01/2023 20:46     Subject: Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
Anonymous wrote:Scarcity mindset. And it’s the natural consequence of poverty, not something to look down your nose at them about. You sound really unpleasant.


DP. My husband was one of five kids. They weren't poor, but at mealtimes you would think they had never been fed. To this day, there's literally no thought for leaving some food behind if others haven't gotten a helping yet. And they all struggle with their weight. Wonder why?

It plays out in other interactions as well. Lots of pitting one against the other in order to be in their mother's good graces. I related a recent anecdote to an acquaintance the other day and she responded, "How toxic!" and I realized that I've become used to the dynamic, and not in a good way.
Anonymous
Post 01/01/2023 12:42     Subject: Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
I think OP is a troll. Since when are toddlers more comfortable on a seat than the floor?
Anonymous
Post 01/01/2023 11:55     Subject: Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Yes. Sir terry pratchett and the boots.


Thank you to the pp who first mentioned the boots a few posts up. And for the link you provided. Very interesting stuff. It breaks it down well.


The boots are a perfect example, because when somethings on sale, we feel like we're getting a great deal or we're being savvy shoppers... when in actuality, the store probably didn't sell when it first hit the shelves/racks, and the store in now just trying to rid themselves of the merchandise that the actual savvy shopper knew not to buy the first time around.
Even on sale it's probably not worth the money / probably garbage.

Here's the "Boots theory of socioeconomic unfairness" by Terry Pratchett:

"The reason that the rich were so rich, Vimes reasoned, was because they managed to spend less money. Take boots, for example. He earned thirty-eight dollars a month plus allowances. A really good pair of leather boots cost fifty dollars. But an affordable pair of boots, which were sort of OK for a season or two and then leaked like hell when the cardboard gave out, cost about ten dollars. Those were the kind of boots Vimes always bought, and wore until the soles were so thin that he could tell where he was in Ankh-Morpork on a foggy night by the feel of the cobbles. But the thing was that good boots lasted for years and years. A man who could afford fifty dollars had a pair of boots that'd still be keeping his feet dry in ten years' time, while a poor man who could only afford cheap boots would have spent a hundred dollars on boots in the same time and would still have wet feet.
This was the Captain Samuel Vimes "Boots" theory of socioeconomic unfairness.


With the rise of fast fashion, I don’t think this is such a good barometer of scarcity complex as much as hyper consumerism. Think SHEIN.
Anonymous
Post 01/01/2023 08:10     Subject: Re:Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
Anonymous wrote:I think the OP is a troll. She keeps changing the story of who provided the box of chocolates…said it was her boyfriend’s mother and her Obgyn…


I caught that too unless her boyfriends mom is her obgyn. Awkward.
Anonymous
Post 01/01/2023 03:53     Subject: Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
Anonymous wrote:Yes. Sir terry pratchett and the boots.


Thank you to the pp who first mentioned the boots a few posts up. And for the link you provided. Very interesting stuff. It breaks it down well.


The boots are a perfect example, because when somethings on sale, we feel like we're getting a great deal or we're being savvy shoppers... when in actuality, the store probably didn't sell when it first hit the shelves/racks, and the store in now just trying to rid themselves of the merchandise that the actual savvy shopper knew not to buy the first time around.
Even on sale it's probably not worth the money / probably garbage.

Here's the "Boots theory of socioeconomic unfairness" by Terry Pratchett:

"The reason that the rich were so rich, Vimes reasoned, was because they managed to spend less money. Take boots, for example. He earned thirty-eight dollars a month plus allowances. A really good pair of leather boots cost fifty dollars. But an affordable pair of boots, which were sort of OK for a season or two and then leaked like hell when the cardboard gave out, cost about ten dollars. Those were the kind of boots Vimes always bought, and wore until the soles were so thin that he could tell where he was in Ankh-Morpork on a foggy night by the feel of the cobbles. But the thing was that good boots lasted for years and years. A man who could afford fifty dollars had a pair of boots that'd still be keeping his feet dry in ten years' time, while a poor man who could only afford cheap boots would have spent a hundred dollars on boots in the same time and would still have wet feet.
This was the Captain Samuel Vimes "Boots" theory of socioeconomic unfairness.
Anonymous
Post 01/01/2023 03:06     Subject: Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Scarcity mindset. And it’s the natural consequence of poverty, not something to look down your nose at them about. You sound really unpleasant.


NP. Thank you for identifying this so succinctly, and for noting the problem in the prior post.

There is something deeply unpleasant, moreso than anything described there, in looking down on people who still carry the with the residue of trauma and pain.

Those of us who managed to wash it off, or not be splashed with it despite the circumstances we stood in, have so much to be grateful for. And gratitude does not come with sneering at those who have less.


What unmitigated crap. Everyone has the ability to learn how to be decent to others and the behavior was rude. I grew up poor in a poor area and people knew how to act. The boors I've met are all from the north. Every one of them. It doesn't matter how much or little $ they have, they are all almost entirely rude and lacking manners.


The OP lacks manners and this post is boorish af.

I’m from the Midwest and in my experience, Southerners are very concerned with social graces and so they have manners but are not actually nicer or more decent people than the boorish midwesterners who don’t dress up or get excited about Thanksgiving or whatever. The manners exist but they are essentially a facade a lot of the time.


Duuuuuh. Manners are a facade to make it easier for people to get along. How do you not realize that?
Anonymous
Post 01/01/2023 02:23     Subject: Re:Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
I think the OP is a troll. She keeps changing the story of who provided the box of chocolates…said it was her boyfriend’s mother and her Obgyn…
Anonymous
Post 12/31/2022 21:40     Subject: Re:Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Clear this up for me, why should someone else stand or sit on the floor so that you can have their chair? Are you elderly, handicapped, pregnant? Or is it just that you are rich and therefore more important?

So you just remain seated and stare at your guests? Interesting.


Are family guests? I would never ever expect my parents to give up their seats for me or my partner/kids!


Chairs go by age and infirmity. I would never expect an older and more ill person to get up for me.


Chairs are… something you have enough of for the number of guests you have? Even if that means bringing folding plastic chairs out or using ottomans as chairs. You don’t just do nothing though.


Kids sit on the floor.


Kids sit on dog beds


Yes! You win the thread.

I’m really confused though by OP thinking her parents and siblings should sit on the floor so she and her kids can have a chair. And monitoring how fast a box of chocolates was eaten by your obgyn is SO WEIRD.

This whole thread is weird. But you still win!


OP here - I'm not sure I thought my siblings should sit on the floor but considering they live in the area (and one of them actually lived at home still), my toddlers may have appreciated a place to sit down as a guest.
I didn't actively monitor the box of chocolaes - I was at home too and was surprised that my mother didn't even get a chance to sample any. I mention my OBGYN because she told me in a thank you note and for reference for how much there was in the box. Seriously, eating that amount of chocolate in such a short duration would make me gag. I mean, you don't even taste it anymore at that rate.


You think adults should sit on the floor so your toddlers can have a seat?! Consider that good manners include respecting your elders, and teach your kids that, OP.
Anonymous
Post 12/31/2022 21:10     Subject: Re:Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
OP, your contempt for your family of origin shines clearly through your comments. You seem quite detached from them as if you were never born to your poor parents.

Why are you still begrudging your own sisters some premium chocolate that they never had before while you could afford to buy a large box of it for an OB’s office? If you were considerate and generous, you’d also buy each of your sisters their own smaller box and buy one for your mother too, so no one has to share. Buy one for yourself, too, so you don’t have to hope that someone else will share theirs with you.

And since it seems you’ve forgotten about their lot in life, your parents probably could use a little help. They may not want to ask anything of you, but you can still buy and ship them some folding chairs so when they have guests, they’ll have enough chairs for everyone, including you and your entire new family. Toddlers are quite comfortable and content to sit on the floor as long as they have something to play with. Or they can sit in a family member’s lap.
Anonymous
Post 12/31/2022 19:59     Subject: Re:Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Clear this up for me, why should someone else stand or sit on the floor so that you can have their chair? Are you elderly, handicapped, pregnant? Or is it just that you are rich and therefore more important?

So you just remain seated and stare at your guests? Interesting.


Are family guests? I would never ever expect my parents to give up their seats for me or my partner/kids!


Chairs go by age and infirmity. I would never expect an older and more ill person to get up for me.


Chairs are… something you have enough of for the number of guests you have? Even if that means bringing folding plastic chairs out or using ottomans as chairs. You don’t just do nothing though.


Kids sit on the floor.


Kids sit on dog beds


Yes! You win the thread.

I’m really confused though by OP thinking her parents and siblings should sit on the floor so she and her kids can have a chair. And monitoring how fast a box of chocolates was eaten by your obgyn is SO WEIRD.

This whole thread is weird. But you still win!


OP here - I'm not sure I thought my siblings should sit on the floor but considering they live in the area (and one of them actually lived at home still), my toddlers may have appreciated a place to sit down as a guest.
I didn't actively monitor the box of chocolaes - I was at home too and was surprised that my mother didn't even get a chance to sample any. I mention my OBGYN because she told me in a thank you note and for reference for how much there was in the box. Seriously, eating that amount of chocolate in such a short duration would make me gag. I mean, you don't even taste it anymore at that rate.
Anonymous
Post 12/31/2022 19:43     Subject: Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
I really think there’s a balance between making boors feel comfortable and shaming/teaching them. Everyone knows the story of the finger bowls or whatever because it was publicized and presumably, even though they were made comfortable at the time, the transgressor learned a lesson.

Right now, transgressors of just basic decency are not even aware, never mind shamed or ostracized or shunned. We need a sway in the other direction before we can all be genteel again. There are too many ignorants and not enough teachers. We need to tip that balance. Sternly.
Anonymous
Post 12/31/2022 19:32     Subject: Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
Yes. Sir terry pratchett and the boots.
Anonymous
Post 12/31/2022 17:42     Subject: Re:Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:PP, I say this gently: thank you for the link. Also, you realize "scarcity mindset" were literally the very first response, and that we've been discussing it since then, right?


Oh, I apologize.
I had a two minute break and hopped on DCUM... this was the first post I read.

That will teach me not to reply until I've read the rest of the responses, lol

Sorry again!


I appreciated your post. I grew up with this mindset and have tried to explain the concept to people who look at me like I have a third head. It has been really fascinating over the years to realize many other people eo ple see the connections you so well explained.


Thank you... I felt really silly after I went back to read the prior pomsts and saw that the sixemn etitled pages before mine were almost entirely devoted to scarcity mindset... in great detail, lol.
If you're trying to explain the mindset to others who don't understand it still, the boots example might help
(having to repeatedly buy cheap pairs of boots every single year of your life (because cheap boots will always fall apart by the end of the season, because they're not only cheap in price, more importantly they're cheaper in quality) versus buying one expensive pair of boots that will last throughout your lifetime).


No, I was the one who mentioned it to you initially, and it was a great link. I just wanted to clear the air in a positive way to prevent unfruitful discussion.
Anonymous
Post 12/31/2022 17:26     Subject: Re:Poor, greedy, coarse behavior - what would you call it?
I think of people are just boorish, that’s the way they are. But certain social graces have lost their meaning. How many people do you know would stand up if an older person walks into the room?